I’m having a heated discussion on another board about this, so I thought I would bounce this off you guys. Dictionary definition:
felon1
[fel-uh n]
Spell Syllables
Examples Word Origin
See more synonyms on Thesaurus.com
noun
1.
Law. a person who has committed a felony.
The issue has been raised that, to be a felon, one needs to be convicted first. I hold that the dictionary definition is correct; conviction in a court simply makes one a convicted felon.
i would bet the overwhelming number of people, in the upper 90 percentile area, when they refer to someone being a felon, they mean a person convicted of a felony.
and if they hear someone refer to someone as a felon, they automatically take that to mean a person convicted of a felony.
i would think that judges, lawyers, cops or anyone involved in legal professions would be at or near 100% in using/ interpreting a felon to mean convicted felon.
I am almost thinking of cross posting this in the liberals vs. conservative threads, because one thing I have noticed, and I have to say this, is that conservatives assume a position, and never change it, no matter what. I’ve seen this in real life, not just on message boards.
For that reason I am not going to drag out my Black’s Law Dictionary again* to post the legal definition, in a source used widely by people in the legal field, that said, essentially, that a felon is someone who has been convicted of a felony.
I will merely note that, if at some point in the past a person was convicted of something that was not a felony at the time (say DUI), and in later years it was changed into a felony, that person is STILL not a felon. If they get convicted again, once it’s made a felony, then they are.
That should clear it up.
*Because I did that, maybe a year ago, and posted it in a thread started by the OP.
A murderer is someone who has committed a murder, but if you call someone a murderer who hasn’t been convicted yet all you are doing is expressing your personal opinion that the person is guilty of murder (and not accidental homicide, manslaughter, or no crime at all). Likewise if you call someone a felon who hasn’t been convicted all you are doing is stating an opinion; you are not making a factual statement. So no, it’s not really proper to refer to someone as a felon unless they have been convicted.
Legally, felons lose certain rights. These rights vary by state, and what also varies by state is which rights are restored after the sentence is served, and how. In some cases restoration of certain rights (voting, for instance) are automatically restored, in other jurisdictions the felon must follow a certain process for restoration of rights, which may or may not result in the felon’s getting the rights back. Appeal to the governor is a typical route to restoration of certain rights. The felon is probably not getting a gun.
If someone has committed a felony but not been convicted, that person still has all rights. If they were prosecuted but not convicted, the same. The same rights as anybody. Jury service, owning guns, voting, traveling abroad.
So therefore, it’s reasonable to say that a felon is someone who, by virtue of being convicted, has lost those rights. Legally speaking.
Speaking on a message board, you can call anybody anything.
Perhaps someone should quote this post so the OP can see it.
Things that are felonies in some districts aren’t necessarily felonies in others. Where I live, a “felony” is defined as any crime which has been assigned by local code a punishment of at least X number of months in jail and $X in fines. A felon must be convicted of said felony in order to be a felon. I suspect this isn’t what the OP is hoping to hear.
A person who committed a felony can only be considered a felon after he/she is convicted. The act of being accused and charged with a felony does not make you a felon. It IS the conviction and sentencing that make you the felon. Don’t get the cart before the horse. And if you commit a felony and no one knows or finds out, other than being lucky as shit you still aren’t a felon. Presumably you aren’t going to run around telling everyone you’ve committed a felony. The conviction is necessary to brand you a felon. That’s all, I think.
The word can be used either way so if it’s not clear from context and you want to be understood, it makes sense to be explicit and say “convicted felon” or “suspected felon” or “everyone knows she’s a felon but the liberal justice system won’t convict her” or whatever the particular case warrants.
The problem you are most likely glossing over is that is seems pretty clear from the context of your question that the word “felon” is being used as an ad hominem.
Whether you are correct or not on the dictionary definition is moot if you are simply attacking someone’s character instead of dealing with the substance of one’s argument.
So it seems in the controversy you’re having, it is like arguing over the precise boundaries of the term “punk-ass bitch.”
OP, you are being sloppy in your language by using legal terms colloquially. A person who kills another is not necessarily a murderer. Murder implies a certain mental state, which may or may not exist when a life is taken. Put another way, when one person takes the life of another, a homicide has been committed. But not all homicides are murder.
Similarly, a person who has committed a crime may be a criminal, but not all crimes are felonies. That’s why you would never hear a lawyer refer to someone as a felon unless they’ve been convicted of a felony. Until then, they are just a (alleged, depending on whether it’s been proven) criminal.
What if there’s a confession? I’ve never been charged with any crime, but I have committed a few felonys. Am I a felon? I don’t consider myself one, although I have, on occasion, “crossed the line.”
In the city where I work, we had an issue with this. Some of my employees, in order to get a license (with the city) for one part of the job have to get a background check done. The city isn’t worried about most issues as long as the don’t directly relate to the job, however, they’ve always and forever said that you have to disclose everything. If you lie on the application, it gets denied, period.
One of the questions is:
(slightly paraphrased since I couldn’t C&P from the pdf)
They want everything. If you got a speeding ticket 10 years ago, got tossed out of a house party in 95 with a ‘disorderly house patron’ ticket, whatever, they’re not joking. Check “yes” and tell them what it was.
So, a few years back one of my employees gets denied for lying on her application. I make some calls to the city find out she didn’t put down that she got a DUI. When I asked her about it she said, “I’ve been accused of that, but the court date isn’t for months, I haven’t been convicted of anything”. She was right, but it took a lot of arguing with the city and her license being suspended (through no fault of her own) for a month until the next common council meeting.
No too long after that, the application was updated, there’s now a question that comes after that one that reads “Are any citations or charges presently pending against you…”
I think the issue is that middle part. Before the crime you’re just a random person, after the trial you’re a [convicted] felon. It’s the middle part. IMO, you’re still just a random person, otherwise “innocent until proven guilty” is a bunch of BS (or moreso anyways).
Back to the OP, I’m seeing plenty of definitions (both random dictionaries as well as law oriented ones) that specifically say a felon is someone that has been convicted of a felony. So either someone needs to find a better definition than some free internet dictionaries or you’re going to go back and forth all day over that.
Besides, your example is way too vague. What if I murder someone in self defense because he came at me with a gun? What if I murder a 20 year old that’s been drinking all day and wanders onto the free way and eats my bumper while I’m going 64mph? What if I murder someone because my shoddy workmanship, as part or a 100 person unionized crew on a high rise allows them to fall through a floor?
We can keep going but all these things are why we have lawyers and courts and juries and judges.