In some cases the RCC has clout here. The Bishops just lobbied to have the no payment for abortion put into the health care bill. Although many Catholics would disagree with their Bishops (like they do with birth contro)l,there are many stirred to vote with the Bishops desires. The RCC reps. seem to feel they need to follow the Bishops thinking!
Some of the same people who agree with the bishops rant against higher taxes to pay for the care of the children once they are born. The conservatives I have heard, complain a lot about our national debt, but forget about the cost of raising a lot of children one cannot afford.They seem to forget the children need care and it costs a lot! The bishops still have them believing birth control(except what they call natural) is sinful.
And you give your location as Australia. Judging from your posts you have no real understanding about just how religious America is. Have you ever worried that one of those friends of yours would key your car if he so much as found out you were an atheist? Has your equivalent of a President ever said he doesn’t think that atheists deserve to be considered citizens?
That may be fine for you, but is there anything unethical in reserving an anonymous message board for airing one’s more strident views? I’ll dip into political threads here, but I absolutely refuse to discuss politics when face to face with someone. It never leads anywhere productive and I prefer to avoid unnecessary confrontational situations, which are all too likely given the current state of politics. Here, anonymity and the fact that this board is primarily for entertainment make it easier to join in bullshit sessions.
The only person over which any of us has any control is ourselves. If I don’t want to be thought of as a bigot, then I shouldn’t be acting like one. Besides, I don’t accept “But they did it first!” as a valid reason for his behavior.
Sounds like you have a problem with a particular institution. The evil atheist Soviets didn’t make atheism evil any more than the evil Catholic institutions in your country make religion evil.
The only reason to respect anyone is for what they do. Their belief system has nothing to do with it. If someone treats people (sometimes even their enemies) kindly, keeps promises, is trustworthy, and works hard, they’re worthy of respect. I don’t care if someone has the most ridiculously absurd belief system in the universe, if they do good things.
Progress! In the past year or so, you’ve gone from “religious people would kill me if they knew I was an atheist” to “religious people would key my car if they found out i was an atheist.” Another year or so and that whole whiny-bitch victim complex will be cured!
“A 2006 study by researchers at the University of Minnesota involving a poll of 2,000 households in the United States found atheists to be the most distrusted of minorities, more so than Muslims, recent immigrants, gays and lesbians, and other groups. Many of the respondents associated atheism with immorality, including criminal behaviour, extreme materialism, and elitism.”Cite.
“But we don’t really hate you. As Christians we love you, even though you’re immoral swine who don’t deserve any role in public life.”
I wouldn’t key his car. I’d just write the word “PRICK” on his windshield in lipstick. (I KNOW I saw that in some movie, but hell if I can remember it off hand)
As for being moral even if I didn’t believe in a god, well duh, of course I would. Why wouldn’t I? Likewise, would Der Trihs still be a fuckstick if he were a theist?
I’ve done a search of Lexis/Nexis and ProQuest, both of which are subscription databases of news content, and i haven’t been able to find a single reference to that incident anywhere.
I guess it’s possible that every single major media outlet agreed to suppress the story that a Presidential candidate would deny citizenship to atheists, but it seems a little unlikely to me.
That quote is very suspect and AFAIK has never been verified by anyone else. It’s hard for me to believe that a seasoned politician would say something so incredibly stupid, even it that is how he truly feels. And based on their record as president, of the Bushes, even if he did say that, I’d still take him over his son any day.
Why is it assumed because someone is rather harsh on a message board, they act that way in real life? When the issue comes up with friends or family, I let them know what I think, but I do remain more diplomatic because I know it’s easier to get someone to change their mind if you remain cool, ask serious questions and recomment that they consider other views.
Online, there is no personal relationship, so I’m more willing to say what I truly feel about religion because I don’t have to deal with these people on a daily basis. With people in the real world, a gentle approach is usually far more effective.
Actually, I found MANY references to it Googling (in news archives) for Bush Atheist Patriot but all the refences from ‘mainstream’ newspapers are so old that you have pay to see the full article, which I’m not willing to do.
I never said I was a Christian – just a theist. And being ethical doesn’t mean being a doormat and not calling people on it when they’re acting like jackasses.
Cumberdale – again, I’m sick of the whole, “well, so and so is really nice in REAL life!” (Which, I didn’t mention in the first place, just counter the argument that, would someone act the same way whatever their religious beliefs?)
It’s not “real life” here. So all I have to go on is what I see here. And what I see is some guy who’s a dick.
Maybe my Google-fu has deserted me, but in Googling those terms, i haven’t found one that leads back to a reputable news source.
If you can point me to some of the links you found, or give me some names of the papers, and some dates, of your references, i’ll look them up. I have access to Lexis/Nexis and ProQuest, and if there was an article, i should be able to find it.