Recently a teacher of mine related the allegedly true story of an ambassador’s son, who, high on drugs, went on a shooting spree in a Dallas nightclub and “killed about 15 people” (her words), and then used diplomatic immunity to go to his home nation and was never punished. Now, I know that fifteen dead is flat out inaccurate, but what’s the Straight Dope on this anecdote? Thanks.
It sounds like a horribly exagerated for-instance.
I’m not an expert on diplomatic priveledges, but it was my understanding that they applied to the diplomat, not family.
My Googling didn’t turn up anything, but I find it highly unlikely that someone could do this and not have it turn up somewhere. My understanding is as follows.
Diplomatic immunity is a convention based in international law and extended mutually between countries under the Vienna Convention. Diplomats accredited to host governments enjoy inviolability of their persons, personal effects, residences, vehicles, and pets. Inviolability is extended to official persons and their dependents (usually). Accredited diplomats also enjoy immunity from civil claims, prosecution, and involvement in civil litigation. Criminal matters are generally handled by having the individual so concerned returned to his/her country of origin and made to make recompense under the laws of the local jurisdiction. For capital crimes, including murder, sedition, and treason abroad, US diplomats are generally guaranteed transport back to the US pending review. Depending on the case, they then may be tried under US law and sentenced.
In a nutshell, there is no such thing as absolute immunity, and for murder, regardless of rank and immunity, you’ll wind up serving time somewhere. Gueorgui Makharadze killed a 17-year old girl in 1997 while driving drunk, and Shevardnaze waived his immunity. He’s in a Georgian prison right now. For things like shoplifting, parking violations, traffic tickets, etc., it’s usually too much trouble to get the person to pay, so they just waive it. You will be noticed if you try claiming diplomatic immunity and your chief of mission will be pissed off to high heaven. I have been instructed to not abuse the immunity and inviolability, as accredited US diplomats are subject to both US and local laws.
False_God
(Political Officer, US Embassy Colombo, Sri Lanka as of March '03)
Not so. Diplomatic family members have immunity, depending upon who the diplomat is. http://www.ds.state.gov/immunities/di-chart.html You’ll have to download the PDF file from that link to read the chart.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by False_God *
**Diplomats accredited to host governments enjoy inviolability of their persons, personal effects, residences, vehicles, and pets. Inviolability is extended to official persons **and their dependents (usually). **
As False_God points out, diplomatic immunity does not mean that the individual in question goes off scott free. They may well be punished under their home country 's laws.
For example, there’s been a case involving diplomatic immunity running in Canada and Russia for the past 18 months or so. A Russian diplomat was driving drunk in Ottawa. He hit two women walking down a street, killing one and badly injuring the other. Canada asked Russia to waive diplomatic immunity, but Russia refused. They shipped the diplomat home and tried him in Moscow, under the equivalent Russian law. He was convicted and is currently serving time in a work camp in northern Russia.
The only Dallas nightclub mass murder I can think of is the Ianni’s shooting in 1984 by Abdelkrim Belachheb. He was a Moroccan national, but I haven’t seen anything connecting him with any diplomat, and he most certainly is doing time.
Hey False_God, I believe that barbitu8 was no-so-ing leenmi, not you. Check the post times.
Just wanted to make sure that we know that privelege extends to dependents as well. Sorry for any confusion.
Is it true that diplomats have the right to go into and out of the country without having their persons or luggage searched by Customs?
**“It is Article 27 that deals with diplomatic pouches, and it clearly states that the diplomatic bag “shall not be opened or detained.” But with recent abuses by drug-smuggling diplomats, certain amendments to this article have been adopted. Article 27 (4) states that diplomatic bags must contain ONLY those articles for diplomatic use, so if customs authorities suspect a bag to contain contraband, they can, with the consent of the diplomat, open the bag, or, failing to receive consent, return it to the country of origin.”
"Under Article 30 of the Vienna Convention on Consular Immunity, bags transported by consuls can also be searched if the consular representative gives his OK. If not, they too are returned to the country of origin. This request for opening pouches often results from detection of some sort of illegal substance or dangerous weapon by metal-detectors or drug-sniffing dogs. According to the GUIDE TO DIPLOMATIC PRACTICES, the host country may “subject a bag to detector devices to show the presence of explosives or drugs since this does not involve opening or detaining it.”
Most receiving states have drawn the line at X-raying diplomatic pouches, however, for this is nothing more than opening them electronically. The Vienna Convention makes no reference to analysing bags in this manner, but is obviously a breach of the security that the convention desired.
Personal luggage of a diplomat is not expressly covered in the convention, but is generally treated with the same respect given tagged pouches. If suspicious, the customs agents CAN open the personal bags, but the diplomat must be present before they can do so. To avoid any delays and hassles, diplomats usually just stick their personal belongings in a diplomatic pouch with the official items."**
Of course the information from this site should be taken with a grain of salt… Taken from the index page:
**"There where others get a ticket for parking at the wrong side, being drunk or making “big” mistakes, diplomats are even helped in very difficult situations.
Paying taxes, getting arrested, speed or traffic tickets, things which are most of all a nightmare for the general public, is laughed away by the diplomat.
This website explains you everything on it and explains you how to get the right credentials to become “untouchable”."**
The Convention cited is correct. The rest of that site could very well get you jail time, as claiming fraudulent immunity is an offense in and of itself.
And yes, sometimes we do just stick stuff in the pouch so as to not deal with customs, but considering at least three or four people have to see what’s in it before it gets sealed, smuggling is really not an issue. Usually it’s just personal papers. Pouches vary in size from a 18"x24" cloth pouch with lead seals to large cardboard boxes.
This law review article (in .pdf) describes several incidents where dependents of diplomats claimed diplomatic immunity after committing violent crimes. I just skimmed it, but it doesn’t mention 15 killed in a Dallas nightclub. It does mention the stabbing of a nightclub bouncer in DC (a case I remember vividly because it caused quite a ruckus in DC).
There’s currently a major problem in NYC, with Diplomats parking in the wrong spot.
Some were threatened with… gasp being towed.
Sure, there are some abuses, but really, immunity comes down to how much the host nation is going to back you up. Immunity or no, I wouldn’t want to be the guy who has to get out of jail with a host country pissed at you.
A pal of mine is a Vice Consul in Toronto. That’s a fancy-schmanzy word for “He speaks the native language and helps people who are new to the country”. No pay.
Now, as a citizen of Canada, he has NO immunity in Canada, unless performing a “super official” deed. He doesn’t need it, since Canada would have no reason to “witch hunt” one of their own. In theory, a Canadian should KNOW their own laws and not be a target of their own government.
Now, unofficially, he is given a smidgen more leeway, he says… He’s gotten out of one speeding ticket, and if pressed, he doesn’t have to stop for a RIDE check (Our random drunk driving check program). (But he does)
He still has to STOP for the RIDE check, he just doesn’t have to answer questions or whatnot… But… He would have to show diplomatic ID! And it has to be checked! And that would take more time!
He’s a good guy, and does it for his affection for his home country and fellow citizens, not any diplomatic benifit. The home country is ALWAYS trying to get him to do a ton of stuff, and his reply is always along the lines of Pay Me, Take it or leave it.
And no, there are no hot russian babes showing up at your doorstep in the middle of the night for any reason what so ever. He’s quite emphatic about that…