Discussion thread for the Hamas Attacks Israel thread, October 2023

I don’t understand the logic behind attacks like this or the previous one in DC. I can’t see the leadership of Israel (any leadership, not just Netanyahu) deciding to give up or change course because of terrorists doing terrorism. This isn’t going to make things better for the people of Gaza. If anything, it’s going to make things worse because Trump is going to want to escalate and retaliate against Gaza even if there was no direct connection from Hamas to the attackers in the US. Trump’s preferred solution to the Gaza situation is absolute ethnic cleansing. All this attack is going to do is remind Trump to get started on it. Hopefully cooler heads prevail in Israel when Trump suggests flattening Gaza again by way of response.
TLDR version: how much freer is Palestine now?

The victims are all older people - 67 to 88 is the age range. Witnesses say the attacker shouted “Free Palestine” and “End Zionist” as he threw the Molotov.

Attacks like this are about bigotry and hatred - anything involving Gaza is just an excuse.

Er… “cooler heads”? In the Israeli government?

:::: cue despairing laughter ::::

That’s because there’s no logic to understand. Lone crazies like this don’t operate on some grand plan. They’re not members of terrorist cells operating with schedules and strategy and end goals. This was just violent rage manifested at an easy target.

bad format

Yes, the person who did that could have opened fire at a McDonald’s screaming “Christ is Lord” if he’d been exposed to different rhetoric. Raw hated and an urge towards destruction will find some outlet.

Well, Trump is gonna have a field day with this… It looks like the terrorist was an Egyptian national who illegally overstayed his visa.

I see it’s currently the top seven stories on the Fox News website.

On the (Mobile) site I see it’s only the top two stories, after that it goes to Ukraine’s drone strike on bombers and to Trump vs cartels. But I expect they’ll have a field day, too.

I mean compared to Trump who is probably telling Israel (for the sixth or seventh time) that they should just nuke Gaza.

I am not a fan of Netanyahu but I still laugh thinking about when he called Trump an “outside-the-box thinker”, the very definition of a backhanded compliment.

‘What, because of the attack in Boulder?’
‘There was an attack in Boulder?’

No kidding. I read that he held off on the attack for a year until his daughter graduated (with a scholarship!). However, if his immigration status is any indicator of the family’s status, that poor girl won’t be attending any medical schools in the US. Great way to paint a target on his family’s back and get them deported post haste.

According to reports, the IDF massacred civilians at a food aid distribution site:

ISTM that the IDF, at best, is incapable of safely distributing aid. And if so, then they have a moral duty to allow other organizations to do so.

Absolutely.

There’s no way that Trump and his arse-licker Noem won’t target the family of this man

I think what’s happening here is that desperate people are acting exactly like desperate people do, and the IDF is interpreting that as a “riot” or even an “attack” and firing shots to “calm things down” or “take control” or whatever excuse they come up with.

Oddly enough this doesn’t work. It never works because the gunfire causes actual panic. Yet the IDF keeps doing the same thing over and over. I can’t figure out if they want a different result or this is the result they want.

You can expect to see a lot of BS reports like that I. The next few days - the GHF is an existential threat to the whole aid-to-Hamas pipeline that organizations like UNRWA have been so complicit in creating over the last few decades. Cutting off the “humanitarian” organizations which, as we have seen time and time again, are uniquely corrupted and infiltrated by Hamas in this particular conflict, and getting aid directly to the people who need it (people who have been shocked that the aid is free, by the way; they’re used to paying Hamas for UNRWA aid) is a way to shortcircuit the ways that UNRWA, Hamas, and other have entranced themselves into Palestinian society, so it’s no wonder they’re so opposed to it.

Like other reports of shootings at the GHF site, this one appears to be bullshit, with zero evidence, footage, etc provided that would certainly exist if the IDF just unloaded on a crowd of Palestinian refugees.

In fact, the shooting referenced happened half a kilometer away from the aid distribution site, near the Netzarim crossing. And it didn’t involve people lining up for food.

I mean, it should be completely obvious that this didn’t happen, because specifically for this reason the IDF is not even present at the GHF site. Security is provided by American private security firms that are mostly employing local Palestinians. So anyone who’s been paying attention to the conflict and to the GHF situation would know that if a shooting happened, it either didn’t involve the IDF, or it wasn’t at the aid distribution site. The claim is farcical on its face.

But again, if you think about why an organization like Doctors Without Borders would say something like this, it is perfectly clear; their incentive structure rewards entrancing themselves as the only providers of aid possible, not actually resolving the issue.

That might make sense if this incident happened at the GHF aid site, or if the IDF was present at the GHF site. But those are both lies.

I can’t read the Hebrew link. I’ll also note that half a kilometer is 500 m, about a five or ten minute walk at most, so not very far at all.

Here’s the Wikipedia link about these shootings, which includes multiple linked sources: Rafah aid distribution incidents - Wikipedia

I’ll also note that the GHF is a Trump and Netanyahu backed organization whose founder, Jake Wood, resigned after just a few months based on conflicts about independence and impartiality: https://edition.cnn.com/2025/05/26/middleeast/gaza-humanitarian-foundation-aid-resigns-intl-hnk

I don’t trust Trump and Netanyahu any more than I trust Hamas, so I’m not at all sold on the GHF. If the IDF stays within a few hundred meters, that’s hardly “not being present” IMO.

As always in Gaza lately, it’s extremely hard to determine accurate reporting, as much or more due to the IDF as due to Hamas.

I’m not convinced that shooting(s) didn’t take place. I do agree that determining WHO did such an act is more fuzzy.

That said - I wouldn’t trust “private security” to be well behaved. There’ s a long history of “private security” being even worse than the military/police in handling crowd situations.

“Entrancing?”