Diversity is good. Prove it!

erislover:

Well, diversity of opinion is welcome and wanted in the military. The chain of command works both ways. It’s the foolish Captain or lieutenant indeed who does not seek input and advice from his sargents. The Sargents lseek input from their squad leaders, who in turn seek advice and input from their ASLs (assistant squad leaders.) It’s true that it’s assumed the rest of the squad is too stupid to communicate anything meaningful, but ideally the ASL will pick it up if a nugget of value surfaces. Majors listen to their Captain’s. Colonel’s listen to Majors and Generals listen to Colonels.

The idea is that there is supposed to be a flow of information and advice that goes both ways.

The rub is that the command structure is well-defined. That is, if your sargent tells you to dig a hole, you really can’t refuse. In fact, the situations in which you can refuse an order from a superior are few.

But, most of the time, there’s not a lot of micromanagement.

It’s a lot like a corporation. Initiative and judgement within rigid parameters.

Certainly you don’t think a Corporation seeks to stifle diversity.

Within a military task force, there is purposefully a lot of diversity, among skillsets and specialties with some having more initiative and control than others.

For example, on my father’s firts tour of Vietnam as a recon Marine he was a Forward Observer. He would be taked with taking out certain targets. How he did it, was his judgement. He would choose his own location for a reconaissance point to view the target based on the situation. He would then perform calculations and direct fire from ships as much as 100 miles away. After each salvo he would correct until he hit the target. In such a circumstance, though my father was only a PFC at the time, he essentially commanded the actions of an entire battleship, which fired according to his direction.

The whole point of the command structure is to put the decision making ability in the hands of the person who needs to make the decisions, and to hold that person accountable for them.

Now sure, he had orders he had to follow, but the broad strokes of the tasks he had to perform were his to decide. My father was essentially his own man.

A fire team is completely different. Such an entity will consist of a group of individuals who strive to attack together in total harmony, like a football team. Their jobs and actions are highly regimented, but like a football player, he is expected to be flexible and react on his own initiative to a changing situation in concert with his fellows.

During his second tour as a Sniper, my father essentially lived seperately from the rest of the Marines in his group, moved seperately and acted almost entirely on his own initiative. He was not accountable to the lieutenant or sargent of a platoon he was tasked to support. It was assumed that he knew the limits and parameters of his job better than they, though they were in constant communication.

A flyer is a very different breed from a grunt.

Religious and personal beleifs are respected within the military with a few exceptions.

I would honestly say that diversity is the rule in the military.

On the other hand, I think I know what you are trying to talk about, and let me see if I can define it better. In many areas of the military standardization is something that is striven for. It is expected that a well-trained specialist will perform his task in identical fashion to another well-trained specialist.

But, I don’t think it works as a negative towards diversity. Any well-trained specialist has his own style. For example, as a forward observer, my father chose not to carry a firearm under the belief that if he fired it while in hostile territory with people seeking him out, he might as well be shooting it at his own head. Other Forward Observers thought he was nuts.

My father also chose oddly in his observation locations. He tried to choose a location where he had a terrible view of the target, because the enemy would tend to search for him in locations that afforded a good view of the target. Instead he sought a post with an excellent view of a location at the same elevation and a defined distance from the target and a a poor secondary view of the target itself. He would direct the opening salvos at the location he had a good view of, and when he had that location boxed it was a simple calculation to redirect to the actual target.

Again, he did this on his own initiative and it was controversial, but it was his call. It was controversial because the theory was that by adding an extra variable it would take longer to take out the actual target increasing the danger of being discovered. My father disagreed and thought that the target of the opening salvos was moot, and that any delay would be justified by the better hiding spot which would enable him to be less likely to be discovered, thus increasing his chances of success.

That’s just an example.

However, any time standards are needed diversity is a poor thing, and I think that’s what you’re getting at. For example the diversity among our standards of measurement here in the US is a major detriment. We don’t need multiple standards and there is no advantage to having both a metric and an English system of measurement as anybody that owns a socket set will tell you. Nor does it help us to have both Farenheight and Celsius as measurement systems. Any time you are trying to judge something, diversity of methods is a negative. You want judgement to be standardized.

Is that what you going for?

Very much so, and well said. When I see the military, I see a series of standards and manuals and handbooks and about piss-all room for individuality. However, your counterexample is well-noted.

Thanks for the heartiest laugh of my day.

So, what do fingerprints have to do with reverse discrimination, again?

Diversity is good, so long as it is not forced.

Glad I’m not the only one who has been wondering that :slight_smile:

My feeling here is that there’s no causal relationship between college diversity and student performance.
I do think that if you tell people enough times that diversity is good and important, they will start to believe it.
To me, diversity is just something which ‘is’. It’s neither desirable nor undesirable.
One more tangent and we should get back where the OP started…:wink:

…and putting the diversity and array of choice back into consumer products is one of the major parts of the information revolution.

Is there any reason why you specify women’s colleges rather than same-sex colleges? There are still men’s colleges in the US.

As a women’s college student myself, I would venture to say that I am in a more diverse environment than I would be at most co-ed schools, as my school has an unusually high percentage of foreign students.

Traditionally African-American colleges are, surprisingly, predominantly African-American due only to tradition. Students from other ethnic backgrounds can attend these schools, and many have even received diversity scholarships.

Sorry I haven’t been around lately. Darn that whole life thing. :wink:

Thanks to pldennison for those links.

The reason I made the fingerprint reference was to give an example of a “foreone conclusion” that deserved a closer look. I linked that with the Diversity issue because of another case regarding the Univ. of Michigan law school could use “diversity” as a criteria for admission, as if “diversity” was a good thing with out the same kind of, at least, cursory scientific study as to how it effects the students, the school, and the (law) industry in general.

True, and I apologize. But show me a group of men clamoring to get into a “women-only” institution and I’ll eat my hat.

But that’s diversity of skin color and/or nationality, not ideas. Is there a “Right to Life” group on campus? How about “Gun Rights”? And if they exist are they vibrant communities or are they the “nut bags” on campus?

Come by the night of our big fall mixer, and you’ll see plenty of men clamoring to get in.

As for men desperate to be students at a women’s college, believe it or not men are already allowed to attend classes at many women’s colleges. There are a few male students at my school every semester, mostly taking advantage of our excellent foreign language program. They cannot receive their degree from my school, but they can take any class they like and the credit can be applied towards a degree at another school.

You are much mistaken if you do not think that diversity of nationality does not provide diversity of ideas. The rest of the world has not yet become quite so Americanized that foreigners cannot still offer different cultural perspectives.

In regards to “Right to Life” or “Gun Rights” groups, I am afraid the student body is not large enough to support such specialized organizations. There are student groups affiliated with the Democratic and Republican parties, but none devoted to specific political issues.

I’m not sure the virtues of diversity can be measured scientifically. I would consider it a matter of the values one holds. Also, it depends on the sort of diversity being judged.

For example, I would consider it a good thing to be exposed to a variety of opinions and cultures. On the other hand, I think it would be silly for Harvard to diversify itself by accepting a certain number of complete and utter morons every year. But it would lead to a more useful experience, by my standards, for its students to be exposed to people of many different backgrounds.

Diversity is one of the main reasons I like living in the city. I simply think that my life is richer and more rewarding because of the variety of things I am exposed to.

A lot of what we call diversity is actually trivial. For example, an institution will call itself diverse because it’s membership includes black Americans as well as white Americans. We like to imagine that the cultural divide between these groups is huge, but it’s just not so. White southerners in particular have a great deal in common culturally with black Americans, from the food on the table to the Bible they read in church.

Real diversity would involve either one of these primarily Protestant, entirely English speaking peoples adjusting to people who didn’t speak English, and didn’t want to learn; or Islamic fundamentalists who refused to allow women out of the house, and imposed this rule on the rest of society. Conflict would ensue.
Real diversity often leads to conflict.

The diversity that you find in military is also largely trivial. The military imposes a huge amount of cultural conformity as standard procedure. Conformity in dress, in behavior, in living quarters, even in speech. Indicators of social status and corresponding annual income are literally worn on a soldier’s sleeve. The military has dealt with cultural diversity by suppressing it, and replacing it with an official culture that only makes token recognition of ethnic differences.

A strictly enforced, rigid conformity is one of the most effective ways to defuse potential conflicts

In 1965, there were 236 all-male colleges in the U.S. Today you can count on your thumbs the number of secular, four-year, all-male colleges unaffiliated with a female college:

Wabash College
Hampden-Sydney

In 1960, there were 200 women’s colleges in the US. By 1993, there were only 83 left. Most of them are affiliated with a church, with more being Catholic than Protestant. Many are also affiliated with a men’s college, or a college that was a men’s college at the time of the founding of its sister school. I couldn’t tell you how many women’s colleges do not fit these criteria, but there aren’t many. There might be more than two, but there aren’t a lot.

Of course, there are more American women’s colleges than men’s colleges in general, and for a very obvious reason. Most college aged men are unwilling to go to an all-male school, but a fair number of college aged women are willing to go to an all-female school.

Diversity has always seemed to me to be some sort of shibboleth that everyone pays lip service to and agrees that it is good, but it never seems to ever get defined; It’s a synthetic, feel-good thing that will make everything well through a mechanism that has yet to be explained (to me, anyway).

I work in a pharmaceutical company in The People’s Republic of Cambridge, MA. According to our HR department, we are highly committed to maintaining a diverse workplace, and they have been highly successful in nurturing a workforce which reflects the make-up of the local community, provided the community in question is Shanghai. There are a handful of African Americans, no Latinos to speak of (if you discount the cleaning crew), but a whole lot of newly-minted PhDs from Mainland China. Is this Diversity?