But at any time of human evolution, would you ever need to know instinctively? There would always be other animals/people around doing it.
Malleus–am I being whooshed?
There’s a reason you don’t have a cite for this.
If you guys think you have problems, imagine what it’s like for gay people. It’s not as obvious as figuring out how to make babies. It took me many years to figure out what worked for me and what didn’t . . . and to stop trying to enjoy things that simply weren’t working for me. And porn . . . especially same-sex . . . didn’t used to be available the way it is now.
Uh, very easily? At least for me – I’ve had a LOT of vaginal sex doggy-style. All he has to do is mount you from behind, position his penis, and go to town. It’s slightly more likely for him to slip out, but even if he does, he just readjusts and, er, gets right back in. Takes 5 seconds. I strongly recommend checking out a porno if you’re still fuzzy on the concept.
Obviously animals, including those such as mammals and reptiles who do it more or less like we do, know how to do it instinctively. The question then becomes why, and to what extent, do humans come not to know instinctively. The most likely explanation, to my mind, is that humans, unlike other animals, wear clothes, and thus do not normally get to see what members of the opposite sex have down there, and thus our instincts do not get the chance to kick in naturally. This is probably exacerbated in societies like ours, where sexual intercourse is strongly discouraged until many years after puberty, so that both sexes spend years dealing with strong sexual desires for which the “natural” outlet is not available, and basically, filling their heads with inaccurate ideas and worries about what is really supposed to happen. If humans regularly went around naked in mixed company, instinct would probably work fine.
For my part, I did not get any reliable information about what a woman has down there, and what you are supposed to do with it, until I was about 16 or so, and another boy sketched a rough diagram for me and a group of others (and I do not think he was working from first hand experience). Luckily, his information was more or less accurate, but even then, when I finally got the opportunity to put the knowledge to practical use, I did not do a very good job.
On the other hand, a few years after that, by which time I had gained a bit of sexual experience, something happened which led me to think that there really is some instinctive knowledge there. On this occasion, I had come round to see my then girlfriend, with whom I had already had sex a number of times, and both of us were expecting to do it that night. When it got to the point, though, I found that I was completely out of condoms. :smack::eek::(We had anal sex (which was new for both of us) but neither of us found it very satisfactory, and so we wound up in bed naked together after that, basically just kissing and cuddling. Somehow, quite unintentionally, while this was going on, my penis, as if it had a will of its own, slipped very easily into her vagina. After two or three thrusts, I summoned up the willpower to pull it out again (she was not resisting at all). Certainly neither of were ready for her to get pregnant. But I swear I never intended to put it in there. In those circumstances, naked and cuddling with a woman, my penis (and probably her vagina too) knew what to do by itself, and did it in spite of my conscious wish not to.
So, all in all, I think the instinct is there, but its natural operation typically gets thwarted by clothes and other social customs, so that most of us have to learn, during early adulthood, how to have sex naturally. If we had always grown up with naked members of the opposite sex around, and if there were not strong social rules against doing it with anyone anytime you feel like it, I am sure nobody would have any trouble figuring out what to do as soon as they were through puberty.
Incidentally, I am not trying to say that either clothes, or social conventions against sex for post-pubescents are bad ideas.
I remember a New Yorker cartoon that showed two newlyweds lying in bed next to each other. The man says to the woman, “Aw, jeez, you’re a virgin, too? Now what do we do?”
Aren’t there examples of nonhuman primates reared in captivity who upon adulthood are given access to other members of their species and have no clue how to react–which includes sex/courtship?
Urban legend, popularized in the 1960s and originating with Alfred Kinsey (1948).
The Master pontificates:
Part I: Why is the “missionary position” called that? - The Straight Dope
Part II: Assuming the missionary position … again. - The Straight Dope
Well, from first hand experience with multiple fertility doctors, I can tell you that that is complete and utter rubbish. For the record, most people undergoing fertility treatment have a better than average understanding about what they need to do to get pregnant.
I agree that people in more repressed times saw animals mating frequently, unlike the sheltered children of today. That’s enough to understand the basic mechanics. Almost everyone would have figured out the erect penis went in the vagina, when cats and dogs roamed loose and there were horses, cows and sheep everywhere.
It doesn’t seem so surprising to me. We all need to eat, right? Yet there’s lots of mammalian predators that need to be taught how to hunt or how to complete a kill by their mother/pack/pride/whatever. Isolate a bobcat kitten and it might fumble around trying to hunt and kill something by instinct but without being taught how, it’s unlikely to be very successful.
Likewise, humans are surrounded by other humans and learn how to successfully have sex. Left to their own devices, they’d probably fumble through it eventually (at least as a species) just as a feline knows to pounce on things even if it doesn’t have all the details down. I’ll agree that the notion of teaching your offspring seems to relate to a rise in intelligence though. Predatory beetles or lizards don’t need training to start killing and eating stuff.
The great thing about being embedded in a culture is that no-one has to re-invent or re-discover everything from scratch by themselves.
The OP seems to be puzzled by an essentially imaginary scenario where two people have come to exist in what amounts functionally to complete isolation from all other humans.
There never was such a time. Even in times of sexual repression, children have wondered where babies come from, and will have eventually grown to an age where silly tales about storks won’t wash any more. In the present era, the OP saw an X-rated video, and figured it out. The functional equivalent in former years was, as others have said, the barnyard (not for erotic purposes, I hasten to clarify, but educational ones).
Girls and boys have giggled and whispered about it since time immemorial, hearing from peers and siblings and parents. It’s just not part of the written culture of earlier times. Just like you don’t see the giving of instructions about how to use toilet paper/cloths or deal with menstrual issues mentioned in Jane Austen novels, so you don’t see the giving of basic sexual instruction. But it obviously happened, even if not done formally or openly.
Couple that with the inherent desire for Mr Happy to find his way to warm moist places and Mrs Happy’s desire for the inverse, and any ambiguities are readily solved. The mere fact that some individuals may not twig so readily doesn’t mean the system overall necessarily fails.
Seconded here - we saw two “fertility doctors” and neither asked us to “prove” that we knew what went where.
jasonh300 writes:
This is demonstrably not true. There’s plenty of art predating Christian missionaries by centuries that shows humans having face-to-face sex. Look at wall paintings from Pompeii, vase paintings from Greece, and temple carvings from India. You’ll find sex in all positions.
And sometimes the age of porn fails in its ability to spread instruction everywhere.
Not to get Penthouse-lettery, Malleus, and it’s hard for me to believe this isn’t an elaborate joke on your part, but if you’re serious, then you have something new to try. The female bends over, or gets on all fours, which gets her vagina aligned reasonably well for entry from the rear.
It’s a very very common position. One might say instinctive, if one were speaking without scientific rigor.
Seems to me that if you are kissing, hugging and cuddling enough, eventually the penis will slip into the right place. And I’d venture that we certainly have an instinct for kissing, hugging and cuddling.
It’s so easy even a caveman can do it.
Isn’t Malleus a virgin, or did I dream that up? She might not have had the opportunity to learn about it yet.
Dunno. If so, that would certainly explain the lack of personal experience. And be one more thing to add to the list of things to try in the future!
Virginity: the best kind of ignorance to fight?