Recently here in Kansas City a lawyer was shot right in front of his house.
One theory they are suggesting was that he had just won a $5.75 million judgement against a man for shooting someone who had trespassed on his property. The man was a homeless person and the shooting injured him causing him to have both legs amputated.
Now I hear this happens all the time in places like Mexico but I didn’t know of it happening here.
Does anyone know of other lawyers either attacked or threatened?
Like anything, it happens occasionally. When I was working as an attorney, I never felt threatened by the thought of someone acting out their need for revenge. And since my clients were corporations, didn’t have to worry about my own clients wanting to do me in!
Moved to IMHO.
Colibri
General Questions Moderator
As a judge who regularly deals w/ unhappy, unstable people, I’m surprised (and pleased) that it does not happen more often.
In Chicago, I remember a couple of high profile cases over the past couple of decades: one where a federal judge’s husband (IIRC) was killed, and a few where disgruntled clients shot up their attys’ offices.
My wife’s pithy comment:
Over the decades she’s worked as a prosecutor, a defense attorney, a low level judge, and doing corporate work. Never felt concerned about being attacked. It’s a random risk out there, but so is lightning and drunk drivers. And choking on your dinner or tripping over your cat.
In 10 years, no. While my practice is mostly corporate, I do quite a lot of work for NGO’s and women shelters on the side. Worst was when some women’s abusive ex, took a dump (a literal steaming dump) outside my Court offices (known as a “lawyer’s chambers” here). I was not there at the time and my poor assistant got sanitation guys to clean it up.
Sorry, but that last one is definitely NOT random.
I work with and am friends with a number of both criminal and civil lawyers. One of my best friends is a state prosecutor. And to my knowledge, the worst thing he’s heard is that he’s some sort of horrible racist. Which is funny, because I’m pretty sure some of his best friends are black…
I know WAY more lawyers and judges than I care to admit to; my wife has worked in law offices most of her life and I used to have a going flyfishing business. I know a couple who have been attacked and most are at least aware of it and take it into account in some of their habits. Some are carrying concealed or at least have some sort of firearm at home and 100% as far as I know have home security systems that they use religiously. And these are people practicing mostly business and real estate law; I hate to think how the criminal law side feels. Or that could surprise me as they feel less threatened knowing things about the average criminal I don’t. So yes; I know people who fit the OP.
My wife was a secretary for a personal injury lawyer who kept a gun in his desk. Every once in awhile, clients who were dissatisfied with a verdict, the amount of the settlement, the time it took to receive payment, etc., would show up at the lawyer’s office to express their unhappiness personally.
I don’t think the lawyer ever fired a shot, but there were definitely times he felt threatened.
Anything is possible, but I’ve never felt threatened in my years of practice. I’ve done litigation and while people can get pretty angry at you, I’ve never felt personally threatened.
An attorney I’ve had a case with was kidnapped and assaulted, but that is the only case, I’ve ever heard of in my jurisdiction.
I feel threatened by lawyers.
This incident happened several years ago and was caught on camera. In this case, the client was pissed at his own lawyer and chose to express his feelings with hot lead. Lawyer recovered, despite being hit multiple times. Perp got life+ for attempted murder.
You don’t live in Grishamland ?
Actually, in a Dornford Yates book ( 1920s ) an assizes judge had been threatened whilst sentencing:
“Now, when a man’s found guilty, before the Judge passes sentence, the prisoner is always asked if he has anything to say. When the usual question was put, ‘Silver’ Gilt looked at the Judge.
“ ‘I’ll give you a tip,’ he said slowly. ‘The longer you make my sentence, the longer you’ll have to live.’
“The threat was ugly enough, but the look in his eyes as he made it—I give you my word, it made my blood run cold. But Peppery Joe never blinked.
“ ‘So be it,’ he said quietly. ‘Let’s both have fifteen years.’ ”
“Then he isn’t out yet?” said Jill.
Berry shrugged his shoulders.
“He should be soon. If he behaves himself, they’ll let him off two or three years. But in fact that kind of threat is never redeemed. After a while the iron in the soul grows cold.”
Oddly enough the chap does take a shot, but the hero’s German Shepherd leaps to knock the gun askew.
Same here. The closest was when I was defending a vehicular homicide case in a rural county and the victim’s family were very upset, understandably. There were racial undertones, and all and all, a pretty tense two weeks. However, no threats and no real concern about my safety.
There was a federal prosecutor murdered in Seattlea while back. None has ever been arrested, but everyone thinks it was somehow related to his work.
I rarely feel threatened, but I recognize that through my job, many people feel threatened by me, and some of them will act out against me, so I govern myself accordingly.
As a family lawyer, I have been threatened quite a few times over the years. It is not a big problem, but it is significant enough that violence against lawyers is one of the issues that is occasionally covered in continuing legal educations programs, such as the one we held a couple of weeks ago in my district.
For example, in the districts where I practice:
[ul]
[li]A charter plane carrying the circuit court and lawyers (including me) was shot down (bullets through a wing while landing – took the rest of the day to get materials and a mechanic flown in to make repairs) – criminal law matters.[/li][li]I was assaulted in my office during a conference, resulting in a police search of my office and also another law office in the building (having played rugby for seventeen years, I was able to forcibly ram the assailant out of the office and shut the door which he then tried to bust down) – family law matter.[/li][li]A fellow whom I verbally ejected from my office went to see another lawyer that day whom he then attempted to murder (and was for which he was convicted) – family law matter.[/li][li]Someone shot out the door of the office in which I worked out of anger against another lawyer – I later ended up taking that lawyer’s job) – family law matter.[/li][li]A prisoner in the dock extracted a tampon from herself and pegged the judge in the forehead with it – criminal law matter.[/li][li]A judge who is now retired has mentioned that he kept a handgun with him while in court (note this is Canada, where handguns are few and far between) – general law matters.[/li][li]Decades ago, a fellow in court shot to death his wife, the judge and himself – family law matter.[/li][/ul]
Lawyering is a safe career overall. In my country, Canada, handguns are few and far between, so even although occasionally a nutter loses it, the frequency of unplanned killings is negligible. What is safer than being a lawyer in Canada? Driving to work is riskier for a lawyer than working in chambers. Staying at home is riskier for a lawyer than working in chambers (lawyers have a higher than average suicide rate – depression kills – but typically the office is not where they off themselves).
That being said, although the risk is very slight, some specialties are more risky than others. My area of law, family law, has its risks, which tend to be higher than many other specialities of law. What it comes down to is that when nutters with pre-existing anger management problems find themselves at the end of their rope by losing everything in life that they care for (ostensibly their children, spouse, and home, but in reality their power and control over their children, spouse and home) and fall down into a vortex of escalating mental crises and alcohol dependency, they lash out verbally, and sometimes physically, at anyone whom they perceive to be against them in their obsession to regain power and control over their children, spouse and home.
Think of it this way. Do you ever recall coming across someone and thinking, “He’s a fuse waiting to be lit!” Well folks like that often go off the rails when their lives bottom out, such as when their family lives disintegrate before their eyes (read: when their spouse attempts to escape from their psychological and financial manipulation and physical and sexual assaults). Family litigation lights their fuse. Family lawyers do what they can to protect their clients (arranging restraining orders, increased police presence, regular court attendances, secure safe houses with support workers on-site, and secure professionally supervised child exchange and/or visitation centres), but the more the lawyer protects his or her client, the more the maladjusted nutter perceives the lawyer to be the threat preventing him or her from getting their life back, so occasionally a nutter will act out violently against the lawyer.
Bear in mind that in family litigation, matters resolve by (a) mutual cooperation, (b) judicial decree, or (c) one side or the other being wiped out either financially or emotionally. If a nutter will not cooperate in resolving the matter by mutual cooperation, I will move heaven and earth to defeat that nutter by any legal means available, so I am a very real threat to the nutter, and therefore it is in my own person best interest to be alert to the probability that the nutter will recognize me as a threat and the possibility that the nutter will lash out against me outside of legal bounds.
To mitigate the risks, I will not meet with a person whom I deem to be potentially violent, or verbally out of control, or in any way failing my spidey-sense, unless the meeting is before a judge at court with security alerted. If I do not have such concerns, but there are indications of either a significant power imbalance between the parties, or one or the other party liking to press the other’s buttons, I will not hold face-to-face negotiations with the parties both at the table, and instead I will hold shuttle negotiations – give them each their own boardroom with cookies etc., but keep them the hell away from each other so as to keep things calm.
If over the phone a potential client seems a little bit off in any way or unduly hostile or angry concerning anyone (e.g. their spouse, another lawyer or a judge) or anything (e.g. the government, or a gender/sex, ethnicity, race or religion etc.), or if there are indications of previous or present instigation of domestic abuse or conflict with the law, I will not meet with them, represent them or give them advice.
Physically, I keep my office door locked, I have an otherwise unused extra exit to my office, I keep my cell phone within easy reach, and I do not meet with people after hours unless I have previously met with them during office hours and I trust them. For court attendances, I and/or the judge alerts court security (not rent-a-cops – real police officers) in advance of any attendances at which a nutter is expected to be present, and they are very good at not letting a nutter out of arm’s reach, and monitoring ongoing attendances. All the public areas of the courthouse are under audio and video surveillance, and entry into the courthouse is the same as airport security only done by actual police officers who know what they are doing and are very thorough.
So do I feel threatened despite the risks? No, I do not feel threatened, but at work I am alert to threats and I mitigate those risks so that I do not feel threatened, just as when I drive to work I am alert to risks and I mitigate them by driving defensively so that I do not feel threatened. I enjoy my job, and I enjoy my drive home knowing that at the end of the day I have helped good people in bad situations deal with people who threaten them emotionally, sexually, physically and/or financially.
It happens. I’m not a lawyer, but I’m familiar with some instances.
My father was a judge. One time he presided over the trial of, and sentenced, the national leader of a national criminal gang. He had to have the U.S. Marshals Service protect him for a while. I did too, because we have the same name, and I started getting threatening calls from gang members who thought I was him.
His father was an ADA in New York City. My father tells me that at times he had NYPD detectives assigned to protect him, and that he carried a gun for a while.
Some years back, I worked at a firm with a large matrimonial department. Threats from enraged soon-to-be-ex spouses were commonplace.
It happens.
A guy with lupus (It’s NEVER lupus) threw a chair at my general direction once back when I did litigation 15 years ago. Since I’ve been doing corporate IP work, a dog barked at me once, but I don’t think it was related to work. That’s about the worst of it. My dad who was a county court judge had poo flung at him in court (missed!) and had death threats once which required us to have two bodyguards at home.
And on the rare (2, I think) instances that someone said/wrote something I considered threatening, the federal protective services went all midieval on their asses. So - helpful hint - even if the federal judge IS an asshole, you’re best to keep the threats to yourself.
I thought this thread was going to be about lawyers feeling threatened by competition from automation and outsourcing!
I’ve never personally been threatened. I was once threatened indirectly, when a guy who was unhappy with the settlement he’d agreed to told his attorney he was going to kill “him and everyone associated with the [workers’ compensation] case.” I was a junior associate working for the employer’s attorney, so theoretically I was on the hit list. It wasn’t really a big deal; we just started locking the front door of the building for a while. Eventually we went to a hearing to enforce the settlement; the judge had the guy appear by phone, and in the interim he had changed his mind and went through with the settlement with a minimum of fuss.
Most of the insurers I work for now have fairly elaborate security as claims adjusters deal with more people, and thus more overwrought/aggressive people.
I’m somewhat surprised that I’ve never been personally threatened. I’ve been in fairly contentious depositions with injured workers but none ever went beyond “I’m not answering that!” In my most recent trial, I spent half an hour explaining to the judge why the injured worker was a fraud, but I wished her good luck on the way out and she smiled and shook my hand.
Injured workers generally seem to reserve their ire for own lawyers. Thinking back, the most aggressive person I ever dealt with was a doctor who was pissed off about a subpoena. He screamed at me for a good 15 minutes even though I repeatedly told him I didn’t have anything to do with the case.