Yes, and my point was that the discrimation isn’t limited to getting your degree in women’s studies…but in any sort of degree that shows lack of foresight towards employability. I.e. while I think there is prejudice towards womans studies majors, I think there is a bigger problem in this job market in any underwater basket weaving type of field.
My brother got a degree in Family Planning (this was before such things were considered evil.) Luckily he had a good plan B of working as a car mechanic, which he is quite good at.
I’ve never gotten a resume from an astronomy major, but I can imagine hiring one for a job opening I have now, assuming he or she had good programming skills and lots of physics. I know the math will be good.
I don’t know where you are, but in Silicon Valley good engineering grads are getting multiple offers and astounding amounts of money. I suspect good programmers are doing pretty well also. I also know of someone who found a job within a week of being laid off. I can’t vouch for those who graduated from crappy schools or who can’t send in a resume without spelling errors, though. We, by the way, understand that some people got laid off through no fault of their own, but we’d want to see that the person was trying to keep up with his or her skills during that time. The person might have to work a bit harder in creating a value proposition, but it can be done.
BTW, you misspelled Bush recession. And if a depression involves the Dow doubling, I’d hate see what prosperity looks like in your book.
Is math considered liberal arts?
Yeah, I’ll admit it’s not fair, but I’ve heard horror stories of people taking Women’s Studies courses. This was an academic, accredited course at a research 1 (outdated standard, I know, but bear with me) University. A couple friends were in the course (not me, thank the gods). They would have discussion sections about fairly serious gender and societal issues (things ranging on the sensitivity scale from income disparity to rape), and they, like good students, brought up facts and used them to support their opinions. They got marked off and chastised by the TA because they should only “talk about their feelings on the matter” and that “facts didn’t belong in discussions about <this topic.>” And this was with two different TAs.
I would have thought my friends were just being sexist and overanalyzing a few snide remarks by a WOMAN :eek: or pulling a stupid prank on me, but they didn’t fare much better on the research papers, over time, they found they got better grades by just being really… new agey in their papers and eschewing statistics and facts. I saw the comments on their papers by the TAs and started to believe it was possible.
Ever since then, this sort of thing is what I think of when I hear “Women’s Studies major.” It’s not fair, and it’s probably not even universal to all colleges, but that class soured the major for me.
But I don’t see substantive evidence of this discrimination.
Is there evidence that a liberal arts degree results in WORSE employment prospects than no university degree?
I think it also depends on the content of the degree; I don’t think a liberal arts degree can be rigorous in the same way as physics or engineering, but your knowledge of the field can demonstrate your ability to consider a situation abstractly and critically. If your field is history and you understand it as a process, you should be able to comprehend, at a high level, some business or manufacturing process. Given the nature of the human beast, this is the best many students can do, since few students know, at 18 or 19 that they want to major in something like engineering, and have the ability and preparation in math to make that feasible. Moreover, in the case of other currently lucrative but less daunting majors, today’s labor shortage leads to tomorrow’s job shortage as students flock to the major.
What am I hiring for? Women’s studies might work for an HR position, or if I sell into a female-dominated marketplace.
I like hiring psychology majors. In a good program, they have taken more statistics and have written more than many other social science degrees. Most importantly, they don’t think that they already know business when they walk into my office.
Hint to the business majors - you don’t know shit except a few catchphrases.
To be fair, Crafter_Man is an engineer, so it’s hard to imagine that, under normal circumstances, any openings for which he’s making the decision wouldn’t have garnered many resumes from people with more suitable education and background. Then again, do theater majors learn how to do backstage prop construction or electrical work? I’d think some of those practical skills could translate well to non-theater settings.
One would think a degree in Jewish studies, where you’d have to parse Talmudic commentary, would imply that you’re unusually detail-oriented.
Depends on the person, but yes technical theater gets the same theater B.A. as everyone else. It wasn’t my field but I know a bunch of skilled carpenters and electricians who were all theater majors before they started to specialize.
I am just wondering the impression the major gives more than anything. It seems that most people think all theater majors are actors when, at least at my school, only about 1/3 of the program was actor focused.
In the course of getting my theater degree, I learned a bit about wiring, woodcarving and carpentry, welding, painting, upholstering, sewing, dyeing, and color theory. Unfortunately, the only jobs that are looking for that sort of jack of all trades are set and costume technicians and there’s a lot more people applying for those jobs than there are jobs. If I’d known then what I know now, I would have transferred to a school that had a stronger internship process in a heavily theatrical area or stayed at my school and chosen a more math or science based major.
I’m not Jewish so it may be none of my business, but I’ve taken a look at some of the extreme obsessiveness of some Jewish scholars and I have to say that you’d have to be detail oriented to make it through this, and if you aren’t detail oriented when you start, you would have to become that way.
I’d also venture a guess that studying Catholic Canon Law or Catholic Theology is also going to be pretty detail oriented.
I also hire technicians, and some of the techs I’ve hired have non-technical college degrees. I would have no problem hiring good tech who happened to have a degree in theater.
When I was interviewing, the only thing I did with the degree-type was sometimes I’d ask people what they felt the degree taught them. The answers were interesting and it gave people something to talk about freely. There was no right or wrong answer.
First of all, thanks to everyone who replied. I got stuck at work and just now returned to the thread.
I was surprised mostly by the unanimous responses of my friends when I asked this question. I tried to phrase it in a way that the applicant was qualified, but the degree was tangential (ie. for a clerical position that didn’t require college).
even sven is correct that they are ignorant (as am I) of the exact nature of a women’s studies degree. To them, it just sounds like a recipe for a problematic employee, and they elect to skip to the next applicant. I was curious if this is common, or if there are other fields of study which might actually inhibit employment, rather than help.
FWIW, none of the people I asked actually work in HR. They simply have (had) varying degrees of authority over who is on their team or project (one is retired). Also none of them work at my company. Paradoxically, the most adamant negative response was from someone who, although having almost total authority over their department, has a very diverse workgroup*. This person said it’s because they “…hire the best person for the job… period.”
I will be spending a little time soon with an old friend who owns his own small, but successful business (2 employees). I will ask him this question when I see him.
*a white male would actually be notable, due to their rarity.
yep, techs are the sort of people I was thinking of. A friend of mine has worked as an EE tech for many years.
And in this case I think you could also say “no answer is wrong”, and parse that in at least two ways.
Every hiring authority is going to have their prejudices whether they admit it or not. I freely admit I have prejudices. (IMO people who claim they’re “completely objective” are simply lying.) Though it may not be accurate, I make instant judgments on a person based on their chosen field of study when I review resumes. A women’s studies major? I picture an angry, spiteful, intolerant, and bitchy woman, and I won’t waste my time interviewing her. Psychology major? I picture a flaky person with no real talents or drive. Communications major? I picture someone who had no idea what he/she wanted to major in and sailed through college without any real challenges. Chemistry major? I picture an analytical person who’s not afraid to tackle difficult subjects.
Fair? No. But I don’t have time to determine if a sociology major would make a good employee. Rightly or wrongly, I make a snap judgments based on what I see in their resumes.
I seriously doubt that there any undergraduate degrees that actually decrease your job prospects, but there are some graduate degrees that might. If you have a PhD in women’s studies (or anything named _____ studies, really), there are very few academic jobs that you’re qualified for, and you’re competing with people from other humanities and social sciences fields. Private employers aren’t going to find you all that attractive either, worrying that you’ll think their work is too boring or that you’ll jump ship as soon as a professorial job pops up (this is a delusion). So that may be the answer to the OP.