I hate tollbooths with a passion. Having my time wasted really burns me, and to make it worse, lots of tollbooths are placed in locations that are already bottlenecks - bridges mostly.
And when hundreds of cars are sitting in lines to get a ticket or pay a toll, that’s GOT to be increasing air pollution, right?
So if we removed all the tollbooths would traffic congestion be eased? Or would things get more congested because there would be no “penalty” to be paid, and hence more drivers on the road?
If you have a toll booth it might regulate the flow of cars onto another road. Only so many cars can get through at a time so you have a steadier flow of traffic after the tolls.
And the other side is if you put in a toll booth you will slow down traffic.
They definitely slow things down when opposed to the case of not having to stop for one at all. All the toll roads around here widen by several lanes to mitigate the slowdown where a toll stop comes up, but I think you really have to consider the length of time your trip would take if the toll road (existing only by virtue of its having been pitched as a toll road originally) were not there at all.
You didn’t ask this, but I will suggest that rarely are tollbooths put in to limit usage and traffic flow. You can use stoplights and gates for that. Tollbooths are generally put in to make money: to pay back bonds for the building of the road/bridge/tunnel, to cover repair/maintenance/patrolling, and to offset costs elsewhere in the system (free roads and bridges).
Tolls are not likely to affect road use if there are not comparable free alternatives. For example, in Jersey it’s impractical for most folks who drive the Turnpike or Garden State to take the local roads instead. On the other hand, given the choice of the 59th St Bridge or the Triboro to go from Queens to upper Manhattan, many will avoid the Triboro simply to save a few bucks, even though they will have to put up with several hideous blocks of traffic.
Another factor is whether the road is busy or not. The tolls on the Garden State put a major pinch on traffic flow, especially before they had EZ Pass installed. Meanwhile, the Kansas Turnpike tolls aren’t likely to slow you much, except perhaps during holidays.
I knew someone that worked for the NJ Turnpike Authority, collecting tolls or passing out tickets. He lived in Bayonne, and usually worked up north. But sometimes they would need him to work at the southern end, near Delaware. That’s normally a 2-hour drive. Union rules only permitted him to work 8 hours a day, and that included driving time (at least for distant sites). One holiday weekend,it took him 3.5 hours to get down to the tollbooths (I can assure you he wasn’t jockeying for the quickest lane). He worked for a little over an hour, then had to drive home, so he wouldn’t run over the 8 hours.
Simple example:
At 9am a car leaves for a 30 minute trip.
At 9:31 a second car leaves for a 20 minute trip
and there is no other cars in existance
there is no traffic because car 1 gets to it’s destination before car 2 leaves.
now we put a toll booth or 2 to delay cars about 3 minutes.
so the 1st car will get there 33 minutes later but because of that car 2 has left - now we have traffic.
in short
If you lenghten the time it takes to travel there will be more cars moving at any given time.
well not a gate but some entrance ramps tot he LIE and Northern State parkway have lights that let only one car through per green.
There IS a way to remove the tollbooth (to ease congestion) without removing the penalty (which would add drivers to the road), and that is by doubling the toll in one direction, and making it free in the other direction.
This eases congestion in the free direction, but very little revenue is lost. I will admit to choosing routes which allow me to take the road in the free direction one way, but avoid that road on the trip home, but it is usually too circuitous to be worthwhile.
(Specific example: All the NJ-NYC connections are tolls going to NYC, but free going to NJ. So no matter which tunnel or bridge you use to NJ, you still have to pay going to NY, unless you go a hundred miles all the way up to Poughkeepsie or something. HOWEVER, the Verrazano bridge connects Staten Island and Brooklyn, and is double-toll ($7 at present!) to Staten Island, and free to Brooklyn. So I will sometimes go from NJ to Brooklyn via the Verrazano for free, and then return to NJ via Manhattan for free. But it’s usually not worth it.)
Even if you go all the way up to Poughkeepsie, you’re still outta luck. All five Mid-Hudson river crossings (Bear Mtn, Newburgh-Beacon, Mid-Hudson, Kingston-Rhinecliff, and Rip Van Winkle) are also pay toll only when traveling eastbound. The next bridge up is a Thruway spur bridge leading to the Mass Pike. So you have to go practically to Albany to avoid the toll. Is it worth it? Depends on how much you hate and despise paying tolls. (A hint: the tolls on these bridges aren’t close to NYC standards.)
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Even if you go all the way up to Poughkeepsie, you’re still outta luck. All five Mid-Hudson river crossings (Bear Mtn, Newburgh-Beacon, Mid-Hudson, Kingston-Rhinecliff, and Rip Van Winkle) are also pay toll only when traveling eastbound. The next bridge up is a Thruway spur bridge leading to the Mass Pike. So you have to go practically to Albany to avoid the toll. Is it worth it? Depends on how much you hate and despise paying tolls. (A hint: the tolls on these bridges aren’t close to NYC standards.)
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But the NJ crossings are $6 (5 peak and $4 off peek w/ ezpass) the tappan zee is (IIRC) $2.50 maybe 3, the bear mtn bridge and rt 84 br is 1. I frequently will make a cost saving loop via the verazanno, or tappan zee or even the rt 84 or BMB if I am in hte general area to save a few . Never had to travel high enough for work to get back for free though.
Tolls create traffic here in the Bay Area, where you pay for leaving the East Bay or into SF. The kicker is that originally, the tolls were to be in place until the bridge was paid off, which happened about 35 years ago. Now there is a $1 surcharge (to make it $2 total for all bridges except the GG, which I don’t use very often, I think it’s $3, but I’m not sure) to pay for the to be built eastern span of the Bay Bridge. I’m sure that will be temporary as well. I wouldn’t be so bitter if the money stayed in the area instaed of paying for stuff in LA, especially when it took about 9 years to replace a freeway damaged in the Loma Prieta quake.
Even though i saw this post and have posted some times here (I think 3 times in one) - when I scan the GQ’s I read this as “Do toothbrushes create or relieve traffic?” and I go ‘huh?’
Yea I know this should go into MPSIMS but I don’t think it really deserves it’s own topic - just a brief side is all that I needed.
