I think kanicbird and BobLibDem are accurate about the kind of crazy that has infected the thinking of a substantial percentage of the electorate. With that being the case, it’s hard to imagine going back to the Old Normal.
If Trump wanted a foreign war, why didn’t he start one during his first term?
Didn’t Trump order a strike to kill Iran’s general Soleimani, it didn’t start a war but it sure seems like he was trying.
Biggest problem is the sixth word of your question. Answer to that is clearly “No”, which invalidates the rest of it.
Great post! I don’t have too much to add, but…
Yeah, my mom watches Fox News, and all day long, I mean all fucking day long, all they do is micro-criticize the Dems and the Left. Hey, guys, you’re picking at a zit while you have a gangrenous arm. And the same thing with nationalreview.com, which I read to see what a somewhat sane version of the Other Side is thinking. There is anti-Trump stuff, quite a bit, but a lot of the same zit-picking.
Trump being where he is at is neither normal nor acceptable. ALL of the media, Right and Left, needs to be shouting, “We condemn this man and can’t allow him to win.”
E.g., you can’t host a fucking Republican debate (even without Trump) and pretend it’s a normal primary!
Astute. They want to create a fake country in which everything happens to go the way of the 1%. However, here is a good article on kos about why that’s not working very well for them (btw, the graphic is hilarious!):
While Trump is an idiot, he is still the only one who can hold this shit together. I don’t think, say, Heinrich Himmler could have held Nazidom together after the death of Hitler.
See, like Nazism, Trumpism is built upon the charismatic leader. I think your post has value in that I think it lays out what these assholes are going to try to do. I just don’t think they are going to succeed. The breakup I have outlined would be triggered just the same.
To be fair to Trump, I don’t think he’s all that into war or killing people. (I do think he’d be happy to be Dictator for Life.) But a lot of his followers sure do want to fight and kill.
“to”
What’s wrong with “to”, exactly?
Pretty sure they were referring to the OP, with word #6 being “think.”
Yes, sorry. I’ve done that before here–thought I was replying to the main thread, instead replied to a specific post. I’m trainable, honest. Well, it’s rumored.
Yes, Trump is not really the danger here (though that is not any real reassurance in the scheme of things). Trump doesn’t give a shit about how the U.S. or the rest of the world works. He only cares about one thing and that is not going to prison. If he is elected, he will concern himself with getting all his legal problems to go away and then he will play golf and hold rallies (totally exonerated!). He will leave the country in the hands of the Steve Bannons and the Stephen Millers who will actually do the things Trump rants about every day. He will be fine, of course, with letting them make him Dictator but he himself will not really put any effort into it. Aside from preening and talking about how great he is.
If you watch his speeches, he says all the ranty words in the sing-song monotone his imitators do so well. There is no enthusiasm, no zeal behind his message (see Hitler). He is just repeating the things he thinks he needs to say to get elected. The threat is the MAGA movement that has made him their unfathomable figurehead. Unleashing the full force of that on the country will ruin us. And there are plenty of evil people surrounding him who will love to make it burn. It’s astounding that it’s come to this.
Yeah, I think your post is on target. None of this would be happening if the GOP adults in the room were accepting their responsibility as Americans and politicians. Trump is nothing more than a charismatic dumbass, the voters who vote for him are mostly stupid, but all of Trump’s enablers have no excuse. They are selfish, venal, and yes–evil.
As mentioned, Trump may have hoped that killing the Iranian general would have given him a full-fledged foreign war. And there were other instances of his seeming to be looking for war (his hope to nuke Mexico, for example). But as has also been mentioned, there were ‘adults in the room’ who thwarted Trump many times during his term. Of course there will be no such people come January 2025, if he gets in again.
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Heh. Yes, “Blame Canada” might see quite a resurgence.
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I am genuinely curious about what you see as a power held by Blue states. Sure, a governor and/or state legislature can declare that they will not follow such-and-such Federal mandate. And Blue states generally are not dependent on Federal funds (being net contributors, rather than net takers of Fed. money).
But I’m still not seeing how they could band “together and oppos[e]” Trump. Examples?
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Sure, that might happen. But the point of Trump possessing a Foreign War is not the booty he’d acquire. (Or is only marginally so.)
It’s more the excuse for martial law/totalitarian rule that a foreign war would confer on him. Vast numbers of Democrats in general, media and pop culture figures, and activists of any left-wing stripe could be imprisoned (or executed) because they are “secret Canadians” (or actual Canadians!) Being a “secret Mexican” or “secret Cuban” would work for some on Trump’s Enemies List, but…Canadians tend to be whiter, and so more useful as scapegoats. Canadians–they’re all over the country! They sneak in along so long a border! We must be uber-alert for them on every square foot of this great nation! And we must cooperate with our trusty military, occupying every city, town, and hamlet–protecting us from those evil Canadians!
And so on.
I see major corporations as going along with all this for the same reasons that major industrial figures went along with Hitler: they got sweetheart deals and immunity from most persecution. They also got, in many cases, forced labor. Though Trump would certainly stage public executions if he thought they would make him more popular, he’d also be open to being paid by the big corps for providing them with tons of slave labor.
Large corporations would be thrilled to be handed quantities of slaves (that is, critics of Trump). Manufacturing would return to the USA!!!
To riff on the foreign war things, they could declare themselves sanctuary states for those who refuse to be drafted. If federal border security starts doing crazy shit per Trump’s orders, they could kick them out or passively oppose them. Lots of stuff is possible, up to and including leaving the Federal Reserve system and starting their own currency.
I don’t think we’ll see outright secession. Rather, such states would say that Trump and the Supreme Court are illegitimate and perhaps any GOP majorities in Congress, as their members supported the insurrection, etc.; and therefore, the states in opposition to Trump are the “real” US.
I don’t agree in this case. Most big corporations are multinationals that still have to answer to their shareholders and customers in Europe. We saw how quickly corporations left Russia; even though money was still there to be made, they had no choice. It would be the same thing in the case of supporting Dictator Trump.
That’s why the German branch of Coca-Cola created Fanta in WWII. They could no longer get ingredients in because of a trade embargo so they started a new brand and all of the ingredients were local.
Corporations will find a way to make things work but not without consequences. They will not be able to just ignore what’s going on and have business as usual.
Like today’s cowardly GOP, they will try to justify acting in their own interest, but I doubt that they could possibly be as craven as the GOP (which doesn’t even understand its own interest!)
Another reason I suggested Cuba as a possible Trump takeover target is tied to his likely policy on Ukraine. Trump’s foreign policy would turn the clock back over 100 years when the US stayed out of European affairs and largely concentrated on the Americas. I could see Trump making a deal with Putin to cut off American support of Ukraine and NATO in return for Russia letting him do what he wants in Cuba and the other countries in the Caribbean basin (i.e. “America’s Lake”).
The only thing funnier than watching two ego-dudes do a deal is watching what happens next when each of them notices they’ve made a deal with somebody who pays no attention to fulfilling their side of any deal, much less that particular deal.
Good examples. But I still think that a Trump instructing the US military to capture and imprison a blue state’s governor and Democratic legislators would prevail against anything a blue state could do. (Yes, the Army, Marines etc. could take out any state’s National Guard, even if that N.G. has some leaders on the side of the blue state governor and legislators. Many National Guard personnel, of course, are MAGA–probably more than we dream.)
Making one or more blue states an example (and how Trump would love hanging Gavin Newsom in front of his Sacramento governor’s mansion!) might quell all resistance in the rest of the blue states, and blue cities in red states, too.
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That sounds very plausible to me.
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Heh. Quite true.
Yet in the case we’re positing, there might be enough loot and power to keep all the totalitarian leaders happy, even though they are bound to be deal-breakers when it comes to the details.
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I think there are a bunch of different Trump supporter types. They range from dumb-dumbs who think they’re supporting a normal Republican candidate to self-acknowledged neonazis who want the killin’ to start soon. And there are a bunch in between who are lying to themselves about their own beliefs and motivations."
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BlockquoteYes, they’re fucking nazis. A significant number of them want to get down to killing people.
But they’re also idiots and don’t see the immediate hard pushback they would face.
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I think comments like these drive home what’s wrong with this country and why we may indeed be headed toward the end of Democracy.
If you don’t understand some group or party, don’t attribute the worst possible motives to them, vilify them and call them names…usually in a silo of like-minded individuals who nod and agree with you. If you want to know what they’re thinking and why they act the way they do, TALK with them, get to know them and find out what motivates them. Don’t pretend your life experience is the same as theirs OR that your life experience makes you superior to them. If you don’t know any (FILL IN THE BLANK…Republicans, Democrats, Gays, Religious people, immigrants, gun owners, etc.), maybe that’s a sign you need to go outside your comfort zone and find some before judging them or pretending you know what makes them tick.
What makes you think I don’t know any? I know a bunch from across the spectrum, from dumb-dumbs to someone I know somewhat well who wanted Trump to declare martial law after the election (a smart guy, actually, but a true authoritarian).
We’ve also learned about Trump supporters a lot through the media. We’ve heard them talk, we’ve seen them storm the Capitol. We’ve heard endless sound bytes from Trump-enabling GOP pols and talking heads on Fox News.
We’ve seen white supremacists march and heard their rhetoric (these would be some of the killers I mentioned, if they got the chance).
We’ve heard and learned a lot more than we desired since 2015. We’ve been soaked in this piss.
What the hell don’t we know at this point? Trumpism is not some esoteric mystery–it’s in our goddamn faces 24/7!