Do vaccines strengthen the immune system overall?

[Moriarty]

As I understand it, generally, if you get a vaccine, you are forcing your body into an immune response (by giving it an inert version of the illness - at whatever molecular level science is able to produce). This is why you may feel a little sick in reaction to the injection, and why some people may indeed have a very serious reaction; their body’s immune system has waged a simulated war on a toothless invader.

Nevertheless, once your body overcome this reaction, you have developed a resistance to the illness (up to and including immunity).

Presuming this is basically correct, it occurs to me that it is similar to how the body responds to other stimuli. Exercise, for example, taxes the body beyond its usual functioning, thereby triggering a response that makes the person stronger. This is true for endurance and muscular power.

Similarly, “stressing” one’s brain (even if just by asking to perform puzzles) can help stave off dementia. Again, the body seems to respond to a challenge by reinforcing the pathways needed to solve it.

In that vein, is it accurate to say that getting vaccines strengthens your immune system overall?

Meaning, just by putting it through its paces each year (such as by getting the flu vaccine), are you keeping it robust and better equipped to respond to other types of Illnesses (even those for whom you haven’t received a vaccine)?

For all the controversy about getting Covid vaccines, are vaccines actually good for you?

(Part of what inspired this was an article I found earlier today, and which I posted in a Quarantine Zone thread. See below: a person’s body killed off a tumor in response to getting the Covid vaccine)

Spontaneous tumor regression following COVID-19 vaccination

(I wasn’t sure if this should be in the quarantine zone, but it’s more general than just Covid, so I chose here)

[Dr_Paprika]

You have asked an important question. In general terms, vaccines do seem to strengthen the overall immune system. You have innate immunity against random interlopers. But vaccines also improve immune memory, which remembers previous insults and preforms antibodies against them for use on re-exposure. Recent research suggests this is an oversimplification. Vaccines seem to also strengthen innate immunity.

Active immunization means administering part of a microorganism (perhaps a toxoid or purified antigen) to stimulate an immune response similar to natural infection. Passive immunization means giving a preformed antibody, say after exposure in an unvaccinated person, or in someone whose immune system is suppressed.

Live vaccines are used for less virulent pathogens such as measles, mumps, rubella and chicken pox. The viruses replicate, leading to mild and usually sub clinical infection, and this leads to strong cell mediated immunity. On re-exposure, immune memory is robust and lasts a long time. But live vaccines also seem to make the innate system more effective.

An inactive protein component is used for many vaccines with more virulent pathogens, including: tetanus, hepatitis B, influenza, pneumococcus, meningococcus, diphtheria, pertussis and polio. Immune memory is of shorter duration, and there is much less replication or cell mediated immunity. Booster shots are usually required to maintain immunity. Innate immunity seems to be strengthened less.

The benefit of vaccines are greater than one would expect just from the specific injection. But live vaccines strengthen the immune system more than inactive proteins. This is an issue with regards to the polio vaccine (see link).

The name for strength through overcoming a mild stress is called hormesis. It is why warm saunas might potentially increase health span or why the muscle microdamage from exercise may lead to greater strength or endurance.

This discussion may be clearer than my explanation.

Q&A: How vaccines can strengthen immune response beyond a specific disease

[Dr_Paprika]

@mozchron and @DSeid may also know more about this than I do.

[DSeid]

Probably not, but that won’t stop me from throwing my bit in!

@Moriarty

it occurs to me that it is similar to how the body responds to other stimuli. Exercise, for example, taxes the body beyond its usual functioning, thereby triggering a response that makes the person stronger. This is true for endurance and muscular power.

Similarly, “stressing” one’s brain (even if just by asking to perform puzzles) can help stave off dementia

I think your analogy is valid but I’d take it further: there is also specificity of response.

Training for a marathon won’t improve your ability to powerlift. Even within the same class of activity specificity applies. Doing curls does not gain ability to at leg extension; doing math doesn’t increase writing ability.

Most vaccines are more like doing a curl or memorizing a very specific list of facts than whole body exercises. Those that trigger the innate response are a bit closer to whole body exercise.

Crossword puzzles and cognitive decline is an interesting bit. It isn’t just doing the crossword puzzles- they have to be hard enough to make your mind work at it. It likely helps that they integrate across domains, verbal recall, tactical thinking, and visual spatial even. Keeping it stress free doesn’t help.

For each the principle applies that there is too little and too much stress.

[Maserschmidt]

@DSeid

Crossword puzzles and cognitive decline is an interesting bit. It isn’t just doing the crossword puzzles- they have to be hard enough to make your mind work at it. It likely helps that they integrate across domains, verbal recall, tactical thinking, and visual spatial even. Keeping it stress free doesn’t help.

This comment reminded me of a JAMA article from last year.

Lifestyle Enrichment in Later Life and Its Association With Dementia Risk

In adusted [sic] analyses, more frequent engagement in adult literacy activities (eg, writing letters or journaling, using a computer, and taking education classes) and in active mental activities (eg, playing games, cards, or chess and doing crosswords or puzzles) was associated with an 11.0% (adjusted hazard ratio [AHR], 0.89 [95% CI, 0.85-0.93]) and a 9.0% (AHR, 0.91 [95% CI, 0.87-0.95]) lower risk of dementia, respectively. To a lesser extent, engagement in creative artistic activities (craftwork, woodwork, or metalwork and painting or drawing) (AHR, 0.93 [95% CI, 0.88-0.99]) and in passive mental activities (reading books, newspapers, or magazines; watching television; and listening to music or the radio) (AHR, 0.93 [95% CI, 0.86-0.99]) was also associated with reduced dementia risk. In contrast, interpersonal networks, social activities, and external outings were not associated with dementia risk in this sample.

My first reaction to that was good, it does help. My second was that 11% isn’t much, but I’ll take it.

[Moriarty]

@DSeid

Doing curls does not gain ability to at leg extension

No, not directly.

But doing squats helps your arms to grow.

Norwegian researchers found that training your legs immediately before training your biceps actually creates bigger and stronger biceps than without the leg exercises. How? Heavy leg exercises rapidly boost your testosterone and growth hormone levels.

The Secret to Bigger Arms Has Nothing to Do With Working Out Your Arms

I think the same mechanism works with your immune system. A focused attack on some pathogen (even if it was a mere shell, or only a specific marker, as with vaccines) makes for a more robust system overall.

And, by contrast, I’m guessing that a person who is “never sick” and so “doesn’t need vaccines” is actually not as prepared to fight off a serious illness than somebody who takes vaccines to periodically “exercise” their immune response.

@DSeid

For each the principle applies that there is too little and too much stress.

Well, certainly. I’d think the “too much stress” for immunity wound arise from actually getting the diseases, instead of the vaccines. That’s why vaccines are so amazing; they trigger the body to get stronger without subjecting it to the risk of overkill. (Well, most of the time. It is true that some people won’t be able to handle even the simulated stress)

It’s like triggering the body to get more tan without incurring the risk of a sunburn.

[Chronos]

On the other hand, if you’re exposed to an actual (presumably different) novel pathogen while your body is in the process of reacting to a vaccine, couldn’t that decrease your immune response to the pathogen, as your system is splitting its resources between responding to the two apparent threats?

[puzzlegal]

I think the opposite is often true – that when your immune system is running at full tilt, fighting one thing, you are LESS likely to catch something else. See Viral Interference

Basically, it’s expensive to fire up the immune system, and mostly, we don’t do that. But when we are fighting something, we do.

[Jackmannii]

The ramifications of non-specifc immune system responses to vaccination remain unsettled.

There’s some evidence of positive effects.

Epidemiological data suggest that vaccination with live-attenuated vaccines such as Bacillus Calmette-Guérin (BCG), measles vaccine, and oral polio vaccine results in increased overall childhood survival, and several of these observations have been confirmed in randomized trials. Immunological mechanisms mediating NSE include heterologous lymphocyte effects and induction of innate immune memory (trained immunity). Trained immunity induces long-term functional upregulation of innate immune cells through epigenetic and metabolic reprogramming.

On the other hand, research by Peter Aaby et al in a small African country (Guinea-Bissau) seemed to indicate higher all-cause mortality in a cohort of children given DPT vaccine. The World Health Organization looked into that research and found it lacking in a number of areas.

More on the subject here.

[Dr_Paprika]

I didn’t mention Alzheimer’s in my reply. My personal guess is diet, regular care, avoiding bad habits and chronic disease, and mitochondrial efficiency may play a role in reducing incidence. Using many parts of the brain, through different activities using different systems, may mean local vascular or metabolic effects could be of less significance simply since there is more redundancy. I think we still have enormous amounts to learn about this subject.