Says the guy arguing against seatbelts.
Woah, dude, you are REALLY not in a position to be snarky about other folks’ discussion skills here. If 80-90% of all accidents are avoidable, it’s still possible that the 20% of all unavoidable accidents includes 100% of automobile accidents. So your conclusion is a non sequitur. People were giving you the benefit of the doubt when they asked you for a cite about how many auto accidents are avoidable, assuming you’d just left out a word and not constructed a non sequitur.
Of course, a modified your original claim (applied specifically to automobile accidents) is correct, if I’m reading this pdf correctly:
If I’m correct that these percentages are additive, that’s 85% of collisions due to recognition errors, decision errors, and performance errors–smack dab in the middle of the 80-90% of accidents you claim are avoidable.
Edit: aw, crap–I just reread that quote and saw the first dependent clause. That’s only 85% of cases involving driver error, not 85% of all collisions. D’oh!
Then again, they are avoidable if BOTH parties are driving correctly. Your solution–be a truly GOOD driver–has three problems:
- A truly GOOD driver is one who makes no errors. That’s not possible for a human. The best we can do is to minimize our errors. And even there, activities such as engaging in conversation with a vehicle passenger count as “internal distraction”; few drivers are willing to avoid all conversation while driving.
- A truly GOOD driver may still get in an accident with a truly BAD driver. Being a truly GOOD driver doesn’t eliminate the risk of getting hit by one of those terible people.
- 15% of collisions are still due to other factors. Seat belts can help in those cases.
Seriously? You’re the one making a completely bogus claim about how the constitution applies to driving, showing complete ignorance of the legal structure of our nation, and when someone points this out to you using a correct analogy, you call them willfully stupid? I mean, I don’t think you’re being willful about it, but you’re also in no position to call them names like this.
Okay, Here’s a compendium of cites about human error causing vehicular accidents, claiming human error is responsible in about 90% of crashes.
I haven’t read the thread so someone might have come up with a good reason, but I hate seatbelts and refuse to where them when I can. The only times when I actually wear one is if I think there are cops nearby, if I’m driving with this friend of mine who seems to attract cops, or when this friend or my mom annoys me about putting it on.
I’m utterly unconvinced about the whole saving money/health care thing. I have health care, I’m insured, so if I want to play god with my own life and money, I’ll do so. If I didn’t have insurance or health care, I can see why it would be the law. But I can pay for it, and I do, so I’ll risk my life if I want.
I once had a cop behind me on the freeway when I didn’t have my belt on. I looked in the mirror then panicked and pulled it on. I got a ticket for that. He specifically said it was because he saw me put on the belt. So now, when I’m around cops and not wearing the seat belt, I act cool like a cucumber and ignore the belt. Maybe its just confirmation bias, but I haven’t been pulled over yet even if the cops drive next to me for a long time or we stop next to each other on a red light. I’m sure most cops are too busy to go around pulling over random people without seat belts
This is where I stopped reading your post.
Yeah, the cops are too busy putting those random people in body bags. :smack:
Well, if you’ve got a passenger in your car, and you roll it, you’ve just become a projectile bouncing around the inside of your car. Likewise if you get involved in a head-on collision and fire yourself through your windshield and into the passenger compartment of the other vehicle, you’re likely to do a lot of harm to someone other than yourself.
Both of which are pretty unlikely, of course. And as a further bonus, if it does happen, you’re not likely to live long enough to feel guilty about hurting someone else.
I really think that the chances of me being a projectile and hitting someone else is microscopic. We’re safe enough
Yog, part of the point is that when people are hurt it drives up everyones insurance costs.
My brother also doesn’t wear a seatbelt. For him, I guess it’s a bit of a convenience thing, with a side of machismo. He’s foolish and silly.
Your post opens with this statement but then goes on to challenge the right of society to require you to wear seatbelts.
But why do you hate them and refuse to wear them?
OK, I can accept that you have the God-given right to die in an accident (or become critically injured, or disabled for life) if you choose–after all, it’s your life. And I guess there must be nobody else who cares what happens to you, as long as your insurance covers the cost. But what is the downside to buckling a seatbelt?
I usually wear my seatbelt, although I don’t bother when I’m just jockeying around cars/trailers on our property. Yesterday I took the doors off of my Jeep Wrangler just out of curiousity. You couldn’t pay me to leave my seatbelt off! The doors are back on now.
I always wear mine when in a private car, but often I do not use them in a taxi.
I think its ok to take a chance occasionally. There is a tiny chance that I’ll get hurt in an accident, even accounting for how cars are more dangerous than planes and all that. And there’s a good chance that I can afford my medical bills. Given that, I feel comfortable in taking a chance by not wearing my seat belt
Don’t get me wrong, I’m as liberal as they come. I’m perfectly fine with society making laws forcing seat belt wearing. I’m actually even fine if cops go around stopping people (such as me!) for not wearing seat belts. I’m just saying that as a law, I just don’t want to follow it, even though I support it and think its a good idea.
This may be hard to understand, but I’m not automatically against anything I don’t like. I don’t say “I hate this, it bothers me, therefore it should be illegal”. Not all the time, and not reflexively. I think its great for society and cost savings that we make people wear seat belts. Completely 100% for it. But for myself personally, I find them uncomfortable and don’t want to wear it. I’ll try to get away with it whenever I can. Its annoying, and I rationalize it to myself that ultimately, I won’t cost society that much money, so its not a big deal.
I feel the same way about speed limits. People should follow them, they are good. But I’m going to speed when I think I can get away with it. I dunno, does that make me a bad person? I really don’t know.
They’re uncomfortable. That’s really all there is to it.
Funny thing is, I tend to wear them more at night or in inclement weather. Partly because its more dangerous, but partly because I want to feel the safety of the belts during those times. I can do 90mph in the day on a freeway without even noticing, but I can’t do it at night, I feel unease speeding when its dark
I’m not going to call you a bad person, but on this topic that’s a pretty foul attitude. Either speed limits are dumb and everyone should feel free to get away with what they can, or they’re good and everyone should follow them. Saying that everyone should follow them except you is narcissistic.
Are you obese?
You almost got it. I think it would be great if I followed speeding laws too. I sorta wished I did, less risk that way. But I have poor self-control and do impulsive things. I KNOW speeding laws are good for everyone, including me. I just can’t make myself follow them. I get to driving and driving and suddenly I notice I’m 10 or 20 mph over the speed limit
No, but I could lose a few pounds. I’ve felt this way about seat belts for years, even before my present amount of poundage. I don’t like how it touches my neck. I don’t like how it “locks” where if you pull on it, it won’t give any slack. When I was mostly a passenger, I’d pull extra length out of the seat belt so I’d have a lot of slack to move around. I don’t like how I can’t wiggle my legs out of the lower half. And I’m afraid that I’ll get into a fiery crash and will burn alive without being able to unhook the lower belt and escape
Wut?
99.9% of the time as a driver or front seat passenger. Occasionally, if I’m just moving the car up or back a couple of parking spaces, or just up the block, I don’t.
For back seat, I’ve only relatively recently gotten into the habit of buckling up, and I can’t swear that I do it without fail. I’m fairly certain I don’t do it on the rare occasion I’m in a taxi, for instance. Growing up in the 80s, we never buckled up in the back seat, and since I’m so rarely in the back seat these days, it never quite became a force of habit.
(I voted third option in the poll.)
That’s right
It shouldn’t lock unless you’re making jerking movements. Normal body movements and the belt moves with you. At least that’s how it is on every car I’ve driven. With cars made within the last twenty years or so, there is a way to switch back and forth between the emergency locking mode (where only sudden jerks lock the belt) and automatic locking mode (where the belt remains locked.) Emergency locking mode is the default.
Dude, if your seatbelt stops you from wiggling your legs, you are either suffering from a deformity of some sort (if so, my apologies) or you aren’t wearing it right.