I was wondering if the Christian God ever lied?
I’m debating with this guy and he keeps emphasizing that God never lied.
But they’re already so many contradictions that I am starting to believe the people who wrote this where trolling us.
I am still reading the first few books of the bible(Well it’s actually a story that the author explains what each verse means while I look through the bible. It’s funny as hell, no pun intended)
Still new to debating!
Thanks!
No. And he’s never told the truth either.
How would anyone ever know? The Bible was written by people.
He lied point blank in Genesis. He told them eating the fruit would kill them, because he didn’t want them to get the knowledge of good and evil and become as gods. Spoiler: It didn’t kill them.
Yeah, you can make a weak case about how me meant metaphorically or something, but then you have to go and defend Obi-Wan too.
Here’s an example of Jesus lying, from the book of Matthew:
21:18 Now in the morning as he returned into the city, he hungered. 21:19 And when he saw a fig tree in the way, he came to it, and found nothing thereon, but leaves only, and said unto it, Let no fruit grow on thee henceforward for ever. And presently the fig tree withered away. 21:20 And when the disciples saw it, they marvelled, saying, How soon is the fig tree withered away! 21:21 Jesus answered and said unto them, Verily I say unto you, If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do this which is done to the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done. 21:22 And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.
Obviously, Christians can’t do that. Some few people recover from cancer or whatever, but at no different rates than Muslims or atheists, and there is no known case of amputees growing new limbs. When the Black Death swept through Europe, devout Christians died at the same rate as Jews and Muslims. As for snake handling (Jesus made another promise, in Mark 16, that believers would be immune to poisons and poisonous snakes), the scientific term for people who push their luck on that is “corpses.”
Jesus was lying. Christians will give lame excuses like “he’s not a trained seal,” but it was Jesus who made the unsolicited promise that you would get anything you pray for, even if it’s something stupid and spiteful like killing a fig tree for not having figs (a parallel account in Mark 11 notes that it wasn’t even the right season for figs), or just showing off, like throwing a mountain into the sea, so he’s a liar.
Another example
God loves everybody:
- JOHN 3:16, For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
But then it says here:
- HOS 9:15, All their wickedness is in Gilgal: for there I hated them: for the wickedness of their doings I will drive them out of mine house, I will love them no more: all their princes are revolters
- MAL 1:3, And I hated Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness.
He created an entire world where the fossils measure to be millions of years old even though they are only 6006 years old. If creating a forgery isn’t a lie, what is? 
“I want you to kill Isaac.”
“Sorry, what?”
“You heard me.”
“You want me to kill my son?”
“Yeah, take him up that fucking mountain and kill the fucker.”
“Really?”
“YES!”
…
“OK so we’re at the top of the mountain now.”
“Cool.”
“So you’re sure you want me to kill him?”
“…Nah I was just pulling your leg.”
I think that you need to differentiate between a simplistic, instructive explanation that may be a bit inaccurate but it’s at the level that can be understood (as we might explain stuff to young children), changing one’s mind, and a intent to deceive.
The first and second one sure, the third, I can’t think of anything at this time, but will think it over.
You’re mistaking Matthew for Jesus. Easy mistake to make. But for reference - Matthew wrote the above, not Jesus.
God also lies to Abram about Sarai’s reaction when he (God) tells that she will bear a child. She laughs and says it is impossible because her husband is so old but God tells Abram that she said she was too old.
Any lie God tells immediately becomes truth. It’s part of the job description.
This thread would fit better in Great Debates. God, please move it.
(for a Catholic) By definition, he can’t.
Just for the record: The standard rebuttal to this is: God didn’t put those fake fossils there; the Devil put those fake fossils there to deceive us and tempt us to believe the wrong things.
(Do you believe THAT?) :dubious:
See the post above yours.
He didn’t mistake Matthew for Jesus; his first sentence even states “from the book of Matthew.”
We’re aware that God/Jesus or God and Jesus didn’t write any of the Bible. I bet the OP is aware of that also but others are answering the question based on what others wrote in the Bible.
It’s my understanding that Christians consider Matthew a reliable source.
I had come across a link on Reddit from a former youth pastor who had put together a Google Docs list of things he found in the Bible that ultimately lead him to leave the church. It’s quite a big list, but I have not looked up any of the verses/stories and confirmed his findings. Your version of the Bible may yield different results I suppose. I know there is a section of contradictions and inaccuracies in there somewhere.
May be something in here can help you out. Good luck.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1f6ZewV_Ro5HLixACGE_wgJrnlFNVKVxTfuVALqARNEs/edit?hl=en_US&pli=1
This is an excellent one! It’s not a case of different authors describing God differently or God speaking “metaphorically” or anything else. It’s very clear that the point of the story is that God directly lied to Abram to spare Abram’s feelings - a white lie, but a lie clearly. I never thought about the implications of that before!
(I’m not aware of any Christian exegesis on that particular point, but I believe the Rabbis were straightforward in interpreting the story as demonstrating the propriety of telling a white lie for the sake of another’s feelings.)
What do Christians have to do with the posted question? I don’t really care what they, Masons, polar bears, or Equity members consider a reliable source! : D