Does Proper Grammer and Spelling Really Matter When It Comes to Debating?

Great Debates
1

I know this is going to be one crazy thread and I going to get bbqed for but I am sick of being attacked for my grammer and spelling mistakes. Because I don’t think it makes one bit of difference on debating a topic(I’ll give my arguments on that later).

First, some history I hated English in school. I mean I hated it. I think they make this language harder and more complicated than it has to be. Even my English teacher said this. And I really hated punctuation you know where commas, semi colons, and crap like that go. Yes, I did make it all the way though college and graduated(surprised and no I am not an aggie) but then I had some bad drug years which probably ruined my memory of grammer(and kept me from reading many books as I should have goboy) so sometimes I forget things and mess up with my writing as many of you intellectual grammer nerds suckers have pointed out many times.

So here is my argument on why it doesn’t matter about your use of grammer in debating. As long as you can be semi comprehended by the person reading your post than grammer should not be an issue for them to attack. I understand that in debating and your mission is to build up your argument while tearing down your opponets and I am cool with that. And it seems to me when somebody attacks your English it is called one of those terms for debating something like ad homin attack (the one that means they have nothing to say of substance so they just pick something lame to attack your opponet with)or something. (I am sure If I got that wrong and someone will jab into me go for it but frankly I just don’t care)

Back to my argument some of the smarter people here use a quite a bit of foul language all the time. I have read somewhere(now somebody is going to want a cite for that comment huh) that if you use foul language in a debate, that is a sign of weak debating skills also. Personally I don’t think that is a true statement either so I don’t care if you do(use foul language to express yourself other than taking the Lord’s name in vain). But what I am saying no one should attack my grammer as a weakness in a debate we are having if you use curse words in your post. Fair enough?

This something I am been wanted to complain about for a long time wishing I could say “bitching.”

Thinking to myself “do I really want all the grief this post is going to cause me down the line if I hit the submit new thread button…hmmm oh well what the heck…”

2

And are you satisfied with being only “semi” understood?

Language is important. Consistent use of language ensures consistent communication, especially in a text-only forum such as this. All we have to judge you by are your words. If you are unintelligible, it reflects poorly on you.

Do you wear nice clothes to church?

3

I think that taking issue with someone’s spelling or grammer as part of an argument is an ad hominem attack.

I also am not a great typer. Though I will look up or ask for the spelling of a word most of the time, I don’t usually take the time to proof a post. Frankly, since I never proof my posts, I’m surprised that my posts are not more fucked up.

That said, common spelling errors don’t look very good either, and I try and correct those when I can.

Yer pal,
Satan

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4

Clarification: I agree with Satan. While I consider language to be extremely important, I do not think anyone shoudl be attacked for using it improperly.

5

but all of us misspell or make typos once in a while.

6

Yea ad hominem that’s it. And I do the same thing satan sometimes I get in a hurry and don’t proof read either.

So far two out two agree with me. Yaaa baby.

7

Well, I think that Billy should be happy about that.

:: fleeing for his life ::

Yer pal,
Satan

I HAVE BEEN SMOKE-FREE FOR:
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5834 cigarettes not smoked, saving $729.33.
Extra life with Drain Bead: 2 weeks, 6 days, 6 hours, 10 minutes.

8

Me fail English? That’s unpossible!

A few typos and minor errors are to be expected in this type of forum. I drives me nuts when people get ticked about someole typing “Shoudl” instead of “should.” How cares?

But logical fallacies, they are a different matter. Though there are those who will say that a straw man argument is perfeclty acceptable, I say “Nay!” You are wrong!

9

make it a “qualified” three. We don’t have a spell checker on this, I type fast, therefore, lots o’ spelling errors, some grammatical misplacing of the comma, and one or two run on sentences, if you know what I mean, but I digress.

However. If the debate centers around something along the lines of :

OP: “gads, itt rely burnz me up wen I dont’ git promottted at werk even thogh i hev 7 years seniorititity, and they hir sum new colege grad to be manger evn thogh I kin do eveyting better”,

well, I for one would feel obligated to gently point out one area, at least one area at least that the “colege grad” may have over the OPer…

10

It is the matter of comprehension that is at stake for me. I don’t usually get my knickers in a twist over simple spelling mistakes but I do like punctuation and grammar that is correct ;). When a post is so ill-punctuated and grammatically illiterate that it makes no sense, I won’t put the time in deciphering it.

11

slaps self in forhead “duho” one area, or twice… um, well, you know…

12

Bill, make it one more.

But,

(There is always a but, isn’t there?)

While it is very hard to learn spelling and punctuation from the ground up for every post, there are substitutes. Write your posts in a word processor with spell checking. Cut and past them into the window for the Message Board. Don’t drive yourself nuts or anything, but correct the words you misspell most, and the obvious errors like missing verbs, and sentence fragments. If your language is so complicated that MS Word can’t follow it, chances are you are going to lose some of the audience as well.

Why bother?

OK, why post at all? If you are posting because you want to get your point of view out there, to be heard, and to be answered, then you are best served by having the most communicative style you can muster. You are also likely to be read by more of the forum if your posts are paragraphs, with structure, and sentences that relate in some manner. Being read is part of the goal, right?

I never even read long posts with no paragraph breaks. I know it is considered arrogant by some, but the fact is that I just can’t follow the task of reading well enough without the benefit of the structure. (My eyes are old, and my vision less than perfect, even with glasses.) No, I only point out grammar stuff when the poster himself is a grammar slammer, or the error is one of those which is inherently funny. But I do notice. And the time I spend noticing it is time I don’t spend appreciating the content of the post.

So, the answer is, yes, Grammar nazi’s are idiots, and you should ignore them entirely. But you benefit greatly if your post is couched in more “finished” prose, and minimally correct style.

Tris

13

Nice job, everyone. Including the typos, which I suspect most people left in intentionally!

My ten cents: The message is the important part of whatever you produce. But garbing it in the proper “dress” is simply a courtesy to whomever you’re trying to communicate with.

We’re accustomed to finding capitals at the beginning of sentences, punctuation that divides what is written into bite-size chunks for ease of digestion, and paragraphs that break where thoughts break. They’re customary. The point is that one expects to read clear English prose, with perhaps the occasional typo or spasticated punctuation when it’s online and uneditable by mere mortals. They’re not the be-all and end-all of existence. But if the thought was important enough to post, it was important enough to dress it with the right “clothes” to make a good impression.

Clear writing says, “What you think matters to me, and I am trying my best to reach you and make you see my point.” Stream-of-consciousness gibberish (and we’ve seen some of that!) says, “I am just so cool that everybody should feel honored to read whatever comes out of my fingertips.”

On the other hand, nobody expects perfection – or at least nobody gets it!! Nothing is funnier than someone posting a flame about somebody else’s typing and leaving in a typo of their own. :slight_smile: And if someone is doing his best to express himself and bring his thoughts across to others, and that’s evident online from the context, it’s pretty snitty of anyone to pick on any errors he happens to make. (Note to the PC police: please mentally substitute “or she”/“or her” as necessary throughout this post.)

14

errors that are clearly typos are ignored and realized for what they are yet if someone consistently misspells words especially the same words like grammer and if they don’t use the proper punctuation or if they dont use any puncuation at all including apostrophes then it relfects badly upon themselves i mean cappitalzzatin and spelling and grammer is very important dont you agree moreover proper diction syntax grammer limit the posibality of being misunderstanded

15

I’ve seen “fumblerules” before:

“A preposition is something you should never end a sentence with.”
“Avoid run-on sentences, they are hard to understand.”

But I had never seen a fumblepost until now! LOL – thanks, Barbitu8!! :smiley:

16

There are levels. By order of importance:

Typos are one thing and no one is going to get worked up over that though it is a courtesy to proof read things.

Misspellings and bad punctuation are tad worse but not a capital sin. I would say they do reflect poorly on the writer though because they show lack of courtesy to others. A resume with misspellings would not get past me.

Confusing different words (like accept/except, affect/effect, etc) or using words or expressions mistakenly (I just pointed out in another thread that just about every time I have seen “per se” used in this board it was wrong and often, to make matters worse, spelled “per say”) well, this, to me, is not acceptable. And if the author says “well, you know what I mean” my answer would be “In that case you do not need to tell us and display your ignorance”.

But the worst is not expressing oneself with clarity. Some people can ramble for a long time and leave you wondering WTF they are trying to get to. Last night I saw Politically Incorrect and it was a rerun which wwas done in a prison. Some of the “guests” were inmates and one of them who shouted a lot just had such a muddle in his mind you could not make heads or tails of what he was saying. If you are at that level, then spelling is the least of your problems.

Having clear thoughts and expressing them clearly and concisely is the most important thing. Then knowing the language and the meaning of words and using them correctly. Then spelling correctly and, lastly, avoiding typos and knowing how to present and format documents.

17

I know this is going to be one crazy thread[,] and I [am] going to get bbqed for [it][,] but I am sick of being attacked for my gramm[a]r and spelling mistakes[,] **ecause I don’t think it makes one bit of difference [when] debating a topic (I’ll give my arguments [regarding] that later).

First, some history[:] I hated English in school. I mean I hated it. I think they make this language harder and more complicated than it has to be[;] even my English teacher said this. And I really hated punctuation [–] you know, where commas, semi colons, and crap like that go. Yes, I did make it all the way th[r]ough college and graduated(surprised[?] [A]nd no I am not an aggie), but then I had some bad drug years which probably ruined my memory of gramm[a]r (and kept me from reading many books[,] as I should have[,] goboy)[,] so sometimes I forget things and mess up with my writing as many of you intellectual gramm[a]r nerds suckers have pointed out many times.

So here is my argument [for why proper use of grammar doesn’t matter when] debating. As long as you can be semicomprehended by the person reading your post, th[e]n gramm[a]r should not be an issue for [him or her] to attack. I understand that[, when] debating[, it is] your mission to build up your argument while tearing down your oppone[n]t[’]s[,] and I am cool with that. *t seems to me [that] when somebody attacks your English it is called one of those terms for debating[,] something like ["]ad homin attack["] (the one that means they have nothing to say of substance so they just pick something lame to attack your oppone[n]t with). (I am sure If I got that wrong someone will jab into me[;] go for it[,] but[,] frankly[,] I just don’t care)

Back to my argument[:] some of the smarter people here use quite a bit of foul language all the time. I have read somewhere (now somebody is going to want a cite for that comment[,] huh[?]) that if you use foul language in a debate [it] is a sign of weak debating skills also. Personally I don’t think that is a true statement either, so I don’t care if you do (use foul language to express yourself[,] other than taking the Lord’s name in vain). But what I am saying [is:] no one should attack my gramm[a]r as a weakness in a debate we are having if you use curse words in your post. Fair enough?

This [is] something I [have] been want[ing] to complain about for a long time, wishing I could say “bitching.”

[(]Thinking to myself “do I really want all the grief this post is going to cause me down the line if I hit the submit new thread button…hmmm oh well what the heck…”[)]

Come on, admit it: all of you were just dying to do that.

Seriously, though: I think WB is right. Good grammar in a debate is nice, but it’s hardly necessary. The exchange of ideas is what matters; proper grammar mearly greases the wheels.

It’s going to be really embarrasing when someone corrects my grammar here. . .

18

Really shoulda used “Preview Reply”. . .

19

Too funny Varloz, LOL. You are not a English teacher are you?

Also the mispelling of the word “grammar” in the title was just a joke(me wondering to myself if they bought that lame excuse for mispelling it. Maybe not I’ll try this one to explain it away) Down her in Tehas that’s Texas for yer yankee fellas. We spell grammer with an “e” because that’s the way we er say it down here in this part of the country. :smiley:

20

I’ll chime in. It’s better if you use proper grammer and spelling. However, as long as the message is completely, not semi-understood. It’s ok. And if you don’t use proper grammer, don’t be surprised if people ask you what the ell you are jabbering about.