I don’t recall claiming in this thread that the US – or any other country-- had the best legal system.
If I made such a claim, please show it to me.
I am not sure what you mean by “web design and technologies” or how they can be measured. I work in the telecomm field and have just returned from the Broadband trade show in Brussels. The USA is not first in any category I can think of. Look at broadband subscribers for instance. In absolute numbers Europe is ahead and China is bound to pass the USA this year. In subscribers per capita the USA is #6 behind South Korea, UK, Canada, Germany and France. In growth it is #4 behind China, Germany and France.
Broadband subscribers
2007 2008 population lines/1000 pop Growth %
South Korea 14.4 15.3 48.2 31.7 6.3
UK 14.5 16.7 61.2 27.3 15.2
Canada 8.1 9.0 33.4 26.9 11.1
Germany 17.6 21.8 82.2 26.5 23.9
France 14.2 16.7 64.5 25.9 17.6
USA 66.2 76.9 305.3 25.2 16.2
Japan 27.2 29.4 127.7 23.0 8.1
Italy 9.9 11.5 59.6 19.3 16.2
Spain 7.6 8.6 46.1 18.7 13.2
China 59.5 76.0 1326.4 5.7 27.7
Broadband subscribers
2007 2008 population lines/1000 pop Growth %
China 59.5 76.0 1326.4 5.7 27.7
Germany 17.6 21.8 82.2 26.5 23.9
France 14.2 16.7 64.5 25.9 17.6
USA 66.2 76.9 305.3 25.2 16.2
Italy 9.9 11.5 59.6 19.3 16.2
UK 14.5 16.7 61.2 27.3 15.2
Spain 7.6 8.6 46.1 18.7 13.2
Canada 8.1 9.0 33.4 26.9 11.1
Japan 27.2 29.4 127.7 23.0 8.1
South Korea 14.4 15.3 48.2 31.7 6.3
Source: http://www.telecommagazine.com/newsglobe/article.asp?HH_ID=AR_4498
Sopurce for population figures: wikipedia
I believe results would be similar for phone lines, etc. Contrary to what many people think China is already a bigger market than the USA in some telecomm sectors and they are already setting standards of their own rather than just always following western standards.
I find most of the time people’s perceptions of their own and of other countries are 20~30 years out of date. Most Americans still have a notion that the USA is way above were it actually is in most aspects of the economy. America is nowhere near being the telecomm giant it once was and the telecomm giants are now Chinese and European before American.
I agree that having put people on the moon is an extraordinary achievement by the USA. Their nationality is absolutely irrelevant though.
Having said and agreed that it is a great achievement I also believe that a nation who can do that has a greater obligation and responsibility to provide for its people than a nation who is dirt poor.
Ok, how about this then…the US is the leading (developed) country in realizing that the gov’t job isn’t to provide for its citizens things they can provide for themselves.
Seriously. Quit claiming other countries are better for being more socialized. That’s not a proper metric for “leading” anything. Secondly, how exactly is the nationality of our astronauts irrelevant? Would it be better if it was phrased “US leads in putting humans on the moon”? It’s true. It fits the OP. Please, oh please, come back and tell me this factoid’s version of “So? No one cares about that/it’s not socialized enough/they used imported products!”
I’m gonna go way out on a limb here and guess that the USA does in fact provide for its citizens far better than any “dirt poor” nation.
It’s called ‘design’. Apple is in California for instance.
The point I was trying to make is that a nation who has put humans on the moon arguably has a certain responsibility to provide for its people better than other nations who have not spent such huge amounts on something of that type. It is just a general statement subject to much analysis and qualifiers. Nothing absolute.
And I am not defending “socialist” policies or any other policies nor saying other countries are better because of them. This thread is about in what aspects the USA leads other countries. There are some aspects which are more easily quantifiable like prison population per capita and which can easily be compared with other countries but there are also other factors which are less easy to measure and more subject to interpretation. In any case, the thread is, inherently, a comparison between the USA and the rest of the countries of the world.
Whether more or less government intervention in certain aspects is a good or a bad thing might be a subject of opinion but I find it difficult to argue with certain facts like the USA having a much higer prison population than other countries or shorter life expectancy. i cannot see how a higher prison population or a shorter life expectancy can be spinned into positives. If less government is a plus regardless of the consequences then I suppose Somalia these days must be as close to perfection as you can get.
Fine. And the US does in fact provide for its citizens better than poor countries. That was my point.
According to this list, life expectancy in the United States is greater than in Denmark, Ireland, Portugal, South Africa, Poland, India, and China.
As far as prison population goes, I would say that it’s good we have the resources to imprison a lot of those people rather than have them out on the street committing crimes. Certainly in comparing our crime rates to other industrialized countries, it would be appropriate to use race-normalized figures.
And if fewer prisoners is a plus regardless of the consequences, then I suppose that Haiti is the pinacle of the Western Hemisphere.
But in many cases not better than countries which did not put a human on the moon which was my point and the point you were responding to.
Since the USA is #45 down in that list and there are many countries which do better I fail to see how the USA leads in that list.
Well, the fact is that the USA leads in prison population. If you want to consider that a good thing that is your privilege. I would consider a country which has less crime and therefore fewer people in prison as more successful in providing for the social integration and happiness of its people. But if you want to consider having a large prison population as a measure of success then the USA is wildly successful in that regard.
Or Somalia. Don’t forget Somalia.
No, you didn’t - but you were getting involved in a silly to-and-fro that was dereailing the thread. Oh, wait. You’re brazil84 and derailing threads is pretty much all you ever do. Silly me.
Just as a matter of fact I will point out that the USA has an incarceration rate of 738 / 100,000 while the rate in other similarly developed countries is mostly under 150 / 100,000 so the USA has an incarceration rate which is roughly between five and ten times as that of other similarly developed countries.
Even China has a much lower rate.
That’s nonsense. The exchange you responsed to had been quiet for quite a while.
Anyway, I’m not a moderator so I don’t have the ability to warn or ban people, but personal insults are against my own rules of debate. From now on, I will not read or respond to your posts except, now and then, to explain why I am not doing so.
Bye.
I have my own rules of debate here
Obviously I don’t have the ability to warn or ban anyone, but I do have the ability to choose who I will not engage with.
Rule 2 is “no weaseling,” which means that you can’t pretend to have said something you didn’t say.
The point you made which I responded to is this:
And now you say this:
You quietly removed the “dirt poor” qualifier without acknowledging it in any way – classic weaseling.
Please acknowledge this change and I will respond to that and your other points. Thank you.
And I have my ass right here should you wish to kiss it.
You have distorted what I said so I will not read you posts any more but you may beg for my forgiveness and I may reconsider. Kissing my ass would be a good start.
I am not a moderator although I have been mistaken for one during presidential debates. A lot of people kiss my ass; you might want to join them.
Bye.
Do you know anything about Germany, seriously? What are you on about?
Germany is a part of the European Union. As part of that union it allows (or will allow) the free movement of citizens from any of the other 26 states. Although it has had complex citizenship laws it has also absorbed a huge number of non-EU immigrants, primarily from Turkey but also from many other countries. Over 12% of Germany’s population is foreign born (Cite)
I don’t agree that using per capita or share of GNI/GDP is relevant. We are the top in charity and humanitarian aid in total $.
Think about it. If US gives $1 billion in aid to Sudan, and Sweden gives $1 million, who has helped Sudan more? Should Sudan look at the US’s contribution with scorn?
And if China antes up with $1 trillion, should we look down on it, simply because they are more populous?
As a matter of judging the moral character of a people I believe per capita or as a fraction of per capita national product is the only way to go. Absolute numbers are meaningless.
If each state gives an amount separately does it become better if it is aggregated into a single sum? If each European nation gives separately do they become better if they pool the total into a single sum? That’s just silly. In any case, as has been said, Europeans give more than Americans anyway.
As for prison population, the Master speaks: “The U.S. certainly doesn’t have the highest incarceration rate in world history, and depending on whose figures you believe may not even have the highest rate now. However, to be honest, we’re more competitive than you might care to hear.”
That the USA does not have the highest incarceration rate in history is probably true, probably also unprovable and kind of silly to sayn because the comparison would be meaningless. I would even say the comparison, to be meaningful, would have to be with countries in the present and in a similar situation of development and other factors.
Every source I see coincides that it has the highest rate today (the question asked in the OP is not historical but at present).