Actually, he sounds like a friend of mine who has 3 dwi convictions. I wouldn’t say he is an alcoholic. But, he probably goes from zero to asshole in 3 drinks. The last time I saw my friend intoxicated, he left the lights on in his truck, ended up with food all over the outside of his apartment, and one of his shoes at the foot of the steps leading up to his apartment. When he drinks, he gets really messed up.
Put me in the “definitely an alcoholic” category. If he didn’t have an alcohol problem, he would simply quit after all of the legal issues that it has caused.
Just because alcohol is something that goody two shoes Christian people frown upon make us want to put it up on a pedestal to defend it.
Imagine if your life was relatively normal except that when you drank a Cherry Coke you went wild, raped women, and destroyed property. You would just stop drinking Cherry Coke, right? What would it say about your relationship with Cherry Coke it you didn’t/couldn’t stop drinking it?
Is the kid otherwise a good kid? If so, what other possible reason could there be? If he is not otherwise a fuckwit, but only becomes one when alcohol is involved, what is the common factor here? 
Many people live in the land of denial and I’m not talking about the river.
Some of the older people who have experience with alcoholism may remember a story. When you used to go to your doctor to see if you had a problem with alcoholism, and the doc says try drinking just two drinks a night and see how that affects you…if you can’t do that without wanting more, and more then maybe try abstaining for a while. If you can’t do that…then perhaps you have a problem.
This is such an individual thing here. Usually, the only person who can tell you if you are an alcoholic or not is you.
I had a friend who, when we were both in our early twenties, got three DUI’s in fairly rapid succession (within two years, I think). I don’t think he was an alcoholic then, and definitely not now; he still drinks occasionally, but not to excess and never before driving.
However, he did get a triplet of DUI’s while others—his roommates and friends, and at times, I confess, myself—also drove drunk and were never apprehended. I attributed it partly to blind luck, and partly to the fact that he tended to drive carelessly/aggressively even while sober, and doubly so when buzzed. A long-haired cop magnet, as it were.
The kid in the OP may or may not be a true alcoholic, but the state has a limited number of tools to apply to a wide spectrum of situations. At any rate, I don’t feel the slightest bit of sympathy for whatever he has to undergo as a result of his actions.
This, I suppose, is what I was clumsily trying to say. As such, I really believe that there’s no point in trying to force this person into treatment against his will. It won’t work.
What should be done is to take away his right to drive. Remove the threat to society and let him worry about his drinking problem, if any.
The problem is that its difficult to define “alcoholic” - one definintion is “does drinking cause you problems in your life.” If the reprocussions of drinking are causing him to take time to sit in a room and take treatment classes, the answer to that one, at least, is yes.
It is completely possible that this young man may get over this young excess and have many years of drinking socially with no ill effects - in which case, he probably isn’t an alcoholic as most people understand the term. I’m betting money on “drinking problem” and that this is more severe than young excess, though.
In many states it’s the same offense with a different name, but in Texas those are two different offenses. DWI is the drunk driving offense, operating a motor vehicle with a BAC of .08 or while otherwise impaired by a drug, alcohol, or some combination. DUI is when a minor operates a motor vehicle with any detectable amount of alcohol in his or her system. DUI is less serious, it’s a class C offense like a traffic ticket until the minor gets their third one.
Not sure if three DWI convictions makes you an alcoholic, but here it makes you a felon. A third conviction is a third degree felony.
I got a DUI in Minnesota in 1995. After getting nailed to that cross, I learned my lesson. Even over a decade ago, the punishment was pretty tough and very expensive, and multiple offenders had it even tougher. I’m certain the penalties have only increased.
He must be a damn good gambler, because that’s a damn expensive habit.
Insanity is sometime defined as doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. I think alcoholism could be defined in a similar fashion. He’s either an alky or monumentally stupid.
I guess I should have been more clear–this class is by far not his only penalty. He’s been in the workhouse and on house arrest and lost his driver’s license for a long long time. He no longer owns a vehicle. He also has, according to his mother, not had a drink since February.
His mom told me about their second class that they had last night. Apparently, there was a lot of talk about how the brain works and getting your brain back into healthy patterns of thinking which actually seemed to get through to him. I sure hope so.
That sounds like pure AA BS to me. Hopefully, they’ll teach him more than just the AA party line.
I disagree. Whether or not he’s an alcoholic is arguable; however, he is most certainly an Asshole.
I’m not sure what the point is of the mother not wanting to call her son an alcoholic; it really is a testament to what Busy Scissors was talking about that apparently there is a stigma attached to being an alcoholic that isn’t attached to having three DWIs (but there should be).
Exactly.
IMO, the stigma should work the other way around! Admitting your an alcoholic is the HUGE first step. Seems to me that having 3 DUIs is a person in serious denial about his drinking. Which is more shameful (if shame is to enter into it)? The latter, IMO.
I’d say that two (in a reasonable period of time, say a decade) makes you into a problem drinker, with a very high % of being an alcoholic. Certainly, as eleanorigby sez, he’s in denial.
Of course it depends on your definition of “alcoholic”.
Actually, the AA position on this issue has been backed up be recent research on how addiction is centred on brain chemistry. Here’s a quote from a Time article from last year How We Get Addicted :
I seem to recall our esteemed Qadgop posting similar information in a thread about alcoholism a few years ago - that it can take up to a year for the brain chemistry to right itself after an addict stops using. I’ll see if I can find it - or perhaps he’ll come by himself.
True dat. When I got my DUI way back in 1990, I estimated that I had literally driven drunk a thousand times before I got caught. I was a bar drinker, so driving myself home almost every night for 3 years or so added up to around a thousand. :eek:
Which part? The brain chemistry part or the fact that it actually got through to him that you think is AA bullshit?
It must be AA BS if is appearing to help the young lad. :rolleyes:
I have read the AA book and been in meetings for lo these 17 years, and never heard brain chemistry discussed except by folks having coffee… The “doctor’s opinion” in the book is, I think, an actual doctor’s opinion, rather than “AA bullshit”… 
I think this, and QtM’s post, are the critical issues.
I mean, honestly, what are the chances of being caught while driving drunk unless you actually crash your car? One in a hundred? Less?
Three DWIs don’t prove you’re an alcoholic, but if I had to bet fifty bucks either way I would bet the young man has an alcohol problem. It’s just so exceedingly unlikely that you could rack up three DWIs WITHOUT being an alcoholic that it’s overwhewlmingly likely this woman, if not her whole family, is in denial or doesn’t grasp just how bad her son’s drinking is.