Dog ethics question

In My Humble Opinion
1

So I was out walking my pit bull last night. Pit bulls are a restricted breed in Ontario, which means (among other things) that:

  • they must be fixed (which is perfectly reasonable, as far as I’m concerned, all dogs should be fixed unless there’s a very good reason not to), and
  • any ones born after August 2005 are “illegal” and vets are obliged by law to report them if they see them. (perfectly UNreasonable, in my opinion; sick and injured dogs are the most dangerous!)

Now, not to be falsely modest, my dog is very pretty. He is big and well-proportioned and attractive and a lot of people comment on it. He’s a “red nose,” which I am led to understand is somewhat of a unique breeding line. Note that I couldn’t care less about this, he’s a great pet and that’s all I want. But lots of sketchy people like him because he’s so tough-looking.

We encountered a man with another pit bull, a red nose like mine but smaller and darker in colour. He asked me if mine was fixed, I said “yes” (assuming that he was asking in case his dog was the sort that fought with unfixed dogs) and then I noticed that his dog had big swoolen nipples, she had clearly just been bred.

He expressed disappointment that mine was fixed, because if he wasn’t, we could have bred them and made lots of money with the pups.

I tried to contain my horror (our dogs were getting along very well, it was quite sweet).

And then he tried to SELL me a puppy!

(now, remember, this puppy, as well as any others that came out of that dog, would be ILLEGAL, which means you can’t take it to an ethical vet.)

I was so startled I didn’t know what to do. We went on our way, and I immediately started kicking myself for not offering to buy a pup so I could get his number and turn him over to the proper authorities. But then I thought twice about that too.

Considerations: It seems likely that he is going to breed that dog to death, as he seemed to treat her as a cash cow.

However, “the authorities” would almost certainly put the dog to death as well - they don’t make a lot of efforts to re-home pit bulls these days, especially ones that have been treated as brood sows.

Also, I am quite chicken, and not usually the sort to lie/entrap people. I’d be hugely nervous to pull a scam such as pretending to be interested in buying a puppy. (Especially since if I actually SAW the puppy I would be heartbroken, knowing it would be put down …)

Dog lovers, what would you have done? If I see him again, what should I do?

2

Get his name and take a picture with a camera phone or digi camera and turn him in. I do not think that you are the type to take care of him yourself so let the authorities do it. In the long run, you will be doing pit bulls a bigger favor than letting him keep doing what he is doing.

( Could he be unaware of the new law? )

Going to lose some pups anyway and better to do those things that will be most helpful for all in the long run.

Can you or do you know anyway to ship dogs out of the country legally so those already born can be saved? If not, just stop this guy.

YMMV

3

Anyone who uses his pets as a “cash cow” does not treat them as they should be. Pregnancy puts a lot of stress on the body of an animal, and constant breeding is not good for their health and decreases their lifespan. Not only that, but he’s going to contribute to the reasons that pits are probably restricted; they (and a lot of other breeds) are just bred with no regard to how the person who buys it will treat it or use it. I say report him if you see him again.

Sorry, irresponsible backyard breeders irk me to no end. Its a thing.

4

I don’t know, you seem to assume be making some assumptions. I think most people that use their dogs as “cash cows” don’t take them for nice evening walks. He may be from out of town, visiting with his dog. Breeding dogs isn’t necessarily a bad thing, only irresponsible breeding. So if the guy was from Michigan and would be able to place all the puppies in loving homes, why not breed them? Of course, he could’ve said that he lived on the next street over and was breeding dogs to fight, which would be a Very Bad Thing Indeed.

StG

5

If the owner is proposing to breed his bitch to a dog just because it’s the same breed and he happened to run into them on the street, without knowing any details about the health or temperament of the stud dog, IMO that is clearly irresponsible breeding.

6

When you make owning pit bulls criminal, only criminals will have pit bulls.

7

That’s quite unlikely. It has been very big news in Ontario for awhile. Particularly when it came into effect.

The guy sounds like a cretin.

8

I know a woman that got a rescue dog that could not even walk when she got it. The people had just kept her in a cage used her for breeding. She had gotten to weak to even walk. The dog only had a few teeth left and could not even keep her tongue in her mouth.

The dog is doing much better today, but will still probably die young. She is only seven, but looks at least 11 or 12.

9

I must know how, absent a breeding history, anyone can say that a particular dog is a pit bull?

10

It’s reverse onus - if your dog is suspected of being a pit bull, you have to prove that it is NOT.

(Just one of the myriad stupidities involved with this stupid law.)

Because it’s illegal for them to exist in this province, because they were born after Aug 2005. As I understand it, vets can be prosecuted for not reporting them. So anyone who knowingly buys such a pup in this province is by definition a bad owner - how can you buy a pup that you can’t get proper medical attention for?

11

They’ve got a distinct look. Granted, people often confuse Am. Bulldogs and Staffies as pits, but usually any vet worth their money can distinguish between them.

12

Am Staffs and Staffies are considered “pit bulls” (along with American Pit Bull Terriers) for the purpose of the ban. It really is impossible to determine. There’s this and this and this kind of thing, which even vets and “animal experts” are really bad at. Also - what about a pit bull mix? How much “pit bull” does it take in a mix to make a pit bull?

13

I would suggest you find a pitbull rescue in the area. They may be able to work with the police to get the dog away from the animal, but they would then fix it and place it in the right hands. If I where in your shoes, (and more proactive then I tend to be) I would call/email a rescue and ask ‘hypothetically’ what would happen in this situation. If they would do what I think they would do, then give them the info on how to find the guy. (Get a red nosed pit bull and walk down such and such a street and you’ll probably bump into him sooner or later). If they say they would put the dog down, then…well it’s up to you.

14

Around here they recommend that when you first go to the vet with a pit/other undesirable dog mix that you ask that they put the breed as the “better half” of the mix. Pit/sharpei? Its a sharpei. We don’t have a breed ban though, so I don’t know how picky they would be there. Most people around here are students who live in apartments, and even the dog friendly ones don’t allow certain breeds. This can get the dog in the apartment. Apparently the vets register the breeds with the county, so according to the county, that dog is a sharpei.

15

I don’t know ANYTHING about this place, but I found it googling Pit Bull Rescue Ontario

http://pbrc.net/webapp/cgi-bin/organization_detail.cgi/a47eb61727ee616a2bde9dddca1c2803?id=518

BTW, if you want, I can drop and email to my aunt, she runs a doberman rescue in illinois, she might have some insight about your situation.

16

Replace animal with owner.

17

Sigh
replace and with an.

18

I am sure that you are telling me the truth, but this is incoherent. Breeds are determined by sanctioning bodies, who rely upon two necessary criteria: adherence to a breed standard, and proof of lineage, the latter being the more important of the two. Absent a pedigree, there is no way to determine if a dog is a particular breed, although non-adhgerence to the breed standard can rule a dog out.

Aunt Flow, please see above.

19

I remember hearing that argument before and not liking it in the context of that other thread either. It if quacks like a duck and walks like a duck, it is a duck. I don’t care if it doesn’t have the Holy Blessing from the Vaticanine or if it can’t claim title to the crown because it doesn’t have royal lineage.

If you have a champion pit bull and burn the papers, it is still a pit bull.

20

Prove it.