Also, back in the glory days of software stores like Egghead and Babbages and the like, you had a section for PC games. And a section for Commodore games. A separate section for Amiga games. A section for Mac games and a section for Apple II games. A section for Tandy games, etc. The “PC” section isn’t really smaller, it’s just surrounded by XBox360, PS3, Wii, DS/DSi, whatever else games that get homogeneously called “consoles” that seemingly outnumber the PC games by a vast margin.
Blizzard statement says:
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We sold 3.5 million copies day 1.
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We also, on top of that saw 1.2 million WOW user who signed up for a new contract load up Diablo 3 (which came free with that contract).
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For the week, SALES, number 6.3 million. Not counting South Korea (and actually a few other territories).
No where there does it say that the 6.3 actually count the freebies from WOW accounts. In fact, they seperate them when giving out the original numbers.
Also, the licensing for the games does not work they way you think it does in South Korea, which is why they SPECIFICALLY say those numbers do not include the money they make from there.
You really are dead set on putting down anything on the PC platform aren’t? Even making shit up is right up your alley. ANYTHING to bring it down a peg.
The hell why?
I’m sorry, I thought we were talking about the software market.
I had no idea what we were actually tlaking abouit is your local Gamestop.
My bad.
Not enough of these: :rolleyes: in the entire freeking world.
Age of Conan? Star Wars Galaxies? Shadowbane? Vanguard? Rift? Warhammer Online? Tabula Rasa? It’d be easier to list the MMOs that HAVEN’T failed. Heck, LotRO only saved itself by going free to play. Aion is trying to do the same.
“Different demographics” is an excuse? Next thing you know, not selling a game on a platform will be an ‘excuse’. And yay, I knew I couldn’t get away with insulting myself in this thread without getting called on it. Woo.
But I’m NOT saying those things, which is exactly what you’re missing. Every example I have been giving has been in an attempt to show just how MUCH room there potentially is for PC gaming to grow if it were actually as easy as consoles. Do you DENY that PC gaming would do BETTER if PCs were exactly as easy to game on as consoles? Simple question, sir.
Certainly. Do you have a more reliable source other than one press release for a PC only title?
It’s what you’ve been unwitting arguing this entire thread, because my ONLY POINT is that PC gaming gives enough people enough trouble that they pick consoles instead. Go back and read my VERY FIRST STATEMENT on this issue. Heck, here, I’ll save you the trouble:
“it would be a lot more successful than it is.”
Do we both understand what that means? Because it sure sounds like you’re attacking the “PC gaming is dead/inferior/meaningless/somethingnegative” strawman here when, in reality, I don’t CARE, and all I am doing is making a simple, factual statement that the difficulties involved in PC gaming drive some people away. I note with amusement that you’ve chosen not to answer my “which reasons do you think people might not pick PC games” question.
I AM a PC gamer. I AM someone who had a nerdy childhood and is now entirely at home on the PC. I AM a major consumer of indie games. But I am ALSO a console gamer. I do not believe PC gaming is dying, though I do believe that “core games” on all platforms are due for a ‘correction’ sometime in the next few years, because everyone wants to be CoD or Diablo, budgets are ballooning, and it’s getting harder and harder for AAA titles that AREN’T CoD or Dialbo to turn a profit.
So if you’d take a minute off from attacking anyone who sounds vaguely like they think PC gaming is “not doing as well as it humanly possibly could” then maybe you’d realize that you are, in fact, making a bit of a fool of yourself when no one is actually arguing with you.
What the heck is a “software store”? 
I haven’t seen a physical store dedicated to “software” in over a decade - the last one I remember was an Electronics Boutique, and Wikipedia says they rebranded themselves to “EBGames” in the year 2000.
BlinkingDuck used the term which is why I asked. Once the home computer market shook out to PC and the tiny Mac segment, I don’t recall any stores filled with PC games. They replaced the old Commodore/Apple/etc sections with Nintendo, Sega and the rest.
Failures in what way? That they aren’t as popular as WOW?
I don’t know personally the exact situation for all of these. I know maybe one was a true failure were the studio broke up because of it, but I don’t think not being super popular, or ending after a few years, necessarily means they were failures.
Age of Conan made money. It’s still running and still making money. Just because it’s not raking in a billion dollars a month doesn’t mean it’s a failure.
Also, consider how many studios have gon broke making simple single player console games?
Failure is a part of the industry. Not sure why you are singling out MMO’s.
Ok, then let’s stop right here. Maybe I misinterpreted your position.
I do agree that making PC gaming more accessible would be a good thing.
And I think services like Steam, and new hardware like AMD’s APU’s ARE making it more and more accessible.
But accessibility is only part of the picture. Some of the things that make PC gaming so much better than console gaming are either technical, or hard to convince a largely ignorant market are worth the investment.
I think it’s written confusingly, but I think you’re reading it wrong. Here are the relevant sections of the PR:
The question is, what does “that number” in the second paragraph refer to? I think the clearest referent is to the number “4.7 million gamers” in the first paragraph, especially given their caveat that the figures “do not include players in Korean Internet game rooms.” In other words, they’re not discussing sales in their 6.3 million figure; they’re discussing people playing the game, a very slight difference.
But a crucial one: the people who got the free copy with an annual pass are included in the folks playing the game.
I’m not clear on the business model for the game rooms. How does that work? Does the proprietor buy a copy of the game per normal? How does the proprietor compensate Blizzard for multiple players? Obviously each player would be using a different account. I suspect that this whole business model isn’t included in their figures at all, not under sales or under players, but I really don’t know enough about the model to say.
Hmmm, there Is an asterisk after the 6.3 million, and its footnotes says:
- Based on internal company records and reports from key distribution partners.
So again. Not too clear.
I suspect it’s a moot point because it’s probably already sold another million units since the press release anyway.
I don’t know how the Korean cafe’s compensate Blizzard. I do know that the players pay for “game time” at those places.
Hmm, do I calmly wait for an apology or do I rub it in your face that you’re wrong?
Since I’m not the raving lunatic you think I am, I’ll just wait for an apology.
Uh, if that were the criteria, it would include every MMO that isn’t WoW, so no.
I’m mostly listing “MMOs that are dead (no longer running) or dying (very small subscriber base) and which didn’t/probably won’t recoup the fairly large initial investment”.
That depends on how much money they sunk into making it.
Oddly, I can’t remember a single, high-profile company. Lots of little studios, but no failures on the other of the huge investment MMO schemes.
Because they cost so much to implement, were being considered the “next big thing”, and because they seem to have a much higher than average failure rate. Not saying no one else ever fails, but MMOs fail a LOT.
What’s the APU? I’m not familiar with it. Steam is definitely a big help, though I personally have one frustrated acquaintance who had a lot of problems playing her one Steam game offline. =/
What sort of technical things are you alluding to? Just better visuals/performance? As for “worth the investment” aren’t you the one who’s constantly maintaining that you can get/build/something an adequate gaming PC for less than the price of a console? Or is that someone else?
Off the cuff, I’d guess “technical” includes mods for various games. Compare the experience you can have with Skyrim or Dragon Age on the PC versus consoles.
What is it that makes the WoW annual prepurchase not valid Diablo sale? I doubt that many people are making a yearly commitment to a dying MMO just because they love that MMO - they want diablo. And if they’re spending $150 or whatever on a WoW annual pass, if that option wasn’t available, you could safely assume that most of them would just buy the $60 diablo. Additionally, blizzard obviously feels that the income they’re getting on this deal is enough to offset the income from buying a copy of diablo. So why is this diablo-related influx of cash not as good as a diablo sale and doesn’t deserve to count?
Additionally, I’ve heard, but can not confirm, that asian netcafe services usually have some sort of rental/licensing/leasing agreements with the big games for their cafes rather than buying a lot of individual copies, so I wouldn’t be surprised if that doesn’t show up in the purchase counts.
Because that’s how Blizzard worded it: “We sold 3.5 million copies and gave away another 1.2 million to Annual Pass subscribers.” If Blizzard doesn’t consider those copies “sold,” I think it makes sense to use their wording.
A site license does make a lot of sense for a “game room” location.
Hmmm. And speaking of MMOs, I hear 38 studios was supposed to be making one. 
Apparently Kingdoms of Amalur needed to sell 3 million in order to break even.
I doubt they spent that much on development, unless they had a team of a few hundred working that game.
Probably spent it all in marketing to try and get console gamers to pay attention… since that’s the only way they’ll buy games, if you spend a few hundred million on TV adds.
We know you want to blame consoles for this, but lets face it, the high profile PC MMO was the main cause of death according to their own mouths; Since they indicate that, at the very least, 49.8 million of their loan was used to fund development on that, and unlike KoA, it has generated exactly zero revenue to date.
Mismanagement? Sure. But they probably could’ve done better if they’d picked a less ambitious project.
I love older games too. But if that’s what you’re into, you can’t really comment much on the modern state of gaming, since you don’t apparently know much about it. There’s so much choice today that it’s unreal, if there’s a kind of game you want to play, I can guarantee it’s out there somewhere. If it’s old school pac-man/space invaders style games, they’re there. If it’s Zelda style games you’re after, they’re still being made (the game type- not just the franchise). Chrono Trigger? Plenty to choose from.
It’s strange how one person’s experience with PC gaming can so wildly differ from another. I have never in my life spent hours tweaking a computer to make a game work. I don’t think others who enjoy PC games have either.
Oh, I tell a lie, I once spent an hour making Thief 2 work with Windows 7, but that’s to be expected - that’s like putting a PS1 game in a PS3, it’s always going to bit hit and miss whether it works or not (and more often than not doesn’t). The good thing is, Steam has versions of them for very cheap (I picked it up for £3 the other day of Steam) and they work flawlessly.
GOG is also fantastic for older games. No matter what compatibility modes we use with our PCs sometimes they just don’t work. But GOG has tons of the golden oldies made compatible for modern OS’s. It truly is wonderful and painless.
PC gaming is not dying and was never dying in the first place. The fact is that it cannot die, it’s truly impossible for that to ever happen. Every console out there will die, and every console that has ever been released has died (the definition being - no longer being developed for - that’s not to say people don’t still use them). But I still love console gaming. It’s just the nature of the beast means every version has a limited lifespan. That’s fine, you have to upgrade your PC at a similar rate (not quite so much nowadays if you’re sensible with what you buy).
But, the point is, everybody needs a PC (I include Macs in this definition). Everybody will always own a PC, even if it’s a tablet (though I don’t see the market fully moving away from laptops and desktops). If people own these machines, developers will make games for them.
And clearly the market is big enough for developers to continue porting over their console games. I’ll be downloading Max Payne 3 from Steam in June, even though I own a PS3 and and Xbox 360. The reason? The Steam version can be downloaded indefinitely. It has superior graphics and framerate. There is no disc to crack. And my PC doesn’t have quite the same fail rate as my Xbox.
And (trying to get this thread back on track, as it wasn’t supposed to be about whether PC games are dying or are better or whatever) this is what the OP was asking about. For better or worse, download only games are slowly creeping up and replacing disc games. I personally don’t like it (as I have said, my internet connection sucks and probably always will*, and I’m also cynical enough to believe that servers won’t always exist as well), but I see it as inevitable.
*because I’m a cheap bastard and get my internet from a business across the parking lot that lets me do so after they gave me their password for their secure wifi
I don’t really think the industry cares abotu people like you.
Honestly, if you are so cheap that you’d rather use shoddy freebie wifi from your neighbor over paying to get internet to your home, how much are you going to be willing to spend on video games?
If you are so cheap that you’d rather get your car’s oil changed by some sketchy guy down at the vacant lot, how much are you going to be willing to spend on sports tickets?
Really? And you were accusing me of insulting people?
I’d argue that while you’re probably right that segments of the industry have given up on people with poor quality internet, I think it’s completely unrealistic to correlate “so cheap as to be willing to make due with dubious internet” (when, let’s face it, if you’re not downloading big files or playing games that require a constant connection, most of the time, it doesn’t REALLY matter if your internet drops for a minute. My internet could drop for the entire time it takes me to write this, and as long as it’s back before I hit “Submit Reply” it’ll never make any difference.) with “unwilling to spend meaningful amounts of money on single player entertainment”.
If I had to guess, I’d suggest that if any segment of the industry is ignoring people like srzss05 with their bold march towards download only content, it’s because the number of people with sketchy internet is small enough for them to write off in light of other gains, not because they wouldn’t be losing any revenue from those people.
Probably. Face it, the ratio of boxed retail copies sent to Walmart vs digital download keys is going to be whatever’s most profitable for the company. Boxed retail copies incur costs for the discs, plastic clamshells, the box, the art design, the scraps of paper within, the trucks to move them, etc. Digital downloads have none of that. The more popular downloads become, the more the publisher can decide the boxed costs aren’t worth it and the “missed” sales aren’t worth the hassle. We’re not there yet but I wouldn’t doubt that we’re heading in that direction.