Season 4 just started shooting.
As usual, The Dowager was the best part of the episodes last night. The interchange when she informs Rose that she’s being packed off to Scotland with Aunt Agatha (or cousin, I can’t remember) was awesome.
As for the rest of them - Tom is entirely too settled and not conflicted enough with this new life. I liked that he had respect for his new in-laws but I do hope some of his politics comes back into play. I don’t quite buy that he’d give his heart into running the very type of estate he was (if a bit vaguely) trying to burn down a few months ago. Mary & Matthew are boring me and Mary is one of my favorite characters. Anna and Bates, likewise, except I liked snarky Bates until he decided to help Thomas. I’m glad he did help Thomas though because right now, Thomas is the most interesting person on the estate being not the nicest person but human in the way he can care for some people (even those he doesn’t lust over) and has some self-awareness. Yes, he’s ambitious and nasty at times, especially with his dealings with Bates and Daisy at the beginning and a coward when in the army but deep down you feel like he is very lonely and really does want approval and friendship of others without knowing how to go about it. To bad he couldn’t continue work in a hospital or something that would give him a little more pride than dusting off some goofy lord’s suit.
That seemed really out of place. There was very little wrong with the story itself*, but that’s not generally been the way this particular tv show has worked. People don’t drop in from nowhere, have a wacky adventure, and then press the reset button as far as the main characters are concerned at the end of the episode. Other characters who have wandered in and out in the course of an episode at least theoretically had an impact.
*the part that seemed slightly wrong was that her father (who may or may not have been closely related to the Dowager Countess) had a job of some sort. It didn’t make sense that they would have been so shocked at Matthew’s being a lawyer if they already had a close family member who worked.
[QUOTE=amarinth]
*the part that seemed slightly wrong was that her father (who may or may not have been closely related to the Dowager Countess) had a job of some sort. It didn’t make sense that they would have been so shocked at Matthew’s being a lawyer if they already had a close family member who worked.
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I think with Matthew the shock was that Downton was passing to somebody working class; it wasn’t a shock or disapproval of the professions in general.
Rose’s mother is Violet’s niece, and the Dowager made the comment a few episodes ago that one never meets an heiress with a brother, so Violet’s niece probably didn’t have a great dowry, and if her husband was a younger son he wouldn’t have had an inheritance above middle class lifestyle either, so the he must work to either support or supplement his lifestyle.
I think it was their way of introducing a new core character. I think all you were supposed to get from that is she’s a rambunctious 18 year old, and possibly contrast her being the other woman the way Edith will become. She’ll most certainly be back.
The responses to the Thomas/James incident didn’t seem that out-of-place or surprising to me.
*Alfred had the traditional reaction without being [del]nagged[/del] prompted by O’Brien.
*James didn’t need to be prompted too much. 
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Mrs. Hughes has seemed pretty broad-minded generally.
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Bates, newly-released from prison, wouldn’t wish prison on his worst enemy, as he actually said. He also sniffed out that O’Brien was behind all this, and IMHO he wanted to thwart O’Brien more than he wanted to help Thomas.
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Lord Grantham dealt with this as a matter of course back in school.
Having suspected Thomas’s preference from as far back as season/series one – despite being affably clueless, his gaydar works – doesn’t seem to have put him off Thomas dressing him as temporary valet.
And then there’s Carson, whose reaction seemed totally in line with what we know about him, IMHO. -
Avoiding scandal for House Grantham (“this house” or “this family”, as he frequently puts it) as his first goal is pure Carson. Police + juicy charge = press = scandal.
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Carson has a double-standard when it comes to sexual morals and men vs. women. (See Ethel – he immediately thought of barring the maids from Mrs. Crawley’s house, and only as an afterthought barred the male servants. :p) I can totally see him distinguishing a late-night attempted ravishing of a young healthy man who can defend himself from the same committed against a weak and helpless woman. :rolleyes:
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He’s never liked Thomas, but he’s never liked [del]Jimmy[/del] James either.
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He was in showbusiness, recall.
In all seriousness, Thomas is probably not the first gay man Carson’s met, and if he knew someone as a friend before finding out that he was gay, Carson could easily have developed the mixed “hate the sin, love the sinner, umm, tolerate Thomas” attitude that informed his initial uninfluenced decision to give Thomas a useable letter of reference.
Who else, upstairs or downstairs, both knew about the Thomas/James incident and gave their opinion of it? Mrs. Patmore knew but didn’t opine. Daisy and Ivy didn’t know. Molesley seemed as clueless about it as he is about cricket.
Answering the tiny print! I don’t think he had a “job.” He apparently has a Big House up in Scotland but spends part of each year in London; just as the Granthams do, although we never see them there. I believe “Shrimpie” actually has an Important Government Position that keeps him in the city.
I just find it so odd that Robert was up in arms about Ethel’s transgressions but shrugs off Thomas’s behavior. I get that he says it was common in his school but surely his friends use prostitutes as well? From what I gather upper class Edwardians weren’t all that keen on marital fidelity. If you had to marry for money and status rather than love they felt you were entitled to look elsewhere for love and sex.
Matthew danced surprisingly well in the jazz club. I wonder if he sneaks over to the one in the village after Mary nods off.
My main problem isn’t that Mrs. Hughes and Robert might accept Thomas being gay, it’s that Thomas was caught in another man’s room making unwanted advances. If a straight footman had done that to a housemaid he’d have been out the door before you could namedrop Ponzi, with any investigation coming only later.
I absolutely agree. We’re to believe that the Earl is fine allowing an almost openly gay man to be his personal valet, while James was convinced to go to the police out of fear that people would believe he was a homosexual? Doesn’t jive.
I actually quite hated this (double) episode. It seemed like it was written by someone else. So plot devices stretched the limits of plausibility:
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Aristocrats from near and far respond to an ad for a ladies’ maid? How does one conduct a long distance interview in that day and age? Via the suddenly ubiquitous and class-blind telephone, I guess!
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Speaking of the phone, Edith could just pick up the phone and ask for personal information about some random guy in London, and get answers! Siri, is that you?
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OF COURSE Edith’s boss is married, and OF COURSE she’s in an asylum. What an original plot device!
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The London taxi driver returns to the aunt’s house to return a scarf that whatshername left in his cab? After having him wait outside for 2 hours instead of simply settling up and hailing another cab after their tryst? Come on.
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Matthew and Mary running into each other at what must be the only medical office in London.
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Matthew’s doctor being reticent to discuss Mary’s condition with Matthew. This is an age where women were 2nd class citizens, and well before privacy laws. OF COURSE the doctor would have discussed Mary’s condition with him.
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One word from a witness, and Bates is a free man! No new trial necessary.
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It took prompting from Bates before Thomas recalled that O’Brien offed the heir.
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“Her lady’s soap” doesn’t give away the best kept secret in town, after everyone knew that her ladyship slipped after bathing.
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Both Anna and Carson were way too friendly with Matthew and Cora, respectively. I forget the conversations, but Anna said, “Don’t worry, sir. I was only joking.” and the Earl had to warn Carson not to get on the wrong side of his wife. Way too familiar for servants.
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OF COURSE Thomas’ brother was a stereotypical Irish working class drunk.
Finally, I really disliked that Ethel is being transferred to a place near her son because it lessens the emotional punch of her sacrifice.
Other comments:
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Did anyone else think that Edith’s boss greatly resembles her ex-fiancee?
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That dog ages tremendously well!
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Continue to love the fashion and hairstyles.
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I actually like that the Earl hasn’t an ounce of humility, even after being on the border of losing Downton. That is just like a powerful man. Donald Trump, I’m thinking of you.
Yeah, no kidding! She runs to type, I guess.
I agree with everyone who thinks the homosexuality issue was dealt with a bit too modernly.
Also, did Edith’s hypocrisy bother anyone else? She got all high and mighty about the married editor (barely) flirting with her, but had no problem kissing another woman’s husband when he was a farmer!
Is Lily James- the actress playing Lady Rose- famous in England? The role just seemed to have a “special guest star” quality like Shirley MacLaine’s.
Were those two married? I thought the woman’s husband had died (been killed in the war?) and the man was her brother or some such brought in to help her run the farm?
Totally agree on “the editor looks like the older fiance who jilted her” front; very similar type.
I was assuming an Edith:Tom (Branson) romance would form, but unless it happens fast, apparently not.
The U.S. also had “you can’t divorce a lunatic” laws in many states. Around the turn of the century, the state of Florida passed a law specifically to allow this as a ‘thanks’ for Standard Oil gazillionaire Henry Flagler (the father of Florida beach industry), and since the state had fairly lenient citizenship requirements anyway, those who could afford it would sometimes establish residency there with no intention of actually moving there but just to divorce insane spouses. A few other states did likewise and also had people come there for that purpose.
That the farmer who was treated at the hospital with an injection after Isobel begged the doctor to ignore Violet’s counsel. He definitely had a wife. You’re probably thinking of William. He was very briefly married to Daisy the kitchen maid and then died in the war. His father is a farmer who treats Daisy like an adopted daughter.
Edith seems to fall in love rather quickly. I think she was in love with the Patrick who died on the Titantic then with the farmer then with the fake Patrick then with Strellan.
Thanks - now I can sleep at night.
I think I saw her in the previews for next week, so I expect to see more of her. Which is good - more headaches for everybody.
I got the same impression that Bridget Burke did - he wasn’t a tradesman (horrors) but a government official.
I am not sure if keeping Thomas around is a good thing, or not. Now he is theoretically Bates’ superior might make for interesting dramatic tension, but keeping someone who has at the least made improper advances to another member of the staff is not plausible. As Sampiro says, gay or straight, one does not keep anyone about the house who cannot keep his hands to himself, in any sense of the term.
[QUOTE=PunditLisa]
OF COURSE Edith’s boss is married, and OF COURSE she’s in an asylum. What an original plot device!
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Agree. Unless they kill her off, and charge Bates with another murder.
He wanted a good tip from the rich family, obviously.
Maybe they didn’t intend to have him wait, but got distracted (ahem) during what was intended as a quick stop to change for the night club. Then they came out, breathing heavily, and saw him still there, so off to the Poodle Club or whatever it was. Where there were negroes, and cocktails, and jazz, and couples dancing in quite an abandoned fashion!
(Shodan grows faint and collapses on the divan.)
“Carson! Fetch the port decanter!”
Regards,
Shodan
We should assume there will be an in-person interview.
This was weird. Did she call some kind of news/information agency? I thought it was presumptuous. Not the call so much as Edith assuming that she had a right to the information. All he did was ask her to dinner. If he had more than that on his mind, he may have been honorable enough to tell her he was married.
Have there been any original plot devices in this show? I don’t know why we love it so much.
He figured he wasn’t going to be paid. Rose and her friend had other things on their mind.
It’s believable that the gentry uses the same doctor, especially if he’s a specialist.
Yep. We even saw this in Mad Men, when Betty’s psychiatrist told Don everything. In the 1950’s.
Yep. Unbelievable. But since it was so easy to get a conviction, maybe it was equally easy to get a conviction overturned.
Did everyone know the circumstances, or did they just know that she lost the baby?
Yes, but we’re supposed to believe that, for the most part, this family is more progressive than others. It’s been that way all through the show, starting with Robert paying for Mrs. Patmore’s eye surgery.
Except that he really wasn’t that bad. He asked for beer and he didn’t dress for dinner. Other than that, he was okay.
Again, we have the Grantham bunch being all sentimental about their employees.
I think Fellowes is writing for the fans. Sure, he’ll kill people off or put them in prison and keep lovers apart and give them some rough times, but he knows what the fans want. It’s either that, or he doesn’t know how things really were in those houses.
When I got divorced in California seven years ago, the two “grounds” were irreconcilable differences and mental defect.
The taxi driver’s story was that he picked Rose up, drove her to her paramour’s house, where he parked for 2 hours. (That is when the Aunt remarked that it was one expensive cab ride.) Then the two of them came out and he drove them to the Cotton Club. Then he realized she’d left her scarf, so he returned to her home to deliver it. He’s one full-service taxi driver!
At that point, the butler interrogated him, and he spilled the beans. Since she didn’t drive a car or have a cell phone (one presumes) to track her down, it was Fellowes’ flimsy way for them to know where Rose was so that they could barge in on her.