Dutch "Paedophile Party"; Thoughts?

Nope. Sorry to disappoint you.
Here’s a clip of the charming fellow:
http://www.geenstijl.nl/mt/archieven/013612.html

[click on the pink text: breedbeeld or smalbeeld - broadband or smallband]

Neither link plays anything for me.

Here’s an update from Wikipedia:

Here’s another picture from the website of the party picturing the chairman, secretary and treasurer of the party. Including the scary-looking guy in the picture gum linked to, but here he’s holding his mouth closed. :slight_smile:

Oh true, but the difference between a 12 year old and an older teen is just very different. I remember I thought I knew all about sex and relationships, and I look back, and just shake my head.

“Well, in all my years, I never seen, heard nor smelt an issue that was so dangerous it couldn’t be TALKED about. Hell, yes! I’m for debating anything!” Josiah Bartlett, 1776

Someone else could start a party called “All pedophiles should be castrated” party. You always have some extremes in government, the hope is that they stay in the vast minority, and eventually disappear.

You cant force an idea out of existence, ideas only die by being forgotten.

He said, sheepishly…

Yes, of course I would trust THAT guy with my 12 year old daughter…uh huh, sure would…NOT!

Yeah, the pedos are pushing that they’re harmless, and that sex is just so wonderful and good and not harmful to kids! :confused: (in a WTF way)
Thing is 90% of the time, the pedos were abused themselves, and they weren’t treated, so the cycle of abuse starts again. Kids who have been treated show a VERY low rate of being the perpetrators of abuse. If we can interupt that cycle of abuse, then the percentage of pedos in our society will be VERY low!
For the nonabused pedos, I’d say that it’s probaly a mix of sociopathic bastards, and people with severe personality disorders that may have stunted their maturity.

Do you have a cite on that? And what percentage of victims go on to be abusers themselves?

Sex isn’t harmful to kids (at least kids old enough to want to do it). What are you, stupid?

I’ve watched people have sex since I was 12 (on tv and on the computer, I WISH it was in person), and I’m sure participating myself wouldn’t have affected me any differently.

There have been many studies, and the consensus is that pornography and masturbation does not harm children (if they seek it themselves). I’m sure all-out-sex isn’t any different, and shouldn’t yield results that are much different. (By what mechanism is having sex orders of magnitude different from watching sex and jerking off?)

Unfortunately, most studies examining adolescent-adult sex did not factor out incest and homosexuality. While homosexuality and incest aren’t inherently damaging either, our society puts a lot of shame around them, and shame affects adolescents profoundly. (kids are embarassed of everything, and they really do feel those emotions. it’s not an act or a call for attention, and it can do damage.)

Man, I shudder at those words. “Treatment” means repeatedly telling them what a shameful, horrible thing happened. God, that’ll sure as hell fuck up any kid. No matter what the sex itself did to them. How would you feel if adults around you kept talking about your embarassing sex life? (And you didn’t have the capacity to just ignore them.)

Oh, and spare me the “emotional component.” True, it’s there. But despite a fancy name, it’s just heartbreak and disappointment and that sort of thing. Not irrelevant, but not something to write laws about.

Huh huh. Interesting perspective, Alex. Please stay the hell away from my daughter.

I am NOT making this up just to attack Islam. It is usually admitted by traditional Muslims that Aisha was as young as nine (and Mohammed in his mid-fifties, old enough to be her grandfather) when he first consumated his marriage to her. Please see this site for more information.

Now, most of these Mulims say that Mohammed must not be judged by modern standards, and that such enormous age differences and marriage to such young wives was common then.

The question is, what is it exactly that we are against when it comes to children and sex? I note that this new “party” wants to reduce the age of consent to 12. Well, after all, human beings reach puberty around that age.

Are you against a 13-year-old having sex with a 15-year old? What about a 13-year-old and an 18-year-old? What about a 14-year-old and a 25-year-old?

If a spread of 11 years is objectionable, would you object to sex between an 18-year-old male and a 29-year-old woman? Between a 50-year-old and a 61-year-old?

At what age do you believe a young person can give valid consent? 12, 15, 18? Is any age more defensible than another?

I am not in any way definging paedophilia as a practice. I am just wondering where we draw the line and why.

Young people become sexually mature at 12, but traditional morality says they should wait until marriage, which in our society is often not possible economically and socially until ten or fifteen years later. Is this a reasonable system?

I am asking a lot of questions, but I do not pretend to have an answer to them.

Huh huh. Interesting questions, Val. Please stay the hell away from my daughter.

umm… why do you think I will impregnate, abandon, or otherwise hurt your daughter?

I have never for one fucking second said that I am interested in your daughter or in any young person, and I never have been.

I have asked some questions about how we deal with the fact that humans reach puberty at 12, and what this means in terms of what we accept and do not accept regarding what they do and whom they do it with.

If the best you can do, Walter, is jump up and down like a hillbilly farmer with a shotgun defending his pretty young Daisy Belle from the city slickers “what wants ta fuck her”, maybe you should learn something about intelligent debate.

I AM NOT INTERESTED IN YOUR CHILDREN OR ANYONE ELSE’S KIDS. I am a happily married 58-year-old man.

Moderator’s Warning: Keep the insults out of Great Debates.

And cool it with the “you are a pedophile” innuendos as well.

What I said upthread bears repeating

The party didn’t get the necessary 570 subscribers (out of a country of 16 million people) to participate in the Dutch elections.

And I think Walter Winchill is going too far. Accusations of even sympathy or an open mind to the concept of for pedophilia is the worst crime imaginable in the US. Walter accusing two other posters of that crime is, at the very least, an attempted character assasination. Way to kill an interesting thread, dude.
And I wonder if it is such a good value to teach your daughter the same attitude you show here, that there are certain things can’t be discussed, ever, and that they have to do with sex. She might need to talk with you about things related to that subject one day, you know?

And, on preview: damn, the moderators here are fast. :slight_smile: