Engine stutters

Hi,
My first car was a 1990 Toyota Celica, now I own a '93 MX-6. Besides both cars being imports I fail to see the common problem they both share. I hope someone knows what I’m talking about. I have an automatic and my celica was as well… if you know automatics, then you know that if you take your foot off the brake the car will crawl forward by itself. It’s in one decelerations that I experience “coasting stutter”.

Without pushing on the gas or the brake my car with feel as if I am lightly tapping the brakes so the car gives a “hiccupping” kind of feeling … press the gas and it’s all smooth, put the brakes on and it’s fine… coast around without either and it’s hiccup-hiccup-hiccup and even this phenomenon is random meaning I could probably never prove such a problem to a mechanic… what gives… does anyone know what this is and really know cars? Please help. Thanks in advance

Well, as it’s an automatic, if you let off the throttle at speed and coast, the car will downshift for you. These shifts will be noticeable in most cars. if they occur one after another, gradually, and predictably at the same engine loads, then I’d say it’s nothing to worry about.

Crawling forward at lights with an auto trans is due to a lot of factors, but mostly that the friction keeping a stationary car at rest is more than the friction when it’s already rolling. Due to the auto tranny’s multiplication of torque at low rpm many cars can creep forward at low rpm, but not always smoothly.

Have you checked your transmission fluid? When you do, make sure it’s a nice reddish color, not brown or nearly black. And make sure the level is correct too.

I’m not a mechanic, but I worked with them. I’m also not completely certain if you’re telling us that the car stutters when you’re decelerating, say at a stop sign, or if it’s stuttering when you let the foot off the brake when you start off, or both. This is, no doubt, a problem on my part, not yours.

I’m taking these OTC sleeping pills, you see. But I’m trying to help.

Whatever the problem is, you may be able to avoid it in the same way in which unscrupulous mechanics fix idle problems–with a flathead screwdriver and a lot of cohones which, IMHO, oughta be kicked a little more often if they’re pulling stuff like that. But there’s a big caveat, so don’t miss my last paragraph.

I see that there is a known problem with MX-6 throttle position sensors. This brings up the interesting possibility that there may be a behavioral reason for the problem, if I understand that page correctly (and you’d better not trust me).

Someone may have traced a “memory” into your car’s throttle sensor system and you’re annoying the car by driving it differently. Purely out of curiosity, do you share your car with someone who drives it more than you do? Or–get this–you may have really picked it up used from a little old lady who drove the same route to church on Sundays.

Anyway, that’s a three-pointer from the half line. On to the quick fix.

Idle speed problems can sometimes be whisked away (perhaps temporarily) by raising the idle speed of the car. It can fix the problem if the idle is just too darned low, but it can also mask other problems.

First, find the idle adjust. That’s your biggest problem since I can’t find it in a quick Google search. Second, take a flathead screwdriver and, with proper safety precautions like no long hair hanging over the belts and the shot-glass of Bacardi 151 safely resting on the oily rags on the workbench, adjust the idle screw upward until the car stops stuttering. I think the '93 MX-6 had a tach so you might be able to test the car in park–otherwise, you have to go by feel. I’ve seen relatively good cars running with idle speeds above 1100, but keep in mind that the higher the idle rpm, the faster the car is going to putter along at idle while in drive–we took one 450 SL in trade which “idled” at about 25 MPH.

Do not have a girlfriend or wife who just busted you for cheating keep the car at rest with her foot on the brake and with the car in drive while you attempt this, unless you want to be the last trophy to grace the garage wall. Instead, adjust the idle in park and take the car for a drive to see if it helped.

If it doesn’t, you’ll have excluded one obvious quick-fix which a disreputable mechanic might attempt to screw you over with by saying he had to replace your transmission rekinebriator regulator sensor or something. If it does work, you have to decide if you can live with your automatic straining at the brakes a little more than it did, and you’ll always wonder if the problem was just that the idle was too low to drag the car around, or if you had a real problem.

I’m pretty sure that the 1993 MX-6 was also virtually the same car engine-wise as that year’s Ford Probe, so you may have two venues for research.

And here’s the caveat: Did you have the same mechanic for the Celica and the MX-6? Your mechanic may well be completely honest and decent, but he may be also trying to do you a favor by keeping your idle speed low, quiet, and more fuel efficient. If that’s the case, just tell the guy next time that you’re having some stuttering problems at idle and can he please boost it up a touch. Your mechanic ain’t no dummy: he sets your idle speed while the car is in park, and probably doesn’t test it much while just in drive; I’d forgive the guy if he hasn’t spent the last fourteen years charging you for rekinebriators.

And you know what’s the worst about this post? I’m probably completely wrong. But it’s the annoying little things which look like big things which lead to temptation on the part of mechanics, so it can’t hurt to check it out.

If the problem is when you hit the brakes, AND you have vacuum assisted (power) brakes, (You almost certainly DO have vacuum assisted brakes.) stepping on the brakes, especially when you haven’t driven very far, will rob the manifold of air, causing a stumbling in the engine idle. Three ways to fix it: 1) Don’t use brakes (recommended). 2) replace the vacuum lines, and make sure you have a god seal around both ends of the line that runs from the manifold to the brake vacuum can (The thing on the firewall with brake lines and a vacuum hose attached to it.) 3) If you’re REALLY lazy about maintanence; put it in neutral when you need to brake, and set your idle a little high.

On modern cars, idle speed problems will usually be created by attempting mechanical adjustment. The idle speed is controlled by the electronic control system (“computer”) using sensors and actuators. Changing any mechanical setting involved generally throws the system out of whack and makes things worse.

You can’t find it because there is nothing intended to be used to adjust the idle. (If there is something adjustable in the system, it’s a “base idle” setting, meant to put the throttle plate in a position where the electronic controls can work properly. The real idle adjustment is done through the computer.)

No argument there, though it was an entertaining post.

Hi guys,
Thanks for so much help.
<B>QED</B>, I’ll check my tranny fluid but I’m pretty sure it’s ok; Redline makes pretty good products.

I like the article that <B>Sofa King</B> attached the word “bucking” in there exactly describes the kind of behavior my car gives me. But as it says that it rarely affects non-UK cars I’m left wondering.

<B>Dolas</B> it could be a vacuum problem only I’m not using my brakes when it occurs.

For example, I’m pulling away from the pump after a fill-up at the gas station and there’s 50 ft to the edge of the road from where I am, so I apply a little gas for about 25ft and the rest I “coast” hiccup-hiccup-hiccup until I reach the edge of the road and apply the brakes. This problem can easily be masked by applying a little bit of gas …this problem <I>isn’t</I> occuring when I’m in park… in other words it’s not an idle problem… it occurs between I’d guess 500RPM and no more than 1000RPM approximately.

Also it happens (especially with my previous Celica) when I’m coasting from a higher speed into, say a turning lane where you would just take advantage of your residual forward motion until you reached your goal area to apply the brakes. I’m guessing it happened more in my previous car based on the fact that it was a 2.2L 4-banger and I now have a 2.5L V6 …(smaller engines are more sensitive to problems).

It could be a downshifting phenomenon <B>Stan Doubt</B> but it really feels unnatural, besides what’s the likelihood that two different car makers with two different set-ups would downshift the exact some way?

<B>Gary</B>, I know you are correct but be nice to the people trying to help me. I need all the ideas I can get. Thanks again everyone and please don’t give-up!

Oh,
One last forgotten detail… I am the only driver, (short of an occassional driving lesson with my wife). I bought the car used at 39K and it’s now almost *70K * …and “no” the car didn’t start out doing this to me although I have no clue when it began as I am the kind of person to put things off until they piss me off to the point I have to fix it or I’ll go nuts :smiley: Please keep trying guys…

I’m still not certain I’m entirely wrong.

Thinktank, you mention two posts above that your car idles between 500 and 1,000 RPM. I notice that on several sites your car’s idle RPM is supposed to be around 650 +/- 50 RPM. As I suggested above, your idle speed may simply be too low.

Now check this out: on this page there is mention of adjusting the idle on the MX-3, which I realize is a completely different car, but nevertheless offers this tantalizing statement:

[QUOTE]
Now adjust idle speed by turning the large Philips headed screw in the top of the throttlebody.
Set the idle speed about 150 rpm below your desired idle as when out of diagnostic mode it will idle higher.

This example won’t wash for your car, but if for some reason your car runs 150 RPM above the desired idle speed when it’s in diagnostic mode, and your mechanic doesn’t know it, your idle could drop to 500 after he’s set it for 650.

Again, it’s just a suggestion.

I’m sorry sofa king but I just have to clarify that I said the problem occurs between 500-1000RPM… not that my cars idles that fast. In fact, I have not idea what it idles at in “Park”, lol. I guess that might help “Sherlock” (myself) along on his quest some:dubious:
Oh, one other thing Sofa, I never said you were wrong, I only said I was left wondering… I sincerely hope that it is only an idle problem… especially since the brave people offering ideas are getting to be fewer and fewer now. :(…