Engineer_comp_geek, are you *aware* how racist this moderation sounds?

Derailing a thread by saying you are the only person who knows what’s going on and everyone who disagrees with you is stupid is also trying to silence people.

Because that’s not what the moderation direction says. It doesn’t say something like “you may have a legitimate point, but you have to keep it within the rules for the forum.”

Instead, It says he’s “blowing things out of proportion” and “taking things the wrong way.” That’s not about how he expressed himself, but announcing as a mod that he’s wrong to get upset in the first place. It’s the mod clearly taking a side, and that side being the one that multiple posters have explained was in fact racist.

He’s declaring by fiat that all of the posters who explained exactly why this came off as racist are wrong. That’s not his prerogative.

And he’s a white person telling a person of color that they are wrong to be upset about something they perceive as racism. Not saying he was wrong in how he expressed it, but that he was “taking it all out of proportion.” And telling said poster that he needs to shut up and stop ever addressing the issue of race.

That’s what the moderation direction says. It’s not how he said it, but what the poster said that is wrong.

@engineer_comp_geek should listen to what people of color have to say about race, not declare them wrong and “blowing things out of proportion.” POCs have been told that every time they get upset about anything racially related.

For the record, @BigT , I don’t know if e_c_g is White, nor is it relevant to my point. That’s why I phrased it as non-Indigenous.

The only “tone policing” done in the original thread was to try to keep two people to the tone of MPSIMS, it was not specific to Banquet Bear.

Also, Banquet Bear acts like that in every thread I’ve seen him in. The last time I read a post of his he jumped into the middle of a “Is Woody Allen a Pedo” thread, insisting he was right that Allen was a pedo, even tho he hadn’t read much about the case and had not seen the documentary that the thread was started about. And as I said in the ATMB thread, he comes into every thread angry and if you don’t totally agree with everything he says, he continually misreads every post in the worst way possible.

This has nothing to do with his skin color, it has to do with him being a jerk in every thread he participates in, no matter what the forum.

I have to agree that telling BB they shouldn’t get post in threads about indigenous people because they get upset is extremely problematic.

Bullshit, His first post, and then his second in reply to slash2k, were nothing I would characterize as angry posting. He got angry after that, and perfectly understandably so.

Again, bullshit. Was he a jerk in Loki thread with spoilers thread? Or this one?

No, there’s a certain kind of thread where B_B is tone policed, and it’s not every forum and every thread. Mainly, it’s the ones where an uppity PoC makes the majority demographic here uncomfortable.

Not sorry, but your perceptions do not match mine, and even if he was problematic elsewhere, he was not problematic in the thread in question.

Sorry, didn’t notice the spoiler tag, thanks for the edit, @What_Exit

The moderation in question doesn’t appear racist to me.

What’s patronizing at best, racist at worst is to suggest that minority posters should be exempted from board standards because the poor dears can’t control themselves.

*remembering the Huey_Freeman debacle.

“No detectable trace of anger in your posts” is not a “board standard”. It’s a special one, strategically applied just for the uppity posters.

Weaponized tone-policing - the missing tail light of moderation, if you get my drift.

“Extremely problematic” is a gross understatement of how very wrong that moderation sounds and how wrong (and racist) its implications are.

I’ve seen the same thing mordecai described. It’s not in every thread Banquet Bear posts in but I’ve seen it in threads that have nothing to do with race.

And still my point stands about the thread in question.

Of course he was problematic, that’s why he got a thread ban. What makes your perceptions more Pure than others? Being a jerk is being a jerk.

No it doesn’t, he got a thread ban for good reason, he derails threads all the time.

First of all, let me say that there were quite a few things that I wanted to say in that thread, but I also felt that the thread needed to be closed and I did not want to abuse my power as a mod to get the last word in on a bunch of stuff.

One thing is that I do have a lot of sympathy for @Banquet_Bear. Racism is a horrible thing regardless of what race is being mistreated, and I do have a lot of sympathy for those who have to endure being mistreated no matter how big or small the slight. I am a child of the 70s and I grew up with the core value that everyone is equal regardless of race.

And for the record, for those who want context, I am an old white guy.

Another thing that I would like to say is that I personally don’t know how indigenous people are treated here on the SDMB because it doesn’t seem to come up very often. I think that it is an issue that is worth looking into and we have actually started a discussion about a lot of things from that thread in the mod loop.

While I do have a lot of sympathy for @Banquet_Bear, that doesn’t mean that he gets a free pass to derail every thread where the issue comes up.

@slash2k’s initial comments weren’t that bad, but @Banquet_Bear read more into them than was there, and the ensuing argument threw the entire thread off of the rails. @Banquet_Bear similarly misread moderator comments and his anger, while understandable, made it impossible for there to be a reasonable ATMB discussion on the issue as well.

That is the issue. Even if you are on the right side of an argument, that doesn’t give you the right to completely derail a thread.

If anything I said came off as racist, I apologize. That was not my intent.

Yes, they absolutely were.

This is the whole point - you don’t get to say

and then also make comments about whether comments aren’t “that bad.” when an actual Indigenous person was saying “yes, they were.” Angry or not.

I mean, why do you think he got angry in the first place?

That’s a really horrible characterization of what’s being talked about here.

BIPOC people are constantly being asked to modulate their tone when discussing racial issues that affect them. The tone becomes the focus instead of the content, and it’s exhausting to be repeatedly told to just be calmer, nicer, and more polite when pushing back against aggressive comments.

This isn’t something just Mr Dibble is pulling out if thin air- it’s a major part of the conversation on how we should be discussing racial issues. It is not up to the BIPOC person to have to be nice enough to earn being heard.

I do this work as part of my job all the time and I don’t always get it right myself. It’s hard- but when it’s done poorly it deserves being called out.

You said this exactly right. This is what I tried to explain to him in the ATMB thread, but you said it better.

Cute.

My perceptions are more “pure” because I have extensive training in this area, I am heavily involved in this work professionally and scholarly, and that experience helps me see things through a different lens.

Also, for anyone who does this work intent doesn’t really matter, but rather impact. After you deal with impact, you can deal with intent.

I’m trying to listen rather than express an opinion at this point - but I couldn’t let this pass without comment. It’s superb rhetoric, especially if the metaphor is original.