I don’t have that question and do/have not wondered that. I described a good suicide plan that I would personally use if my situation ever warranted it. Someone else carried out this idea successfully a few months later. In his case, committing suicide was not a bad idea. Though after his death (which some insist was accidental) a slew of “friends” emerged from the woodwork lamenting the loss, the fact is that he was homeless, jobless, and hopeless for quite a while before ending it. None of these people would even spare a few minutes to have a conversation with him if he called. He was an addict and his life showed no signs of ever becoming tolerable, and it’s fair to say that in spite of posturing to the contrary, no one misses him. Also, he was extremely annoying.
I don’t think jumping in front of a train is particularly dumb. The problem is that it is wrong, as you are involving another person, probably against their will.
In the case of random people reading this, go ahead and google, I’m sure you will find many fine suggestions. I simply have no desire for any of them to come from me.
You said “What is inhibiting their access to the normal stuff that kills people every day? […] since there are plenty of other options already”.
I asked you what you meant by that, and you’ve said you don’t want to give people ideas.
So are these common-knowledge methods or not? If so, you’re not giving people ideas. If not, your own question is answered.
How can I know what is considered common knowledge?
What seems obvious to me may be difficult for someone else. If a person can’t even figure out how to effectively kill themselves though, perhaps it’s just a passing fancy and tomorrow they will be glad they didn’t carry it out, so if they can’t even be bothered to do any research, it’s probably best not to serve them up a quick and easy plan.
Now if they are incarcerated, that’s a different matter entirely. There could be a mandatory waiting period to prevent people from doing it on a whim, but prisoners ought to be given access to a means of ending their suffering, in my opinion, and prison offers no painless/foolproof options.
I’m really not sure what your point is in arguing for do-it-yourself suicide. There are a number of important reasons for legalizing and institutionalizing euthanasia. One is to provide an expert and objective point of medical assessment, which might well dissuade the person and offer help that would not otherwise be sought, and which can be approached without fear if the principle of self-determination is firmly established in law. Another is to prescribe appropriate and effective drugs, and (depending on how laws are written) maybe oversee the process to ensure it goes as planned. And a third really important one is to act on the patient’s behalf, carrying out the patient’s wishes when the person is no longer physically capable. Most jurisdictions typically already endorse that principle by respecting DNR orders and the right of patients to refuse life support, etc. This just takes it one step further when necessary and justifiable.
And the unintended effect of all of this is that it legitimizes and normalizes suicide as the way that one’s life is supposed to end. And then, a generation or two down the line, people who don’t want to commit suicide are being called selfish and greedy for wasting their family’s resources…
Out of curiosity, how do you feel about palliative care, and doctors who stop trying to remedy the disease, and instead use their medical knowledge and training to make the dying more comfortable? That’s a sort of helping a patient die I suppose, although much more of a passive way than euthanasia.
Making the patient comfortable is an important part of medicine, but it is subordinate to saving lives. It is better to be alive and in pain than dead and comfortable.
When it is absolutely apparent that a person is in their final hours and there is absolutely nothing short of a miracle that would reverse their prognosis, then I do not fault doctors for being more concerned that the patient is pain-free.
I guess if the thought of people suffering pleases you it is.
I believe the point is to keep dangerous people from harming others, not getting revenge on those that have.
Something which I don’t think has been covered in this debate is the fact that even if it is never used, having the option of suicide can provide comfort for those who fear the future.
As an anecdote from the heart I present the situation of my wife.
She suffers from severe chronic pain that is usually, mostly, relieved by prescriptions from her pain doctor. This along with a past of physical and emotional abuse, causes frequent bouts of severe depression, and suicidal thoughts. She discusses these thoughts openly with both myself and her therapist, and has made it clear that she will under no circumstances act on them without first discussing it with us and seeking all possible other options. So when she discusses it with me, I can offer sympathy and understanding but don’t have to fear that one day I will come home from work and find her hanging in the basement.
her suicidal thoughts are greatest on those days when her pain is particularly severe, such that all she can do is lie in bed and wait for the pain to stop. On those days her greatest fear is that this will be the one time that it doesn’t recede, that her disease will progress to the point that her life will be nothing but decades of torture from this day forward. By having the option of suicide she can know that there is an upper limit to her suffering, that no matter what the future holds the torture will eventually end. She reassures herself with what she calls the 1,000 day plan, in that if after 1,000 days things haven’t gotten better she can end it, so that she is sure that the longest her suffering will last is 1,000. Thus far they have always gotten better within a day or a week, but knowing that option is out there has been a great sense of solace when times get bad.
I don’t have a cite for this, but I recall several years ago a documentary on physician assisted suicide, which observed that the majority of those who obtained the suicide medication from their doctors didn’t actually use it, and instead died of their disease, but that they received great comfort knowing that it was there in their medicine cabinet should the reach the point that they decided that using it was the best option.
Says you. Other people don’t feel that way, and given that they are the ones who are actually experiencing the pain that they are in, their understanding of what they are feeling and what is best for them trumps your understanding.
I can tell you what they’ll be experiencing and feeling after they commit suicide. Nothing. Ever again.
If anyone believes that death is preferable to temporal pain, then they are either not aware of this fact, are misinformed as to the nature of death, or have not adequately considered the consequences of death.
I’d rather feel nothing than only bad feelings. If the future likely holds only pain followed by death, skipping as much of the pain as possible is a perfectly reasonable course of action.
If you disagree, apply that to your own life as you see fit. Who are you to think your opinion about someone else’s situation trumps that of the person actually living their life?
And what are these “consequences” you speak of? No one succeeds at committing suicide and then regrets it. It’s only a bad choice if you botch it up somehow.
To the contrary. It strengthens the value of human life by removing from the population those people who have no regard for human life and for the laws of civilized society.