With a “normal” employment market the self regulation occurs in order to maintain that quality workforce needed. Screw over your employees and they are free to accept employment with a firm treating their employees better down the street.
That’s fine, sort of. AFAIK, though, most salesmen don’t belong to unions. Most people don’t belong to unions. So that doesn’t really get us very far in terms of what **elucidator **was getting at.
There are so many reasons why this doesn’t match reality. Wages have gone down to the point where it’s hard to raise a family on less than 2 incomes. People don’t generally have the resources to jump jobs that easily, even more so during the current recession. Even something as simple as health care benefits hits the equation.
Currently capital can screw over employees because it can wave the threat of outsourcing. As long as you can ship the work to a country with 1/10th the standard of living and “civilized” requirements, you can push back all day on employee compensation.
strike!
Strike!
Strike!
That’s why I stated “normal employment market”. Granted, what we’ve been experiencing the past couple of years is anything but, which causes employees just to hunker down and wait out the bad times at a less than desirable job (just thankful to have one scenario). You can bet that as soon as the market comes back, people will be leaving the places they’ve been underpaid, or mistreated in droves. I’ve seen it happen multiple times.
Professional Technical and skilled employees (machinist, welders, etc) are most always in demand during those times. If you have little to no marketable skills, you might want to try and change that at a local trade school/community college.
Yes, there have been many skilled, and even professional technical jobs outsourced internationally but sometimes that has been because they couldn’t get the skilled people locally (most of the times purely for profit, but the skilled labor shortage comes into play as well). Once outsourced, do they end up getting a quality product in return? In many of the cases I’ve seen - no. What they get back ends up needing much in the way of rework and correction.
Really? :dubious: :rolleyes:
I had a union job where we were required to work 45hrs/wk. But the health benefits were about as good as anyone could get in my hometown. For families with children, it could have been a better deal than practically any white-collar job.
Now, that was with the Teamsters, in aerospace (which meant all the money was really coming from DoD) & they negotiated a closed shop to make it all work. I can’t speak to other unions or other industries.
You just never get over this old canard do Ýou, no matter how many times we quack about it. You also don’t realize there’s a shoe on the other foot–there has never been a just society, therefore anyone who tells you he is promoting social justice is just blowing smkoke up your ass.
Also, when you say you want to burn it down, you are essentially adopting the mindset of a two-year-old (ie, “I want my way and I’m going to throw a tantrum if I don’t get it”). Meanwhile, us free mouseketeers are content to let people make choices and experience the outcomes of those chocies. Unlike squares like you, we think it’s groovy for people to do their own thing, even when we don’t like the results.
You really think that high-paying engineering jobs in a new industry like IT are comparable to blue-collar trucking & assembly jobs?
For that matter, are you aware that IT, like other industries, has underpaid workers in it, many of whom are effectively without benefits? Bill Gates’s wealth is more parallel to J. P. Morgan’s than you think.
Regards,
fool’s guinea
The sobering fact that non union tax payers are done falling for the shallow union chants must be increasing advil and sleep aid sales.
Get used to it. Real change has come.
Must be a real bitch to those that it came in 2008.
Have you cast your Koch paycheck yet, shill?
In that case, the union was happy to suck off the government tit and drive up the national debt.
But when times get tough, have unions ever offered to reduce union dues? Dipped into their massive war chests? Cut the salaries of union management? You know, for the good of their workers?
I’ve spent much of the last 18 years as an IT consultant and systems analyst and I’ve been in many many companies doing workflow analysis.
Stuff gets outsourced because some bean counter think that the invoice amount also guarantees the same product or service quality because the line items look the same.
Outsourcing in my experience is done because you can then bid out the jobs cheaper. Bean counters on both the vendor and customer side resist forcibly any notion that the product or service aren’t as good because they are compensated based on cost cutting.
It’s the same problem with the financial industry. Bean counters persuade middle management that the lower invoice total is what is important, completely burying the idea that they are incurring risk. Anyone pointing out that risk and the fact that is not factored into the profit ledger turns out to have made a career limiting observation.
Private sector unions, where your negotiating counterpart has about as opposite an interest to you as you can get? organize away
Public sector unions, where your negotiating counterpart has absolutely no revenue restrictions which to negotiate from, and also has his own conflict of interest since public management pay is somewhat related to “worker” pay? bust away
No, I don’t get paid like the people bussed in for protests. I speak my own mind.
I don’t need a sick note either.
Welcome new poster Assi. Do you think you are accomplishing anything here other than causing embarrassment to actual thoughtful conservatives?
Leaving the question of public unions vs private unions aside, what you’re describing is collusion. But I really don’t even mind that. As long as the assumption is that these workers are irreplaceable, But a company has the right to challenge that assumption. I can see a group of workers striking, as long as they respect the right of the employer to try to replace them. If they’re really so special, management will come crawling back to them. If not, sayonara. Like Reagan did to the air traffic controllers.
We can see that, Assi. Do you have any proof to back up this claim that people are getting paid to protest against Walker?
That is, in fact, theoretically the biggest risk striking workers take. Granted, the ability of management to find new workers can depend on both 1) whether or not the non-employed public thinks low enough of unions to work as scabs and 2) whether or not allied unions (like the teamsters or whatnot) can punish hiring scabs by refusing to provide THEIR services to the company whose workers are striking.
Surely you’d agree the Reagan solution is far more practical and effective than attempting to limit the right of the workers to freely assemble as a collective bargaining unit?
Someone told him on the internet! And by God, if that person is a conservative, he’s telling the gosh-darned truth!
I’ll answer. Every one of those pricks that got a fake sick note off work is getting paid to protest
Pretty simple, unless you are a fucking idiot. Seems it won’t be so simple for several of you here.