F1: Will Schumacher ever loose?

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

With the current Ferrari team of engineers and staff working diligently behind him, is there any chance in the near future that Michael Schumacher will get his balls kicked by JPM (Monteya)?

How much difference does the car itself make? I would guess a heck of a lot more than in NASCAR racing, but I’m not 300% sure.

How much talent has Shumi really got compared with the rest of the F1 drivers? It’s so boring, he always wins! There’s the least amount of competition in that motorsport than there is in any other.

2

Ahh, a thread close to my heart! As a member of the tifosi I hope that Ferrari keep winning, cause it’s sure not boring for me. :smiley: But realistically, I do think that Ferrari can keep winning, maybe even dominating, for as long as the 5 main people in that team stick together: Schumacher, Rubens Barrichello, Ross Brawn, Rory Byrne, and Jean Todt. They have fabulous chemistry together, and Schumi and Rubens do not have the clashes that other teammates do. Add the effort that Bridgestone have concentrated on Ferrari, and you have a mostly unbeatable team.

I’d put Schumacher’s talent level at least 15% above every other current driver. I think Montoya is probably about 5% above the rest of the drivers, and most of the others are probably about the same (with some notable exceptions, like Yoong). But Schumacher has the added bonus of having everyone focused on HIM. The car is designed to suit him, any better equipment is given to him first, even Rubens contract states that he must pull over for Schumacher if asked. So he does have advantages that other drivers don’t. But, imo, he’s earned it.

I would say that in general, the car is probably worth about 10% of team performance, but because things are so close in driver talent, they are the deciding factor. And the races aren’t as ‘competitive’ because the rules aren’t constantly jiggered to provide that ‘competition’. This makes F1 different from almost every other series, and also involves every part of the team in the competition. That’s why I enjoy it, and can overlook the mostly predictable results. But that also makes it more exciting when someone like Sato can perform so well and boost Jordan like he did in Japan.

3

Ah! A F1 thread that I didn’t have to start myself!!

I would say “Yes” with a footnote. That being “if he stays around long enough.”

The nature of the sport is such that eventually, another team will get it right and possibly eve
n catch Ferrari off guard and whip them at thier own game. Near future? Not too likely, but almost certain within the next 4-7 years. If Schumi hangs around long enough ( and he almost certainly won’t) some “better”* will come along and knock him off.

*“better” is very dependant on timing. You can argue that Frentzen is “better” cause he used to beat Michael up in F3000 (was that it?), but not where they sit right now. Remember, everyone said senna was the best and had he not been killed, Michael would be kicking the crap out of him today. You can say Montoya was “better” than Michael many times this season, except on the last lap when the flag fell. Montoya never saw it, his car was parked.

So, to recap: If Michael quits after next season, he is likely to go out on top. If he hangs around too long, he will retire as a mid-pack runner, as the other teams get thier shizen together to challenge Ferrari. My long-odds dark horse prediction is Toyota. They have the $$, resources and motivation required to whip the world. I am guessing that they could recruit top drivers easily to square that team away pronto!

Know what I like about Schumacher the best? He is single-handedly erasing senna from the record books, and soon, he will be forgotten and relegated to his proper spot in history, a little-remembered footnote.

I would say the car is the largest determiner of success in F1. Sure, Michael is the best. But remember, Salo was a winner when he sat in his car. Right now, Ferrari is dominant with the best car and the best driver. And they have Rubens, too. Both of them.

Gatopescado- author of “How to create enemys and piss of friends”

4

Did you guys hear/read about the handicapping system that has been proposed to level the playing field next year in F-1 racing?

Two of the big changes are

  1. drivers would switch cars, ie; Michael Schumaker could end up driving the Mercedes car for one race.

  2. Weight would be added to the cars based on points standings.

Personally I think F-1 racing is pretty boring as there are very few position changes.
But I have to say that the proposed changes are insane.

5

He’ll get beaten. There have been periods when lots of different drivers and teams have been well on top, then they vanish and only the memories remain. It’ll happen.

6

The handicapping systems are all stupid ideas, that pervert the idea of Formula 1 being the pinnacle of motorsports. I really do like the reactions from Williams and McLaren about them (appalled disgust). It’s like saying “Oh, you guys can’t keep up, we’ll give you a boost.”

As to Schumacher fading out, I don’t really know. He really does seem to have an unmatched ability to drive car development over a period of years. I don’t know how many people thought he would take 5 years to win a championship at Ferrari, especially after contending with Villeneuve in his second year there, but then NOBODY thought he would win 3 in a row after that. As long as he has such a team effort pushing HIM, not the team, he will be on top.

I also don’t really agree with the philosophy that overtaking = excitement. I have been to races with very little overtaking, like the USGP, and others with oodles, like the 1999 CART US500. Maybe it’s just me, but I thought it was far more exciting watching the gap between Montoya and Villeneuve go down, or the battle between Webber, Irvine, Salo, McNish, and de la Rosa in the back of the USGP this year. Passing isn’t everything to me (one reason why NASCAR is not at the top of my list of favorite series).

7

At the moment on odd days there are drivers who can take on Schumacher and beat him, but he has to be on a downer and they have to be at their absolute best.

There’s a reason he has the best car, the best engineers want to be around him, its a good job that Adrian Newey didn’t go over to Ferrari to design the aerodynamics or it would have been embarrasing.

As a measure of the rate of progress all you need do is look at the expectations at the start of the last season, Ferrari was expcetd to be challenged quite hard by Williams due to the latter having the most powerful engine in F1 and McLaren was epected to struggle to keep up.

At first this seemed true, but in the course of just 6 races it was clear that Ferrari had simply driven away from the field, and then McLaren edged up incrementally on Williams.

McLaren had to deal with a tyre change which initially did not suit them, those tyres worked much better for Williams, but slowly things were ironed out to such an extent that Mclaren wore its tyres much less than everyone else and was able to have fewer pit stops.

The result is that it turned out that McLaren were the main,if distant, opposition to Ferrari, despite being around 60 or 70 horses down in the engine department.

I’ve seen Coulthard put moves on Schumacher, I’ve seen Montoya do the same, but Williams needs a better chassis and Mclaren needs more power.

When things are more equal I think that Schumacher would still end up world champion, but it would be much closer.

8

The idea of “car-swaping” will never happen. These teams try like hell to keep the other teams/media from even looking too closely at thier cars, let alone let someone actually drive it!

It would be kinda fun to see what times Montoya/Coulthard/Frentzen and a few others could post if they were given the chance to drive the Ferrari. I would imagine that with a little time in the seat, they could be as fast as, or even beat Barrichello and be right on par with Michael.

They all really need to watch out for Yoong. Once he gets the right car under him, they all are toast! :wink:

9

If I remember rightly, not only does Michael’s contract expire after next year when he’s expected to retire, so does that of some of the Ferrari crew as well. And not coincidentally, Montoya and Ralf Schumacher’s contracts with Williams also expire, if I heard a recent BBC (I think it was BBC) report correctly.

I guess that could mean that next year, no matter what happens, Montoya and Ralf will be challenging one another for that coveted scarlet cockpit. But at the same time, that might be just when Ferrari’s edge wears off.

I’m one of those guys who thinks that Senna may have been the best there ever was, but I’ll admit this freely: Michael Schumacher is the best there is today, and his career as a whole will doubtless surpass Senna’s in virtually every detail, if it doesn’t already.

I’ll go even further and suggest that, in light of this past season, Schumacher might just be the finest athlete in the world, because just like Ruth or Jordan or Thorpe, when one proves themselves to be heads and shoulders above the best there are, there’s really nothing left to prove. I will be sad to see him retire–but at the same time I think I might just be a little relieved, too.

10

Things can change pretty rapidly in sports, even when they look static. Williams with Hill and Villeneuvelooked unbeatable until a couple of years ago, then McLaren and Hakkinen got the same accolades. It only takes a small change in the car or a key personnel change to make all the difference (ref. Adrian Newey). Everything’s ticking for Ferrari now, yes, but F1 doesn’t exist in a vacuum. If Fiat or Bridgestone decide to scale back or cut out the great expense of racing, then Schumacher’s clear superiority won’t much matter anymore. The non-factory-funded teams are already disappearing: Prost died before last season, Arrows during it (but hasn’t admitted it yet), Minardi is always on the edge, Jordan no longer has a major engine deal …

There have been rumblings that F1 is losing its audience due to its predictability, and some serious rules changes may be forthcoming. I think so too - the cars are almost completely homogenized and the rules are too static, basically relegating technological innovation to small increments that are invisible to fans, except for those that remove driver skill entirely (i.e. traction control). That’s true regardless of the names involved, but even they’re too homogenized in their public personae anyway. Schumacher himself seems to have gotten a good talking to 2-3 years ago, and stopped being such an ass. I can’t even root for him to lose anymore.

I regret not having paid attention to the days when there was a mix of turbo and straight engines, different configurations, different numbers of wheels even, drivers who had to know when to shift and brake and still had differing personae … hell, a majority of non-Brazilian drivers for that matter, drivers who actually talked to and cared about fans (NASCAR’s main marketing asset, I think) …

Time for a major shakeup or else the fate of IRL and CART looms.

11

The only thing I have to comment on regarding F1 racing is that I’d like to see Villeneuve get a decent car and start winning (or at least doing better) again, because it would please my entire province (Quebec - ignore my location field).