Just watched the highlights back on YouTube after a pretty awful night sleeping with wayyyyy too much adrenaline still pumping. Bit tricky to tell but it looked like Switzerland really were in that game until that pathetic dive. What was he thinking?! The second goal for Argentina was incredible, pretty much on a par with the Cape Verde one. As an Englishman I am very happy it went to extra time, considering ours also went the full 120 minutes. Do I think there is a favourite for Wednesday? I honestly couldn’t pick one.
My worry is Argentina suddenly remember how to play, because it’s England, and you turn it on.
Honest question, who are Argentina’s biggest rivals (or the ones you want to beat the most), other than, obviously, Brazil? I am going to assume, hopefully not arrogantly, that we are on the list of teams it feels extra sweet to beat?
For England it is still just about Germany I imagine, but with their slow fall from grace it’s probably diminished a little. Argentina must be right up there, with 1986 still seen as an injustice, rightly or wrongly.
Argentina HATE England. Their players were chanting songs about England in their dressing room after the previous round - I do wonder if they took their eye off the game against Switzerland a bit. The semi-final could be an emotional affair full of needle.
If he is still not convinced after the red card review for the foolish Swiss diver then he is as big a fool as the Swiss. Of course he will never admit in public that he was wrong in a matter concerning football.
Aaah, that is why the referee is called an árbitro in Spanish?
“Ese Mundial estaba preparado para que ganaran los ingleses. Lo que pasó contra nosotros fue muy alevoso”, reconstruyó Rattín en 2013. “Nuestro técnico me había dicho que si el juez cobraba mal, pidiera un intérprete, porque yo era el capitán y el reglamento me amparaba. Lo pedí porque el hijo de puta del árbitro cobraba todo para ellos, y el tipo me echó”, agregó el argentino, en referencia al referi alemán Rudolf Kreitlein, que luego del partido se retiraría escoltado por la policía local ante las quejas de los futbolistas argentinos.
Which DeepL(dot)com merecifully translates as (by merciful I mean that I would not have translated el hijo de puta del árbitro as that bastard of a referee):
“That World Cup was rigged for the English to win. What happened to us was utterly underhand,” Rattín recalled in 2013. “Our manager had told me that if the referee made a bad call, I should ask for an interpreter, because I was the captain and the rules were on my side. I asked for one because that bastard of a referee was giving them every call, and the bloke sent me off,” added the Argentine, referring to the German referee Rudolf Kreitlein, who, following the match, was escorted away by local police amid complaints from the Argentine players.
He (Rattín) seems to have embellished some facts, the rest of the article is interesting. Perhaps a bit too pro Argentina, but not too much, considering it is about football.
I also just read an obituary for Rattin on kicker.de, and they tell the story quite differently, that after already having been booked verbally twice, he didn’t stop complaining to the ref, and finally he sent him off, verbally and with gestures. Rattin knew damn well what was happening, but he pretended not to understand the situation because of the language barrier and refused to leave the pitch. After 10 minutes of back and forth, he had to be escorted by two policemen off the pitch.
This chaos led directly to the installation of yellow and red cards as clear and unambiguous signs for bookings.
Meh, a lot of people still hold a grudge but to be honest, we probably would’ve lost that game regardless, even if it was blatant cheating. Plus it was 40 years ago. I was 4 at the time! I am a bit of a weirdo though, I’m not particularly bothered by my club side’s big rivals so I’m not the typical fan. I just see them as another team to beat.
I’m a bit like you, I also don’t tend to hold many grudges or real animosity against other clubs/nations. But I bet the English press will make it some kind of revenge, won’t they?
Our biggest “Clasico” is of course Brazil, the list would be something like
Brazil
England
Germany
Uruguay (this is specially important but at a local level because it’s the neighborhood derby)
Netherlands (due to frequency and piquancy of duels against them in world cups).
However that’s the list of teams we want to win against, but there is another, more visceral list of teams against whom we do not want, we can’t, we will not allow ourselves to lose:
England
England
England
England
Mexico (Because some of their fans are insufferable)
Well then I must be foolish…
Look, it’s in part an aesthetic preference, I prefer the old football, more human, more fluid, less tech-mediated.
And in part it’s the fact that the tech that was supposed to eliminate controversy has done anything but, as you can clearly see in this World Cup, so if the tech doesn’t fulfill its primary purpose and it has all the drawbacks we’ve seen, what’s the point to it?.
The Rattin game was in some ways the beginning of the England-Argentina rivalry, I haven’t seen it so I don’t have an opinion on either side, but Argentinians at the time took it as a robbery and the English were reportedly shocked by the “uncivility” of Argentinians.
Or if you are Argentinian you may feel it was somehow fated, Diego’s death brought us the 2022 World Cup, Rattin died so we can face England for the first time with Messi, and Indio Solari’s…
It is a matter of priorities. I think a just result beats aestetics, and I don’t think the tech is doing half as bad as you claim. It’s not perfect, I hope it improves. If helping your beloved Argentina get out of dire straits twice this tournament does not show you the good side of VAR, I will have to wait a bit longer. There are still two matches to play for every team, and the next tournament will surely come.
I remember some injustices commited by referees, perhaps willingly, probably out of incompetence, with bitterness. I have no such feelings for a VAR interruption yet.
But that would be totally biased on my part, I AM biased, but not so much that I would prefer something that actually hurts the sport in the way I feel VAR does just because it happened to favor my side a couple of times.
VAR gives but VAR taketh away too, sooner or later the idiot faking a foul will be Argentinian, the invalidated goal will be from a player with a light blue and white shirt, it’s just a matter of time.
And meanwhile we STILL can’t scream our heads off when our team scores because may be the grandfather of the player who scored had an invalid driving license when he drove his father’s mother to the hospital to give birth…
I am sure you can find a less falacious argument than that one if you put your mind to it. In the meantime, we disagree. Justice and avoiding bitterness is important for me. Aestetics and unbridled joy is important for you.
It’s OK: you are young and have the right to be wrong.