In response to this thread, what is keeping robots or drones from fighting fires? Are they already used in some circumstances? Do they cost too much? What needs to happen before human firefighters are obsolete . . . or at least can do their jobs from a computer?
Robots are not capable of doing the job. They can’t travel the terrain required, perform the actions needed, be reliable, flexible, or effective enough to be useful. Drones don’t offer any advantages over fire fighting planes.
You’re talking about terrestrial drones, not aerial drones, right? If so, then the technology just isn’t ready for the job. Robots do not yet have the mobility, agility, reliability, or range for working in the wilderness. Boston Dynamics has been doing some very interesting workwith quadruped robots that can walk with a dynamic gait over uneven terrain, but as you can see from the video, they’re barely capable of keeping themselves upright under controlled tests.
Bipedal robots are even harder. here’s one in action,, and they even show its ability to recover from a shove - but that’s just on a treadmill, and it also doesn’t have much excess capacity for carrying the equipment a smokejumper needs. I’ll also wager he can’t walk very far without those umbilicals providing power.
Given that they can barely walk on smooth ground, perhaps now you can see why it’s unrealistic to think that we are ready to send a squadron of these out into the wilderness to climb over a couple of miles of hilly, rocky terrain strewn with downed trees, and then dig trenches and clear brush when they get to the fire line. Even if they are given visual/directional guidance from an operator sitting back in a safe command post, that’s still asking way too much.
In reference to the 19 firefighters who died, I am thinking this was probably a major incompetence from the people directing the firefighting response. Isn’t the technology there to both see exactly where the fire is and where it is traveling, and to communicate with the firefighters?
Wow. Not even 24 hours after this incident and you’re out for blood. I take it your fire fighting experience is more than sufficient to determine incompetence from the media reports alone. How long have you possessed an annual Red Card?
Wildland fire fighting is one of the most dangerous jobs there is. Fire and weather conditions can turn in a split second. Been there, done that. There is no technology that can predict, nor save you, every time, when fire behavior has so many variables to it. What may save you are the Ten Standing Orders and the Eighteen Watchout Situations. What may save you are the 19 other members of your Crew doing their jobs and and following 10/18. What may save you is the individual and collective experience of yourself and your crew when someone says, “I don’t like this,” the boss asks why, and a change order comes down.
But not always. Even with the elite of the Elites, a Hot Shot Crew. Been there, done that.
Right now, if you are living in parts of the US where it’s going to get up to 85*, 90*, more than 100*F today, wear a heavy long-sleeve shirt, heavy pants, gloves, helmet and boots. Put on a pack that weighs twenty pounds, minimum. Grab a long-handled shovel, maybe a pick in your hands. Now bend over and clear the new garden in your back yard right now. Now! Down to mineral soil. At least six feet wide and twenty feet long. You have sixty seconds. Finished? Do it again. And again. Easy peasy. Just walk with what you are wearing, and your gear for the next hour. In the Sun. No shade. No rest stops. In the heat. Tired? Imagine all that strain on your body and your mind for the next 12 hours. Now add fire to the mix. Having fun yet? Oh, yeah. Those clothes you are wearing in this test? It’s not Nomex, or equivalent. Try it wearing real fire gear. The flame retardant with the clothes will chafe your skin. I take it you didn’t use baby powder first thing in the morning, either. You’ll learn. No bandana to protect your neck from the Sun and chafing? You’ll learn. Oh, yeah. You should have started your day at 7am, with a three-mile hike in to your location. Your day will end about 12-16 hours later with that same three mile, or more, hike back to a shitty yellow school bus taking you back to basecamp.
And despite all of the training, all of the experience and all of the “technology” fire will turn in a split second and fuck you over. Because it can. Too fast to realize a 10/18 change.
Months from now after a thorough investigation, a report will come out. Somewhere in the report will be at least one violation of 10/18, that if heeded, would have saved them. It’s always there, at least one violation. “Someone” always has to be held accountable, because “we” (Royal "We’) always have to blame someone. The violation will be technically accurate. It could also be practically impossible to avoid at that time Sunday night.
Love the armchair quarterbacks … not.
What Duckster said so well.
Nuff said.
No, it isn’t.
That’s the TL; DR version of Duckster’s fine post.