"Final Battle" (US Invasion of Japan) on Discovery Civilization

Cafe Society
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Watched this show last night, expecting something like the old “Battlefield” program that pretty much stuck to facts and figures, plans, details-- you know, boring stuff. Didn’t get it. The program quickly degenerated into a moral and ethical quagmire about whether or not the US should have dropped the atomic bomb, and then served up a myriad of reasons, seeminly justifying the action.

But thats not what this thread is about. First, I want to say that the show was pretty disappointing. If there were detailed plans for an invasion of the Japanese mainland, I want more information then they gave us on this show. Sure, they talked about it briefly, but not in nearly the detail I would have hoped. Far too much time on stock footage and other issues.

Second, both my wife and I had the eerie feeling about half-way thru that this program was propaganda*, designed to “soften us up” to the idea of impending war with Iraq!! Say it ain’t so, Joe!! Surely, TV wouldn’t do this to us! I mean, come on! This isn’t the 40’s!:eek:

Now, I’m not the paranoid type, and I really don’t believe this cockamaime idea, but the whole tone of the show seemed to be going in the “Gee, war is awful, but ya gotta do the dirty deed sometime for the greater good” direction.

Did anybody else catch this show? Was it anything like you expected? Did you catch this weird vibe?

*I predict this thread will die a swift and mercifull death, like the other 2 threads I started last week that got a total of 2 replies!!:smack:

May the mediocrity of several greeting-card salesman inhabit your soul like unmatched buttons in a empty mayonaise jar.

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I’ve seen it. It’s about 2 years old though, so I dont think it has anything to do with Iraq. What specific sort of detail were you looking for? Are you looking for organisational info, like which divisions were supposed to take which beaches etc?

There seems to be a lot more info on Operation Olympic (invasion of Kyushu) than Operation Coronet. Olympic was scheduled for Nov1 1945. Coronet was tentatively scheduled for Spring '46, but I dont think it was past the initial planning stages.

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Oh thank goodness! I would hate to think the TV was being used to subvert our fragile little minds!

I was expecting (hoping) a program like “Battlefield” where they would outline specifics of the plan, order of battle, overview of the weapons, commanders yada yada yada. Pretty boring stuff, really, which is why that show was stuck on PBS. (come to think of it, I’m not even too sure if that is the correct title)

At any rate, that show last night sucked eggs. This thread can die now.

She said she loved me like a brother. She’s from Arkansas, hence the Joy!

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I believe it should stay alive. I believe we should all endeavor to make this the longest thread in StraightDope history.

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I believe it should stay alive. I believe we should all endeavor to make this the longest thread in StraightDope history.

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To be fair, I think this would be the natural slant of any WWII documentary. You’d have to work really hard to make it slant the other way…

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A search on “Operation Olympic” and “Operation Coronet” should satisfy you.

Ref.: What If? 2, an excellent book on alternative histories. 'Fraid I don’t have a copy handy to look up the author of the Japan A-bomb chapter, but read it anyway. The writer was pretty convincing that, as of the bombings, the Allied high command had already pretty much decided to abandon both operations. With good-quality reconnaissance finally available from the Iwo Jima and Okinawa bases, it was clear that Japan had fortified Kyushu to the extent that Olympic’s success was doubtful, and at the least would cause casualties running into 6 figures and take a year or so - just to take a third of a smallish, outlying island. There simply might not have been enough assets left, both human and materiel, to even think of planning Coronet, the invasion of Honshu.

Rather, the next weapon of mass destruction to be used, if the A-bomb hadn’t worked, would have been famine. The ports would be blockaded to prevent food shipments from Asia, and constant bombings of the key railroad intersections would prevent internal food transportation. Even without a ground invasion, the Allies had enough air and naval superiority by then to do that much. Then, it would be a matter of waiting for the surrender - and knowing that the first people in Japan to starve to death would probably be the thousands of Allied POW’s.

Even as it was, there was a famine with thousands of deaths in the first months after the surrender. It eased only when MacArthur demanded of Congress, “Send me food or send me bullets.”

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More information available in this transcript of a talk given by a member of the U.S. Army Command and General Staff College in 1998.Interesting lecture
AlsoThis book might be worth your time.

My late father island-hopped all over the Pacific, and his unit would have been part of the invasion. As one who is opposed to the use of atomic weapons, but arguably wouldn’t be here to be upset by them if the two bombs hadn’t been used as they were, it puts me in a hell of a moral quandry.

Some people say that’s my normal state, though…