That’s the kind of fiscal responsibility that a CiC needs.
It doesn’t have to be “active” sabotage. Staying on attack till the convention and then offering lukewarm support to Obama afterwards may be enough to do the trick. To
[quote myself]
(http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9616935&postcount=327) from a few pages back in this thread:
Elvis, I appreciate that you have at least finally answered the question of how you see Clinton getting the nomination: some unknown and very bad skeleton is unearthed in Obama’s closet which makes him so unelectable that the supers (and perhaps the pledged delegates) go over to Clinton. And that is not an impossibility even given how little lasting impact Wrightgate had.
And you believe that such a possibility is worth Clinton staying in the race no matter what. No matter how much harm such may cause to the party overall at some hypothetical point. Fair 'nuff.
Except. and
If she, say “suspended her campaign” after an insufficient performance in PA, and such news was then unearthed, she could still rise to the occasion. It is for exactly that kind of circumstance that the supers are free and that pledged delegates are not completely pledged but free to vote otherwise under extraordinary circumstances.
She has that path open even if she doesn’t try to play out the make Obama lose motiff.
I’ve said it many times before, DSeid. Congratulations on finally deciding to pay attention instead of hurl invective. HW, you could follow that example too (yes, once the nomination’s decided, there undoubtedly will be FL and MI delegates seated - now go back and read more carefully, willya?).
As to why she should stay in, even discounting the possibiility of something happening as you so desperately hope, scroll look at the Rasmussen poll numbers I *also * previously posted. Do pause for a moment, then, and reconsider your continued assertion that her campaign is about “making Obama lose”, as if he is simple unable to do so on his own. Not everything bad that happens to him is her fault, ya know.
And that is why they just might notice that there are still more whites than blacks by far, especially the lower-income ones who are most heavily attracted to Clinton, that there are about as many Hispanics, also heavily attracted to Clinton (and a faster-growing group as well), and that they are both far more at risk of going Republican instead, and that beating McCain is going to take more than just not being Republicans themselves. As political animals, wouldn’t you expect their decision to be based on winning in November? Yes, it’s a cold business at times - if you want to win, and if you don’t win, so what anyway?
You may wish to be more careful than that about making assertions “flatly” - that does have a tendency to rebound later on.
We now return you to the daily Two Minutes Hate, already in progress …
And who do you suppose is responsible for that, Elvis?
Given that most of the hate for her around these parts is coming from people on her own side of the fence politically, I have a hard time thinking that it’s the Vast Right-Wing Conspiracy™ that has managed to convince so many people around here to join in condemnation of her.
I submit that she has no one to blame but herself for the way people feel about her.
Boy, you’re really working hard at missing my point, aren’t you?
The key word in what I said was ‘stealing.’ Blacks have voted for a lot of white Dems over the years, and I have little doubt that a lot of whites will vote for this particular black Dem.
Where that happy cooperation would break down is if one group had reason to believe the nomination was stolen from their guy. Particularly if this was going to be their breakthrough moment in national politics, where one of their group had overcome a long history of discrimination to win the big prize.
I stand by my assertion.
Ah, the spirit of GD, at its best: insult your opponents as a group.
Duh. That nasty upstart Obama and his massive army of zombie Obamanites, of course! Geez…
I agree. Going into the campaign, my preferred candidate was Edwards but I could have lived with Hillary had she ever renounced and apologized for her Iraq vote. Still, I could have held my nose and voted for her had she been the nominee. It was only when she fell behind and went negative that I began to actively dislike her. When Operation Kitchen Sink went into operation for Ohio and Texas, dislike turned to utter contempt and now she makes Cheney seem like a teddy bear. I sincerely hope her and Bill disappear from the national stage forever when she drops out.
And, if you would kindly scroll and look and had pointed out that I had actually cited those Rasmussen numbers to you. As you can see she is back down to 42% and he is back up to 47-48% …
So I really do not get your point here. Nor did you respond mine: if that something happened (the pictures of him doing lines with Osama or some such) then nominating Hillary would still occur even if she had “suspended her campaign”.
Hell, I could have lived with Hillary even without that; for a couple of months in there, she, not Obama, was my second choice after Edwards. I figured that by 2009, global warming and domestic issues would be the front-burner concerns, and the reality of Iraq would force anyone who hadn’t drunk the Kool-Aid into similar paths. And even now, I prefer Hillary’s UHC plan to Obama’s pseudo-UHC plan.
For me, it was a number of things. Too many surrogates toying with the race card during the NH through FL period for it to be coincidence, IMHO. The realization that not only did Patti Solis Doyle fuck up Hillary’s campaign through Super Tuesday, but that she was given the opportunity to do so after having made a mess of the finances of Hillary’s 2006 Senate run. (Hillary was all but unopposed in 2006, and should have been able to transfer a huge pot of money from her Senate campaign to her Presidential campaign. But Solis Doyle spent far more money than she had any business doing, resulting in Hillary’s only being able to transfer a small pile of money over. And this is who Hillary put in charge of her Presidential campaign. Ready on Day One, my ass.) And there was the long string of states that Didn’t Matter, as Team Hillary told us repeatedly. You just don’t go around dissing most of the electorate.
That’s an illusion. Hillary may drown the occasional kitten; Cheney just bites their heads off.
I think Hillary is letting the ideal get in the way of the possible. If UHC for everyone isn’t politically possible, then I’d rather shoot for Obama’s position of making it available but not mandatory. The trouble is, Hillary’s name is so closely associated with her disasterous attempt at health care in the 1990s that Republican opposition to whatever she proposes is virtually assured.
Obama has double digit lead nationally
He has managed a 21 pt. swing in under 2 months. Incredible. And this is even after the ridiculously irrelevant Wright “controversy”.
And it is now official, Senator Amy Klobuchar Endorses Barack Obama
This is absolutely true. Early in the campaign, I knew I was an Obama supporter, but I also felt that Clinton was someone I could rally behind.
This changed. The way she has run her campaign has just been appalling.
+1
I like her plan as well and am all for UHC but, for as much faith as I have of her getting it past a Republican filibuster, it may as well be the 2009 Buy Jophiel A Unicorn Act.
I was more turned off by when she insulted my intelligence directly. Once with her asinine “Gee, I’m too busy to release my taxes!” bullshit and again with her “Get real!” remark to Obama’s supporters (along with the “waiting for a celestial choir…” remark). If you think I’m too stupid and brainwashed to make an intelligent voting choice, Hillary, then you sure as hell don’t need me voting for you.
In Orwellian terms, the fight for the Dem nomination is descending into Perpetual War.
Looks like Oceania and Eastasia will be battling it out through the convention.
True dat. My hopes are more set on 2011 than 2009, and who knows whether the differences between their positions in 2008 make a difference then.
Indeed. Like she doesn’t know we know she has staff to deal with shit like this? How long does it take her secretary to call her accountant, get the returns, scan them, and send the PDFs to the person managing their website? Sheesh.
My sentiments as well.
From The Politico:
And Elvis, this might interest you:
Hey, maybe that celestial chorus is what Hillary figures will win her the nomination?