From St. Paul to Minneapolis by rail

Factual Questions
1

Are there any railroad historians out there?

I’m wondering about the routes passenger trains took between the Twin Cities. There is now only one obvious route: Southwest from downtown St. Paul, then West almost parallel to St. Clair Avenue, then gradually back Northwest, then across the river. But for decades there were four railroads that served the two cities: The Northern Pacific, The Milwaukee Road, The Great Northern, and the Chicago and North Western. (The current Amtrak route is partially along this line, but doesn’t cross the river until much further North.)

I know the Milwaukee Road did not take the obvious route initially; rather it continued Southwest, crossed the river at Ft. Snelling, just Northeast of the airport, and then turned Northwest past Minnehaha Falls, paralleling Hiawatha Avenue to it’s own terminal along Washington Ave. in downtown Minneapolis. But it built a"short line" bridge further north across the Mississippi in the 1880s, which connected it to the terminal, it’s yards North of Lake Street along Hiawatha Ave., and it’s mainline westward, which ran a block north of, and parallel to, Lake Street. This “shortline” bridge still connects to the single obvious line that I referred to on the St. Paul side of the river.

In the twentieth century the other three railroads all used Minneapolis Union Station

The most famous railroad bridge across the Mississippi leading to Union Station (just north of the current Post Office; its now the site of the Federal Reserve Bank) is the “Stone Arch Bridge” built for the Great Northern in 1883 just at St. Anthony Falls. Its connection to the obvious route is clear. Which makes me think that the obvious route is the Great Northern Route.

But the Northern Pacific was built before the Great Northern, so I wonder if the obvious route might not have been NP rather than GN. Where did it first cross the river? All I know is that a second NP bridge was built across the river in 1924, to replace the “A Line” bridge and trackage that went directly through what is now the University of Minnesota’s East Bank campus, North of the 1924 bridge. That new bridge was directly connected to the line that naturally led to GN’s Stone Arch Bridge on the East side of the river, and led to Union Station on the West side.

My question? Did the NP and the GN originally have different routes through St. Paul to the river?

And I’ve got no clue about the Chicago North Western route.

Was there a commonly held right of way for the three that varied from time to time?

I would note that the Stone Arch Bridge also carried GN’s freight mainline, while the NP’s freight trains never crossed the river at Minneapolis. The two had large yards on either side of the river, but the GN’s large freight yard south of downtown Minneapolis has been redeveloped, and the current BNSF (formerly NP) yard in Columbia Heights is busier than ever.

By the way, twothings. If you Google Earth the twin cities, and check railroads and wikipedia, you’ll get most of this history, and the geography becomes more obvious. Second, I Googled and Googled and didn’t get an answer. Just so you know.

2

The CNW train was probably the Twin Cities 400, which ran the slightly more than 400 miles from downtown Chicago to Minneapolis in as many minutes.

Wikipedia says:

3

I’d guess this is a better remit for a local historian with a sub-specialty in rail history.

4

In the late 1950s, GN, NP, C&NW, CB&Q, and CGW all used the GN route via the Stone Arch Bridge.

The Rock Island, Soo, and Milwaukee Road used the “Short Line” via the bridge next to Shriners Hospital, then turned northwest on the Milwaukee’s Hiawatha Avenue line to the downtown Minneapolis stations.

After Midway station opened in 1978, Amtrak trains ran via the MT yards from the Short Line to the NP, but continued to cross the Stone Arch bridge and run through the NP station. From 1981, they’ve used the NP freight line to stay entirely east of the river.

You can find details in Passenger Train Journal March and April 1990 issues.

5

Mr Downtown,
Thanks for your answer. I’m aware of the late 50s situation. I rode them. My question is where was the first NP bridge, was there an entirely different line to it in1883 when the Stone Arch Bridge was built, and why did they build a second bridge in 1924 if they could use the Stone Arch Bridge? Why build two bridges across the Mississippi at Minneapolis and St. Paul, only for passenger traffic? There is little if no evidence of the the first (except that the line was the southern border of the old University campus Wikipedia tells us), and they built a second one in 1924 to allow for University expansion, so their plan wasn’t to use the Stone Arch Bridge. What was the NP mainline route those days if it didn’t use the Stone Arch Bridge? Is there a link to Passenger Train Journal?

Gotpassword,
Yup, the 400 was the train. Do you know it’s Wisconsin station stops? Wyeville looks like that is where it crosses the Milwaukee Road, and continues on to Eau Claire. Is that right? Do you know what “Omaha Road” means? It doesn’t seem to make sense in this context.

6

Looks like I left off the wiki page about the 400 - it does have a very basic route map and links to the Omaha Road line, but there’s not a whole lot of info there.

You may have better luck with the CNW Historical Society: http://www.cnwhs.org/ch_spmo.htm and they have a large collection of historical questions and their answers. You can also ask questions there: Chicago & North Western Historical Society - FAQs

7

The first NP bridge was where the BNSF Nicollet Island bridge is today, just upstream from Hennepin Avenue.

Bridge #9 gave easier access to the NP yards for freight traffic, though of course it was reconstructed a bit upstream when the tracks were moved into the trench through Dinkytown. Passenger trains don’t seem to have used Bridge #9 normally.

In 1958, “400” streamliners via Milwaukee called at Eau Claire, Merrillan, Wyeville, Adams, South Beaver Dam, Milwaukee, and Racine. C&NW 400s via Madison called at Eau Claire, Merrillan, Wyeville, Elroy, Reedsburg, Baraboo, Madison, and Janesville.

8

Mr. Downtown–

Thanks for the info re the “400.”

I’m a little unsure of your NP ideas. The bridges I’m talking about are the Stone Arch (GN), the old “A-line” (NP’s first bridge across the Mississippi between Minneapolis and St. Paul), and bridge #9, (the second NP bridge built between St. Paul and Minneapolis, built in 1924). They are or were all on the eastern side of Union Station.

The bridge across Nicollet Island was indeed primarily an NP bridge, though it also linked the NP and the GN. However, it was on the western end of Minneapolis Union Station. A sharp right turn just at the end of the station platforms led westbound NP trains to the NP mainline across the river. If you zoom in on it on Google Earth you can still see the butt-end of the curve attached to the bridge. When Union station was razed, so was the rest of the curved part of the bridge. Similarly, when westbound GN trains left the station, they made a sharp left turn to the GN mainline west of the river, going southwest past what is now Target Field, through a now redeveloping freight yard just north of Interstate 394, St.Louis Park, and on to the next station-stop, Wayzata out on Lake Minnetonka.

The freight and general mainline of the NP was always on the east side of the Mississippi, as is St. Paul. Thus, bridge #9 was unnecessary for NP freights. They never had to cross the Mississippi to get the the big NP yard in the region, which is on the east side of the river, partially in NE Minneapolis, but mostly in the first ring suburb of Columbia Heights. That is now one of three large BNSF yards in the metropolitan area. So Bridge #9 had nothing to do with freight access to that yard.

Closer inspection on Google Earth might show the remnants of a rail line south of Bridge #9 through the U of M campus, and westward across the Mississippi then along the river to the MPLS main Post Office and Union Station.

At this point I’m guessing that east of the university, the GN, NP, CB&Q, and C&NW, all used basically the same route from St. Paul to Minneapolis, but for some reason the NP preferred it’s own bridge across the Mississippi well into the 20th century, rather than use the Stone Arch Bridge, as they eventually did. Any dissenters?

9

The first Nicollet Island bridge was how the St. Paul & Pacific got to Mpls. It was a predecessor to GN, not NP.

The predecessor to Bridge #9 was for the St. Paul & Northern Pacific, an NP ancestor. I get the impression that NP didn’t run across the Stone Arch Bridge until well into the 20th century.

Remember that passenger trains weren’t the only business for these railroads. They wanted the grain and flour loadings—and that happened a mile east of where the passenger station was.

See if this 1888 map helps.