I should point out that, at least in New York State, a third party vote helps them stay on the ballot. Furthermore, the main candidates can run for third parties, as well, and a vote for them counts all ways across, so voting for Bush in the Patriot Party counts as much as voting for him in the Republican Party. On the other hand, the Libertarians and Greens are very slowly moving towards challenging the Dems and Pubs. If it wasn’t for '00, the Greens might be at 5 percent, and the Libs are around 2 and holding as it is.
I don’t see how this could hurt any process. Having options within candidates is a GOOD thing. The electoral college is what is hurting the process. I’d rather see 10 major candidates with different positions on issues, then just 2 of them. Right now, one of them wants to tell us how to run our lives, the other is undecided in telling us how to run our lives, but the third wants us to decide for our selves how to run our lives without interupting how other live theirs. Clearly having more then 2 options is a good thing. The electoral process is fraudulent and prevents a third party from ever getting a chance, even if the people want them to in the years to come.
The third one.
A drop in the bucket vote won’t make a single difference. Well, except in Florida 4 years ago, when it could have changed the shape of the world. The thing people don’t realize is that any state could be another Florida this year (without the plastic flamingos, of course). I live in Massachusetts. It’s nearly a forgone conclusion that we will go Kerry this time. But I remind myself that we haven’t had a democrat in the governor’s mansion for 16 years now. There are significant numbers of Republicans in this state to elect conservative governors, so there are enough to elect a conservative president.
I’ll say it again – Any state is a potential swing state. Yes, your vote does count. In the most important election of our lifetimes, it’s good to remember that.
I agere the electoral college is the problem. I thought I made that clear. Perhaps saying a third party hurts the process isn’t exactly how I should’ve said it. What I meant was that the people who live in swing states should be more aware of how important their vote is in a close election and should avoid third parties at least until we get rid of the electoral college.
I’m not gonna get into a party bash for those who voted Nador in the swing states and then the state went to a candidate by only a few votes. That’s part of the problem. For those voting in a close race…if you decide to NOT vote. That’s part of the problem.
For those who think one is as bad as the other…well I don’t know what to tell ya. Write your congressman and tell him to get rid of this damned electoral college.
I wish my vote had the power that yours does. My state is already a given I’m afraid. I asked once about voting in another state but that thread got locked.
anyway…well see what happens. good luck y’all 
Do you really believe that Bush might lose Texas?
Care to make a wager on that?
Even though…I’m still gonna vote. There’s a lot more on the ballot than just the POTUS.
How much? How about a case of Shinerbock? 
If Kerry wins Texas I’ll buy you a case of Bock every year he’s in office.
Hell I’ll buy you one for every year he’s alive. If not…you da man. One case only.
The chances are very, very slim, agreed. But anything is possible. Texas has had Democratic governors before, no?
I’ll still take the beer, though.
All it takes is enough people thinking, “Everyone else is going to vote the same way I would so I might as well stay home.”
It’d be pretty funny if all the Republicans in Texas thought that. 
Texas was a diehard Democrat state until Reagan/Bush era came about. A lot of Texans for some reason think GHWB and family are a bunch of good ol’ boys.
The rest just have money and know what side of their bread gets buttered.
Before the last couple of decades Texas had been strictly Democrat since the civil war…hell I guess you could say forever. I think we’d had a strictly Dem. congress until only recently.
I guess what comes around goes around or is the other way around.
and wtf do ya mean you’ll take the beer…
You give, I take. Couldn’t be simpler. It ain’t rocket surgery!
So, tdn, you don’t put any stock in polls of likely voters that consistently show at least a 20% lead for Kerry in Massachusetts? You think that 20% of voters are going to suddenly change their minds?
In 2000, we knew Florida was going to be a swing state. Nobody surprised that the vote was close there. How many times have there been upsets were the poll results predicted the wrong candidate in a non-swing state?
As has been pointed out, continuity eror is wrong in his assertion that a candidate can exceed 50% of the popular vote nationwide without gaining a single electoral vote. But the error is minor in comparison to the significance of the following fictitious anecdote:
Funny old world, ain’t it, that can accommodate such an outcome?
I put stock in them, but realize that they’re not 100% accurate, nor do I think that margin of lead absolves me of showing up and being part of that 20%.
Good for you I agree for the most part. And after this election I am done with it all. Fuck em all.
Huh? And your local races? Will your state legislatures be decided by a margin of 200,000 votes? What about your county offices and city councilpersons?
Jesus fucking Christ, this pisses me off more than almost anything else; people ignoring their local elections when in many cases, they make a more significant difference in your life than the president. There’s more than Kerry and Bush: there’s your national representatives, your state and local races, ballot initiatives, and so forth.
But if you’re the kind of person who needs to be told that, I suppose it’s best that you not exercise your right to vote.
Captain Amazing, it’s absolutely love to see that you don’t give two ripe shits about transportation funding, or hospital funding, or state park funding, or any other funding issue on the ballot (there was at least one more), or how we replace elected officials if something happens to them, or your elected - but not by you - officials. Really.
Just make sure you don’t raise a single voice to complain about any of those issues in the next four years, because you abdicated your right to do so by not casting a vote. And thanks, on behalf of this person who’s really tired of Bush, for doing your part to say “Eh, I don’t care” … because regardless of what you say, it’s how you vote that says you don’t give two ripe shits.
I decided awhile back to vote for Kerry, and so I will. I don’t like everything about the man, but that would hold true for no matter who was running. Considering the last four years, I figure someone else deserves a shot at the job more than Bush deserves a second term.
One other thing interests me about this race being so close, and that’s the distinct possibility that the popular vote and the electoral vote will again conflict. A repeated instance of that and the following wrangling and teeth-gnashing might just light a fire to change the process. Of course, being a west coast voter, I’d like to see all national races unannounced and unpolled until the polls have closed in Hawaii.
And as been pointed out so well, there’s plenty of state and local issues to vote on, and I definitely don’t see those as a waste of time.
Cynicism’s fine. But reaching a point where you simply won’t vote doesn’t communicate that cynicism at all. It merely tells the weasels that you’ll take what they give and like it.
It isn’t cynicism. The OP is a nominal Republican and despairs of the choice between:
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The unsuitable incumbent; and
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Any Democrat.
A voter of independent mind would not be troubled thus.
As a voter of no party and independent mind, I sure was.
About 6 months ago I decided that I wasn’t going to vote for Bush, but Kerry didn’t impress me. For 6 months, I looked for reasons to support Kerry and found very few.
Because of that, and because of the constant vitriol againest Bush(who I don’t consider to be Evil), I decided that Kerry didn’t deserve my vote either. (For the record, I’m sick of the anti-Kerry BS as well, but Bush at already lost my vote so it didn’t matter as much).
I voted for Badnarik because he didn’t make me feel sick to my stomach at the mere thought of voting for him. I’m fully prepared for the fact that I’ve commited the cardinal sin this election year of not voting for the OBVIOUS CHOICE FOR SANE, THINKING, MORAL PEOPLE™, but then again, the people who feel like that are not the kind of people I particulary like. My vote is owed to nobody and not voting for your guy is not a vote for the opponent.