Fuck the modern office as security obsesses prison camp

The BBQ Pit
121

[QUOTE=D_Odds]
I have noticed at many of my clients offices that the women’s restroom is either behind the security door (restricted area) or if in an unrestricted area, locked. Some, like my current client (not the only one, though), have the women’s restroom behind the security door, while the men’s is outside by the elevators and unlocked.
[/QUOTE]
I’ve been puzzled through this whole thread - why aren’t the bathrooms inside the work area? Why are they ‘out by the elevator’ in the first place?

I’ve never worked in a multi-story office building. Are they all made this way?

122

[QUOTE=NinetyWt]
I’ve been puzzled through this whole thread - why aren’t the bathrooms inside the work area? Why are they ‘out by the elevator’ in the first place?

I’ve never worked in a multi-story office building. Are they all made this way?
[/QUOTE]
Not all.

My current client has the women’s room in the work area, and an unlocked men’s room by the elevator banks.

My employer has both bathrooms in the work area.

Previous clients have had both bathrooms by the elevator banks.

It’s based on building design, as any floor I visit in these buildings have the bathrooms in the same place on the floor.

The only common thread I’ve noticed is that when women’s rooms are not behind locked office doors, the bathroom is locked in some manner.

123

[QUOTE=D_Odds]
The only common thread I’ve noticed is that when women’s rooms are not behind locked office doors, the bathroom is locked in some manner.
[/QUOTE]

That’s not how it is here. Both the men’s and the women’s are fully accessible from the elevator area.

124

[QUOTE=acsenray]
That’s not how it is here. Both the men’s and the women’s are fully accessible from the elevator area.
[/QUOTE]

New data point!

125

Yes, a new data point, but one that doesn’t change the analysis. Passcard entry is required only when returning from the restroom to the work area.

126

Which, as I’ve pointed out, means it is not used for monitoring movement. Can’t tell if you took a 30 second piss or a 3 hour lunch, as they don’t know when you exited. (Not a point you raised, ascenray)

127

Thank you D_Odds.

128

[QUOTE=Larry Mudd]
Maybe it’s just because I’m a network admin and therefore some sort of high-functioning autistic by definition, but I feel a sad mixture of pity and frustration when users complain about password complexity requirements. Is it really so hard?

We need mixed case and one non-alpha character, changed every quarter. I suggest pass phrases that contain proper nouns and a number. (Eg; “Leopold Bloom has one cheating wife” –> LBh1cw, or “Gregor Samsa is one big bug” –> GSi1bb, or “Nicoli Gogol has one big nose” –> NGh1bn, or “Michael Scott has two big balls,” etc..)

It’s easy to remember a password like this without subverting the entire purpose of network security. Leaving your credentials out in the open is ridiculously irresponsible.
[/QUOTE]

It’s not hard, but it’s a pain in the ass. When I get to work, I want to log in to my computer and start working. I’ve got everything that needs to get done today on my mind and I’d like to jump in and get started. But I can’t, because my computer insists I put everything else on hold and think up a new password right then and there. I need to mentally disengage from my to-do list to think up a new password. Some mornings it’s all I can do to remember my current password, much less think up a new one.

I also need to log into FileMaker, where there is the same problem of needing to think up a new password before I can start working.

It wouldn’t be so bad if I could get my computer login password and my FileMaker password synchronized, but the programs never prompt me for fresh passwords on the same day. They’re usually about a month apart. I need to think of new passwords for each 3 times a year, which basically amounts to me trying to think up new passwords every other month. Which is a ridiculous.

After having a rotation of words and number combinations, I surrendered and started using [capitalized word][number] for both. Only the number changes every time I’m prompted for a new password.

My problem isn’t that I have to think of a complex password. Mostly, what I hate is that the new password creation acts as a barrier to my getting things done. The complexity requirements are just salt in the wound. Yeah, our IT department probably changes their system passwords just as often. The difference is they don’t use FileMaker like the rest of us, and they don’t have the daily deadlines we do. Their stuff can wait until tomorrow or next week or six months from now. Ours can’t. Having to stop to think up a new password (with capital letters! And a number! And a punctuation mark!) can mean the difference between remembering to send an important email on time and totally forgetting. It would be much, much better if I was prompted for new passwords when I was quitting the program or logging out.

By the way, that phrase thing would never work for me because multiple-word phrases have greater potential for misremembering than single words.

129

[QUOTE=shiftless]
If Americans are allowed to move about freely then the terrorist will win. The only way to save our freedom is to take it away. Why do you hate America?
[/QUOTE]

I started reading this thread on a whim and I became rather fascinated by it for I think it gives a rather candid glimpse into the current America mind-set. Amazing observations can be made, especially taking into account that the SDMB is (if you’re to believe the victims anyway) some sort of bastion for all-around social liberalism.

I mean the whole pile-on on the OP is simply unreal. Seems like everyone’s responding to his swipe-card-to-pee illustrative example and ignoring his major point. Namely that you’re becoming (or have already) a nation of paranoid sheeple who are afraid of your own shadows.

Holy shit! BushCo really did win!

In case it needs to be said there were/are some obvious exceptions, OP and quoted post included – which I enjoyed for it says pretty much what I’m saying, only better and succinctly. But the scary part is that they are clearly in the minority.

Guessing US-style Compounds* are going to become all the rage in the very near future. :eek:

McCain’s got a much bigger chance than I ever imagined.

*Think above ground, heavily fortified and armed bunkers. Well no need to imagine really…like the one owned by that polygamist sect that’s in the news.

Welcome to the SDMB, shiftless. Trust you enjoy your stay.

130

[QUOTE=AudreyK]
It’s not hard, but it’s a pain in the ass.
[/QUOTE]

Some help for this issue of passwords. We also require monthly password changes where I work. I am in IT and have to do some of the password resets when the regular network admin isn’t available. I personally am a fan of long passwords that are easily typed (mostly because you type them regularly) vs. regular password changes, but it is hard to change peoples minds from what the industry group think is.

In any case, think up a base password that is easily typed and follows the guidlines put in place by the security nazis. Then add to that the year eg. 8, followed by the month eg. 04 or apr. Your password should look something like this: !Xxxxxx804. Every month just change that last 3 characters while leaving your base password the same. Easy to remember even if you go on vacation because you just have to remember the last month you changed it. If you are wrong, just use a bracket technique to find the correct one. You can use variations of this technique for different applications: ^Filemaker804

131

[QUOTE=D_Odds]
Workplace surveillance has identified people stealing from employers, has identified criminals stealing from workplaces, and also has found pissed-off idiots pissing off into coffee pots.
[/QUOTE]

So, because some small percentage of people will engage in bad acts, that justifies constant surveillance of everyone? We’re all presumed criminals? How is this any different from letting the government constantly monitor everyone’s movements? The result in society is essentially the same.

132

[QUOTE=RedFury]
Holy shit! BushCo really did win!
[/QUOTE]
Nice try, but I needed a pass card to enter my workplace long before Bush was president - unless you are talking the first Bush presidency. Actually, the doors to my workplace (private office) were secured even back to the Reagan presidency - though at that time the place where I worked didn’t have lobby security. Also, while there is now lobby security here at my client’s office, and at my own office, we are not in armed compounds. All the private security people are unarmed.

Are you surprised and aghast that private offices don’t want their doors open to the general public?

133

[QUOTE=acsenray]
So, because some small percentage of people will engage in bad acts, that justifies constant surveillance of everyone? We’re all presumed criminals? How is this any different from letting the government constantly monitor everyone’s movements? The result in society is essentially the same.
[/QUOTE]
Option A-no surveillance. Next to impossible to apprehend the actor, unless he/she is stumbled upon.
Option B-surveillance. The honest folks go about their business, and were they accused, surveillance can vindicate them. The bad people are observed, so appropriate measures can be taken.

It’s not that everyone is a presumed criminal, but all people do have criminal potential. Some go through life without ever crossing the line, others occasionally do improper things, and still others make it a lifestyle.

If I’m in a government building, surveillance wouldn’t be surprising. Some areas of cities that have been identified as high crime areas also have surveillance. The quality of my life is in no way diminished by my non-criminal activities being observed, particularly when the same surveillance assists the authorities with catching and punishing lawbreakers.

The trooper’s radar scans all the vehicles. I’m only doing 70, so nobody cares. You’re doing 85, so you get a citation and fine.

134

[QUOTE=acsenray]
So, because some small percentage of people will engage in bad acts, that justifies constant surveillance of everyone? We’re all presumed criminals? How is this any different from letting the government constantly monitor everyone’s movements? The result in society is essentially the same.
[/QUOTE]

How did we move from locking doors to debating surveillance rights? Or do you believe the pass is being used to track your movements?

My employer is not a government entity. They own/lease the property, and have the right to decide upon the surveillance. They must follow the law (e.g. no cameras in bathroom stalls), but beyond that, they have as much right to surveil their property as you do your own home.

Regarding workplace surveillance, it is time consuming, expensive, and non-profitable. Bosses who constantly review tapes are raging assholes. However, when you do get complaints about a weird taste in the coffee and find that it is because some guy has been pissing in it (real situation, in case someone is wondering), it is very good at providing “beyond a reasonable doubt”.

The ‘government’ can monitor your movements. I’m assuming you were born in the late 20th century sometime - they’ve always been able to monitor your movements. Year over year, it just becomes easier and they can handle more data. Unless you switch to all cash (including getting paid in cash from an undocumented job), your movements can be followed. Personally, I’m not especially happy that if they were to find my metrocard, ez-pass, and credit card, someone could probably figure out when and where I took my last dump, but that is how soceity has evolved. It isn’t turning back. Again, the only thing in our favor is that it is expensive and time-consuming, even with modern technology, to monitor every Tom, Dick, and Harriet. They can’t even proactively track paroled and probationary convicts effectively…yet. Technology is producing some very scary ways for people to be tracked (embedded RFID anyone?). I don’t doubt that this ability will be abused, both in the private and public sectors.

So the question is, at what point does surveillance go over the line. If I’m a 7-11 franchisee, I want to prevent as much as possible losses due to stealing, both by employee and customer. As a homeowner, perhaps I want motion sensitive cameras (I only have motion-sensitive lights right now) on my doors and windows, especially those not viewable from the street. Unfortunately, the same technology can be used to tape the girl’s shower at the HS. Are we going to stop technology? Are we going to outlaw its use so that the camera at my back door is as illegal as the camera in the girl’s locker room? Are we going to tell a business owner that he can’t watch over his investments?

For the record, yes, I do assume everyone is guilty until proven innocent. Fortunately, I work on the “preponderous of evidence” standard versus “beyond a reasonable doubt”. As I am not a judiciary except where my children are concerned, I’m allowed to do so. :cool:

135

[QUOTE=RedFury]
I mean the whole pile-on on the OP is simply unreal. Seems like everyone’s responding to his swipe-card-to-pee illustrative example and ignoring his major point. Namely that you’re becoming (or have already) a nation of paranoid sheeple who are afraid of your own shadows.
[/QUOTE]

Apparently, we’re not the worst. According to some news reports I’ve read/heard, the United Kingdom is the most electronic monitored society in the world. If you drive in central London, video cameras automatically record your number plate. If you litter in public parks (I forget where … Leeds or somesuch?), a public official who’s monitoring by video will offer you a reminder through a public address system to properly dispose of your trash.

136

[QUOTE=Uzi]
In any case, think up a base password that is easily typed and follows the guidlines put in place by the security nazis. Then add to that the year eg. 8, followed by the month eg. 04 or apr. Your password should look something like this: !Xxxxxx804. Every month just change that last 3 characters while leaving your base password the same. Easy to remember even if you go on vacation because you just have to remember the last month you changed it. If you are wrong, just use a bracket technique to find the correct one. You can use variations of this technique for different applications: ^Filemaker804
[/QUOTE]
This definitely helps, but in my security-crazed former workplace, we had some issues with passwords, too. I had about 12 different passwords I used daily for different systems, plus another 10 more for systems I’d use occasionally. Average employees, I believe it was about 8 or 9. Each had different complexity requirements. Because some systems were older, they wouldn’t change but would be set by someone else to something strange and obscure. Others would change quarterly, most would change monthly but they were all on different schedules. I couldn’t go three or four days without changing a password. Others couldn’t accept uppercase characters or symbols. Others required them. Some could be no longer than 8 characters, some at least 8 characters. It was a mess. Nobody that I knew of was able to handle all this without keeping a piece of paper or a file around with all of the passwords.

It was pretty obscene. For one password, we ended up having to set 5 (!) security questions. If you wanted the password, you had to get all 5 right (!) and they were all really stupid questions that it was easy to get wrong (e.g. What street do you live on? but the security questions were set a year before rollout of the system and the answers couldn’t change). Of course, if you were wrong a couple of times, it would lock you out and would require some form to be sent to some office. They’d unlock it, maybe. Eventually.

We had someone come in and lecture us to tell our employees to memorize all their passwords. The management staff nodded at him when he was there, then laughed behind his back.

All of this serves simply to create the illusion of security. It was so secure that employees couldn’t manage, so what happens? 90% of the employee base puts their passwords under their keyboards. The smart 10% does something slightly different but equally unsecure. Do you know how much time was wasted to deal with password issues? We could have easily had one or two full-time people dealing with password resets alone.