Apparently, furloughed federal workers are not permitted to get outside employment while they are not getting paid. What is the logic behind the rule? Potential conflict of interest? Are the rule-enforcers also furloughed? Who could possibly blame someone for, literally, putting food on the table by banging nails or delivering pizza? How long does one have to go unpaid before any “contract” is broken?
That’s a good point. The minute an employer failed to pay me what I was due would have been the end of the contract for me.
The worker contracts to provide time and skill, etc; while the employer contracts to pay for it.
Do you have a link to this rule somewhere?
They can claim unemployment benefit:
I’m not saying it’s incorrect, but I’ve never heard of that. I know many federal government workers (myself included) that have a second job. I didn’t get that job while on a furlough, granted.
Let me expand on the above – I don’t believe such a rule exists. There are general ethical guidelines for outside employment, and federal employees are reminded that those guidelines still apply even while they’re furloughed, but that does not amount to a blanket prohibition. Especially for something like banging nails or delivering pizza.
In fact, there are lots of human interest stories on a google search about federal workers contemplating getting 2nd jobs. Of course, it’s not always easy to just walk into a pizza place and get a job as a delivery driver; people might have kids to take care of at night; they might live in an area without a lot of job opportunities due to the nature of their employment; they might only be qualified to do work that would violate the aforementioned ethics rules; they might not be able to find an employer willing to hire someone who could go back to their “real” job at the drop of a hat. All of these limitations might mean that there’s an effective limitation on outside employment, but I don’t believe there’s a statutory one.
I don’t have a cite for the rule. I’m just going by what a federal employee being interviewed said. I seem to remember hearing the same thing during the last shut down.
In my state, they can’t do that if they’re still working full time, even if not being paid. Obviously whoever wrote the law on that never anticipated someone forced to work without pay. That’s usually prohibited by the 13th Amendment.
But that’s the point. They aren’t working.
What happens if they collect unemployment, when Congress finally pays them? They will eventially get paid, even though they aren’t working. Do they have to return the unemployment?
I think that’s why only furloughed workers can apply for unemployment benefits. If I read my furlough notice correctly, essential employees (i.e. working for no pay) are not eligible for unemployment benefits.
Also, my furlough notice does not say outside employment is prohibited. It just reiterates the standard rules about conflict of interest - e.g. I’m not allowed to work for a contractor for my agency.
Yes. They have to pay it back. At least in Virginia.
There is no guarantee that “non-essential” federal workers (those being furloughed) will be recompensated. If they are (by Congressional approval) then yes, they have to return unemployment benefits. As for outside employment, federal workers are not prohibited in general from holding second jobs, but they are prohibited from engaging in conflicts of interest, e.g. working for a federal contractor whose compensation or performance they could influence. Ditto for investments and undisclosed familial connections. Except for the Trumps, of course.
It should be noted that many “federal workers” are actually employees of contractors working under contract. Those who are furloughed get zero compensation, and many are at the lowest tier of salary or wage structure. There is absolutely no reason these people should be denied their living just because Congress can’t function and the President wants to have an infantile temper tantrum. Everybody involved should be working at least a temporary solution for a continuing resolution to keep people working. That Trump won’t even stay in a room to even make the pretense of bargaining shows just what an actually terrible negotiator he is.
Stranger
You apparently missed that I was talking about those who are still working, just not getting a paycheck for it.
I think they do.
A lot of federal employees have second jobs. There are strict rules about the source of secondary sources of income and relationships with government contractors. But it’s not uncommon for a federal employee to have an ownership stake in, say, a restaurant, or a property management company, or other small business, or to drive for Lyft.
To clarify - “furloughed” means not working. “Excepted” (“essential”) workers are working for no pay; those workers are not furloughed.
No I noticed that. I thought that essential personnel (who were still going to work) WERE getting paid, but they aren’t. So my bad on that.
Literally 10 minutes ago I watched a news story in which they interviewed federal employees who are taking second jobs to make ends meet. One was working as a bartender, another an Uber driver, and a third was delivering pizza.
mmm
I think the issue is that depending on the agency/position, many employees need approval to have outside employment and the officials they need to get the approval from are furloughed.* It wouldn’t affect those who don’t need permission and it wouldn’t affect those who already had permission. But those who need approval and take outside employment without it are possibly putting their Federal position at risk.
- And typically agencies that require approval have very rigid rules regarding the need for approval - you need approval for any outside employment , even to deliver pizza or drive for Lyft.
When the news reports how many federal workers aren’t working, are they using this definition? Because I am a contractor working under contract and I am NOT considered a “federal worker” in any sense of the phrase.
No. The numbers are 380,000 furloughed and about 420,000 working with no pay. These are federal employees only.
The number of contractors who are furloughed and laid off is much higher.