I pictured Daphne Slater as Queen Mary from ELIZABETH R when I was reading the book. Pic.
Game of Thrones - Noteable differences between the book and the show so far (chock full of spoilers)
OK, I have to agree about Robb’s hair. Starting in episode 2 or 3 his hair started taking on this totally ARTIFICIAL red tint to it. but only in back-lit scenes. It is this horrible brassy red tint on top or his dark brown hair. Why not just spend a few more bucks and get a good auburn dye job for Robb, Bran, and Rickon…thereby making them all look alike.
I was disappointed that Jon and Arya didn’t look more alike. If they made the other children all match it would have helped. Her looking like Stark women (i.e. Lyanna, Ned’s sister, which is mentioned in the books) and like Jon is one of the main arguments in the “Jon’s Parentage” argument! Jon’s coal black really clashes against the brown of Ned and Arya
I would have liked to see matching hair on Cersei and Jamie as well. Right now his is more towards the “Ash Blond” and hers runs closer to the "golden blond’ described in the book. Once again, spend a few buck and dye the 2 siblings and their 3 kids hair all the same, really !
This I understand. IIRC there was a lot of online discussion about these 2 during the publication of the first 3 books, with people on both sides of the argument defending their position (just-friends vs. lovers). It was that way until Martin final answered the question (after being asked many times) during one of his hundreds of well-paid personal appearances ( which he has done instead of actually WRITING the next book…not that I am bitter or angry, waiting 6 YEARS!!!) So if the readers took that long to figure it out, the directors of the show figured to hook us in with a little titilation by answering this question right off!
I’m confused. Shouldn’t Dany look pretty pregnant by now?
I thought she did a bit. I noticed it, anyway.
One difference I’ve noticed (that I’m sure others have as well) is that Tyrion looks more “cleaned up” in the show than in the book. He doesn’t have the mismatched eyes or have squashed features. And I think it’s an improvement - it makes him seem more Lannister-like. It helps justify the bit of authority he has over Bronn and the hill people, and it makes his initial devotion to his father and the Lannister name more believable.
Hey all! I’m currently reading through the books (most of the way through the 3rd) and am enjoying them so much I decided to subscribe to HBO and watch the series. I’ve only watched through episode 5, and I wanted to comment on some of the book/show differences.
It is interesting to see how the show handles expositional challenges - it is impossible to convey the story as comprehensively as the book does due to the inherent limitations of television and so the show has included certain scenes to meet this deficit. For example:
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There is a sex scene between Viserys and a whore which does not occur in the book. Viserys’s monologue on the history of the Targaryen dragons is actually given from the perspective of Tyrion in the novel. In the books Tyrion is a bit more scholarly than his television portrayal, and I seem to recall that he has a chapter more or less devoted to his study of dragons.
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There is a scene in the show where Robert and Cersei discuss their romantic history and, in particular, the threat of the Dothraki across the sea. As far as I recall this doesn’t occur in the book - although a very similar exposition on the threat the Dothraki pose to Westeros is given by Ser Mormont (sp?) when Danaerys asks him if Khogo’s followers could actually conquer the aforementioned.
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The dire wolves are a bit less dog-like in the novels (slightly larger and broader) and are generally more present in the story. For example: When Tyrion is returning south from his visit to the Wall, he is attacked by the direwolves when he pays court to Robb. It is a brief attack and the wolves are quickly recalled. Also, when Tyrion is heading towards the wall (in the company of Jon stark) - at a point during their dialogue Tyrion is threatened by ghost.
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The romance between Ronley and ser Loras is very jarring in the show. In the novels this was only vaguely hinted at (I didn’t pick up on it at all when I read through the first novel). Certainly there is no blow job scene.
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Sex scenes, although certainly present in the book, constitute a much larger proportion of the story in the show than they do in the novel.
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The Jamie-Eddard confrontation was much different in the novel. In the book, Eddard and his compatriots are on horseback, and Jamie never fights. I recall he just instructed his soldiers to kill Eddard’s men but take Eddard alive, then leaves. Eddard draws his sword to defend his men. Jorah (I forget his name, Eddard’s top bodygaurd) kills a bunch and is about to escape when he returns to save one of his fellows (he is then killed). Eddard’s horse is stabbed and it topples over, crushing his leg.
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The Bronn fight scene at the eyrie was a bit different. I seem to recall that Bronn’s opponent was a more elderly (although still esteemed) night. The setting of the fight was in a garden. Also, the ‘moon door’ was a vertical door inset into the wall in the novel - not a ‘well’ the floor.
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I was confused by Hodor’s casting decision. I may be wrong about this, but I thought Hodor was described as a younger man - in his late teens or early twenties.
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The show doesn’t seem to capture the extent of Khogo’s khaal - the impression of his army is much vaster in the book relative to the show.
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Tyrion and Aria are both less visually pleasant in the novel. Tyrion in particular has more offensive deformations - he is described as having a twisted leg (making it hard for him to walk) and miss-matched eyes. Aria is not a pretty in the novel, frequently described as being ‘horse-faced’.
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In the opening scene with the others, there is a long sword fight between the arrogant captain and the leader of the ‘others’. The night’s watchman that escapes is a scout who was asked to climb a tree prior to the appearance of the others in order to aerially scout for the missing corpses. In the show it seems like he is caught then released by the others - in the book he hides in the tree and then escapes after the others kill his fellows and leave.
All in all I’m really enjoying the show. Many of these differences are to be expected. I approve of the casting decisions.
[quote=“Ecap, post:106, topic:583205”]
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Yeah that was odd.
Well yes and no - from the wiki
(warning: some spoilers here)
Some other differences:
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Catelyn Stark’s journey through the various gates of the eyrie – this was totally absent in the show. In the book this was a truly harrowing chapter. In fact, at one point, where the path is a thin strand with vertiginous drops on either side, Catelyn almost turns back. This all suggests the impregnability of the eyrie, which is important as later in the story it justifies the inability of the northern king to force the Arryn’s to comply with a call to banners. In the show, there is no intervening scene between Catelyn’s group encountering the eyrie outriders and her attending her sister’s court.
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I envisioned the sky cell as a bit different in the book. In the show, it looks like a proper jail cell with one end open to the face of the cliff. Based on my reading, I had envisioned it more as a broad termini hewn roughly in rock barred on three sides with one face open to the cliff. More importantly, the floor was slanted, so Tyrion couldn’t even go to sleep without fearing he might roll off the edge. I don’t feel that the show adequately captured the horror of the sky cell.
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Odd casting decision for Catelyn’s sister. In the book, she was once beautiful but has since become corpulent.
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Not sure about this yet, but in the show Varys’s character, while well-done, seems a bit tamped down from the novel. When I read the novel, my impression was that he was a bit more formidable and grotesque.
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There have been many scenes which serve to give exposition on the history of the Greyjoys and the circumstances leading to Theon’s delegation as a ward of the starks. Although I might have missed it, I recall only very few expository references to the Greyjoys in book 1. In fact, the first chapter from Theon’s perspective didn’t occur until the beginning of book 2 (I forget whether the scene between him and the whore actually occurs in book 1). I understand this, though, as the audience has to have some context for understanding later betrayals in the story.
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Although I don’t disapprove, my impression from the novels was that the hound was a more mercurial, vicious, and energetic character. In the show he seems more withdrawn than I would have expected.
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(Very minor) The emblem of the hand of the king is a necklace of interlocking hands, not a pin
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Tyrion’s whoring is perhaps a bit over-emphasized in the show, although I can see why this is necessary. There is definitely no scene in the book where Jamie brings him a group of whores. I understand why they did this though, as it’s important to indicate the closeness between Jamie and Tyrion.
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There has been no mention of the Children of the Forest (I’m only up to ep5).
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There was a sexual aspect to Viserys’s abuse of Daenerys which I’ve yet to see in the show. I seem to recall numerous occasions where she was fondled by him.
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I’m worried that they might be overemphasizing Jamie as an antagonist. It will be interesting to see how they handle his later developments.
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In the opening scene north of the wall, the night’s watchmen are accosted by (what I believe to be) wights. In the book, they were others (with the crystal swords).
I’ve given a lot of minor critiques here so I’d like to say a word about what I think was done right. I hold the novels in very high esteem – and this has caused me to anticipate a dreadfully inadequate televised retelling. Overall, I’ve been impressed:
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I love the casting decisions. In particular, littlefinger (charismatic with the barest hint of dreadful cunning), Catelyn (a composed, aging beauty in an ugly world), the Winterfell castellan (I forget his name!! Rodrik? – they got him spot on, even with the side burns tied together!), Sansa (beautiful and insipid, but with good intentions), Eddard (strong and quiet, but just trusting enough to be blithe to the machinations taking place around him), the Lannisters (unusually beautiful and capricious, with the exception of Tyrion), Jon (a suitably identifiable protagagonist, will become very important), I’ve yet to make a decision on
Samwell… -
I can’t wait to see the portrayal of the Freys and their Twin fortresses. I’m also looking forward to the portrayal of moat cailin (sp?). I’m wondering how they’ll do Tywin Lannister, another key character.
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The directors have some very challenging casting decisions to make. Davos (one of my favorites!), Stannis, and Melisandre. Also, assuming we see a season
3… I have no idea how they are going to successfully cast Brienne.
Has anyone seen any reason for Hodor to be so different? The two casting decisions I think have made the least sense were Hodor and Lyssa.
Just completely different for no reason I can discern.
-Joe
Like Tyrion, I think Hodor is a case of getting the important detail (being a big guy) right, and not being too picky about the rest. His being rather young (about Robb and Jon’s age, IIRC) isn’t terribly important (at least up to the point where I’ve read in Clash).
How completely different can he be? He’s big and retarded and says Hodor.
[quote=“Ecap, post:108, topic:583205”]
(warning: some spoilers here)
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Didn’t you see the scene where he was sleeping and almost rolled off the edge, barely stopping himself? It captured the horror pretty well.
Far more furious and menacing in the book too. He’s really toned down in the show.
There was at least one scene where he was all over her body and twisting her nipples etc, but it was less sexual than borderline “I own you, now do as you are told” sadistic.
Discussed here http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/32521-official-casting-synopsis/page__p__1603412&#entry1603412
In the book she is represented as 6’3" or taller. Will be tough to cast.
In the book he’s this huge vigorous, young man-child. In the series he’s more like the Adams family’s “Lurch”. Unless having a huge flaccid penis was a go/no go casting issue there are any number of college football players that would have been a better physical choice for the role.
It doesn’t, nor does his scene with Osha.
I’ve read them all half a dozen times. That doesn’t affect his character in the slightest and picking a college football player would have been… unfortunate.
Shit, Sean Bean is almost 20 years older than Ned Stark. Making Hodor a bit younger doesn’t seem like it’d be worthwhile.
Ecap There’s more than one piece of jewelry for the hand. There is an emblem along with the necklace.
The Night’s Watch patrol is killed by the Others in the show. With the crystal swords too. Did you miss the decapitation?
I don’t think Varys was supposed to be grotesque.
I don’t think omissions are changes either. If you wanted everything from the books then you’d need at least another 10 episodes. It’s a different medium, different things will be shown.
[quote=“astro, post:112, topic:583205”]
I haven’t Tyrion has only just been put in the cell) - I shouldn’t have commented on this until I had seen that episode.
On Hodor - I would have liked a younger actor, football player or no. I agree that this is minor, but it’s still a needless deviation from the novels.
Yes, I saw the decapitation. Unless I’m mistaken, though, a distinctive feature of the wights were their bright blue eyes (it’s that little girl I’m thinking of).
When Varys is introduced in the novel, I recall a description emphasizing his silk clothes, sweaty hairlessness, cloying perfume and effeminate disposition - all in all a fairly repulsive combo.
Obviously, I don’t want everything in the books. I just think that a discussion of the differences makes for interesting conversation.
It’s only needless if you can find them a replacement that is better than the current one in every singly way. I affects the story not a bit, so… we’ll we’ve given it more attention than it deserves already.
Yes, the girl was a wight. The rest were the Others.
Which of those characteristics is different in the show? We don’t know how he smells, and he’s not fabulous, but that’s pretty much what I was expecting from him. I think a lot of these “changes” that I read here and elsewhere are more different interpretations rather than a change. You saw Varys different, I saw him this way. That doesn’t mean that the current guy is changed from the book, just that’s how the writers read him. George didn’t include portraits or anything.
You’re not up to Syrio yet?
I think it’s fair for us to pay attention. The directors and author have clearly put a tremendous amount of work into the show - if we didn’t scrutinize the details we’d be doing them a disservice. I’ll maintain that Hodors casting decision was a mistake, insofar as (1) its a pointless deviation from the book and (2) subsequently changes the texture of the story (albeit only a little).
Ah… at my point in the books (most of the way through 3) its not clear that the others collaborate with wights directly. It seems like they are both associated with a general increase in supernatural phenomena (birth of dragons, Melisandre’s magic, etc) and the coming over winter.
While I disagree that critiques of the show relative to the book boil down to differences in subjective interpretation, I think you’re right in pointing out that Varys isn’t obviously deficient in any important way from his portrayal in the novel. I think his character might have benefited from a more nuanced showing, though.
Yeah, I’ve seen the first ‘lesson’ between Arya and Syrio. I really liked it! One thing I remember from the book his that Ned has a denigrating attitude towards Syrio’s teaching methods - when he encounters Arya balancing on the stairs he says (or thinks? I forget) that some famous knight didn’t need to chase cats to learn to wield a sword…
I’m looking forward to the scene where Syrio defends Arya from the three knights.
Later in the books Varys is also shown to an absolute master of disguise and playing different roles, and the effeminate eunuch character is not necessarily, by any stretch, his “real” persona.