But looking at NK now, their own government doesn’t seem like it’s going to survive the peace either. Something’s gotta give here, and the native’s are growing restless.
But my understanding is that it was Kim Il Sung who had Stalin-like powers. Kim Jong Il is by analogy only a Khrushchev. If his leadership produces a major failure, he would be replaced by the second tier not vice versa.
You know something? I was just reviewing another thread about a year back that dealt with this topic, and I remember writing an opinion of what we could do to radically change the situation in NK peacefully and for the better. Reviewing what I posted, I realized that I still agree with it.
We could normalize relations with North Korea. We could meet them halfway on a few things, concede something here, help them with something else there. We could do whatever it takes to get an embassy in there!
Think about it. What’s the tone running through this thread as well as any other thread dealing with NK? Nobody knows what’s going on, because NK is such a closed society! The people there are starving and the government is desparate! We have no idea what they’ll do next!
Normalizing relations with NK would change all that. We could take some of the heat off them as far as the food crisis went. We could give them another way out. And we could put an embassy in Pyongyang.
Now once you have an embassy in a country, lots of things change. Suddenly, you’ve got fat and happy Americans running aroung Pyongyang. NK citizens will see the fat and happy Americans, and they’ll suddenly realize that not every American eats babies for supper while drinking their blood from wine glasses. Suddenly, NK citizens see stuff like Levis and Nikes and Raybans. Some of them might even acquire that stuff through clever bartering (although really, American citizens aren’t supposed to do that kind of stuff anywhere). The closed society suddenly gets pried open a little.
What’s more, when you get an American embassy into the country, you also get the CIA. Now we’re starting to learn a little bit about the most mysterious country on earth.
Is it a controversial idea? Sure it is. But what else has worked so far? Isolating them? Koreans are used to be isolated. Up until very recently, the entire peninsula went by the nickname of “The Hermit Kingdom,” a moniker it went out of its way to earn. Koreans are used to the “Us against the world” mentality. They’re used to hardship. Isolation isn’t going to get us very far. The best we could hope for is either for KJI to give up control voluntarily without any incentive (Good luck with that! KJI is very well aware of what happened to Erich Honecker, and he probably knows that his fate will be even more dismal), or for the country to eventually implode (and as I’ve stated above, this would be a Very Bad Thing for all concerned).
I think that there’s something to be said for normalizing relations. Of course, that doesn’t mean it’s going to happen.
Come to think of it, while he was at it, why didn’t he mention Cuba? 
Minor nitpick: although I agree, in principle, with this excellent idea*, I believe it was Burma that was referred to as the “hermit kingdom”.
*although I doubt that either the Americans or the NKeans would accept it- especially if the embassy got torched or the staff abducted by “rioters” (who would of course have no connection either to the government or to any radical faction of the military, and I would be shocked, shocked to hear anyone suggest such a thing) a la Iran. And while an embassy would have some positive effects, I doubt that a single building in Pyongyang will have that great an impact- Pyongyang does already get western visitors, albeit mostly journalists and aid workers, so they are not quite as isolated as the rural areas. In summary, it’s a good idea, but I think you’re overselling it.
Korea (old Korea), among others, not including (so far as I can find) Burma.
Burma/Myanmar, of course, probably merits the title now.
I’m not saying that it would easy, and I’m not saying that it would be quick, but I do believe that it would make a difference.
Sheridan: “This is not the voice of treason. These are your sons, your daughters, whose loyalties have never wavered; whose belief in this Alliance has forced us to take extraordinary means. For justice, for peace, for the future… we have come home.”
The way he says it carries more weight than the actual text.
I stand corrected. 
Good line, but it applies to NK how? I mean, the people of SK being the “sons and daughters” of a common Korean culture in no way improves their chances of surviving a war.
It’s good to keep in mind that South Korean does not view North Korea simply as a menance. They view it, in some ways, as a long lost brother or sisiter, with whom they want to be reunited. There are quite a few families, still alive to remember, who were divided by the separation. They don’t see their family members north as “evil.” When you use terms like “axis of evil,” you’re dehumanizing a lot of people. It’s kind of like the North and South of the Civil War in the U.S.
But how do North Koreans view SK?
Do you want to play a game. sure global thermo nuclear war. A game we all can play.
It is coming out now. One of our North korea problems is counterfitting. They have the same presses our mint uses and are copying our 100 dollar bills by the truckload. The cabal includes North Ireland and crime syndicates. It was mentioned in passing by Snow the other day.
They believe they can destroy our economy through counterfitting. Maybe they can. This may be the real anger problem we have.
Can they really keep up with all the things the Treasury Department has been doing, these past ten years or so, to make our currency harder to duplicate?
North Koreans view South Koreans as either “running dogs”, “lackeys” (These terms are mentioned quite a bit in NK propaganda) or abject slaves of the American imperialists. Their stated aim is to force “freedom” upon South Korea whether it wants it or not.
North Korean citizens, having no access to conventional media outlets, are quite convinced that South Korean citizens live in dire poverty in servitude to the occupying American forces and their South Korean puppet government.
At least that’s what comes through in the newspapers.
Actually, I think there is a really simple, almost blindingly obvious solution to your question. South Korea needs to “surrender” to North Korea. Perhaps SK crosses the DMZ waving the white flag.
Think about it. Kim has to accept the surrender based on everything he’s been telling his people. Yet, once he does, the collective delusion he maintains is instantly shattered. Once the NK people get a taste of plentiful food and Guild Wars, Kim would be overthrown almost overnight.
I see this as the classic sacrifice move to check and mate. What are the downsides? Maybe temporarily relocate the SK leadership to avoid unnecessary bloodshed. With some planning, this is essentially a perfect bloodless coup.
Man, talk about melodrama, considering the South Korean military is almost superior to the NK military forces in every way possible, with twice the population of the North. US forces are negligible, since most of the SK forces can do it on their own, the only contribution the US can make effectively is support from the Air and Sea. Why this constant talk of US troop contributions? They’re not needed, and definately not in the amount consistent with Iraq.
Wow, so Kim flattens parts of Seoul, yet finds out to his capital will most likely be wiped out, along with his entire regime. Besides, if SK is attacked from the North, it most certainly will be committed to fighting for it’s survival by destroying it’s northern neighbours government and incorporating it into a united Korea. Yeah, it’ll suck for a while, lots of carnage and death, but SK will win, something I’m completely confident in.
It leaves it to the South Koreans, who it pretty much boils down to. Why would the US bomb NK weapons facilities if its neighbour just below it objected to it? Not considering the massive damage in international relations it would cause. Which would be probably larger than what happened in Iraq.
What this statement neglects is the fact that NK is far more militarized than SK. It also fails to take into account the terrain of the North, which would severely hamper an invasion.
Really? The soldiers in 2ID and the 501st would be very interested to hear you say that. By the way, in case you didn’t know, “ID” stands for “infantry division” Air and sea only? I don’t think so.
You make it sound so simple, Ryan. The capital city of SK flattened (And it wouldn’t be “parts” of Seoul, it would be more like “all” of Seoul or at least “most” of Seoul. NK’s long range artillery is a very real threat on the peninsula. To say it sucks is a huge understatement. In this scenario, both Koreas would be devastated. If it has to happen, it has to happen, but if it has to happen, the losses will be huge.
I might add that making a united Korea is far easier said than done. Don’t forget that China is just to the north, and China might very well object to it’s neighbor undergoing a sudden change in government.
The U.S. might conceivably have ended the Cold War by surrendering to the Soviet Union, with results similar to what you decribe, but that was never a politically saleable option here.
OTOH, as I have argued before in this forum, the same result might plausibly achieved by both the U.S. and SK resolving simply not to bother with defending the DMZ any more.
This is interesting:
IRAN ATTENDS TAEPO DONG-2 LAUNCH
People have been asking why North Korea is doing this. I wonder if Iran’s involvement might be a clue, especially since Iran and Syria are apparently behind the attacks on Israel by Hamas and Hezbollah. The timing is certainly interesting. For example, the attacks by Hezbollah, if directed by Iran, could have been designed to take the heat off of North Korea as well as Iran’s nuclear program. Or North Korea’s launch could have been designed as a diversion to keep the U.S. tied down on multiple fronts, just as Israel is now tied to two fronts in Gaza and Lebanon.