[QUOTE=Skald the Rhymer]
[Inigo Montoya]
I do not think Mary Sue means what you think it means.
[/inigo montoya]
[/QUOTE]
A character the writer uses to insert himself or herself into the story, who speaks with the writer’s “voice” and espouses the writer’s viewpoints, yes? See also: most Warren Ellis protagonists.
[QUOTE=Big Bad Voodoo Lou]
A character the writer uses to insert himself or herself into the story, who speaks with the writer’s “voice” and espouses the writer’s viewpoints, yes? See also: most Warren Ellis protagonists.
[/QUOTE]
I’ve asked you not to mention Ellis around me before. Causes me heartburn, he does.
I think you’re leaving out several elements of Mary Sueism, most importantly the idealized nature of the way they’re portrayed. I’d say more but I have avoided enough work this afternoon; maybe later.
I found the the meditation in Amazing Spider-Man #36 far more level-headed and insightful than most of the stuff coming from the TV and newspapers. Text here.
[QUOTE=Big Bad Voodoo Lou]
A character the writer uses to insert himself or herself into the story, who speaks with the writer’s “voice” and espouses the writer’s viewpoints, yes? See also: most Warren Ellis protagonists.
[/QUOTE]
I’d agree that you are, indeed, leaving out too many components of the Mary Sue in your analysis. Most particularly, the wish-fulfillment component, which is pretty much the most important bit. Morpheus doesn’t get his wishes fulfilled; they’re all dashed.
Anyway, I’d say that Death is more Gaiman’s Mary Sue than that poor schmuck, Dream. I think her viewpoint is closer to Gaiman’s than is Dream’s.
Another oddly touching bit from Sandman: Emperor Norton, who got invested with more dignity than I’d associated with his story ever before.
The stories in the first Astro City collection with the Samaritan. The first story, with the dreams of flying, and the one where he and Winged Victory try to snatch an evening out and you think that maybe there’s a little hope for those two lonely people…
*Astro City * 1/2, “The Nearness of You.” It shows the history-changing effects of a Crisis-type event on one ordinary citizen.
[QUOTE=Dr. Rieux]
*Astro City * 1/2, “The Nearness of You.” It shows the history-changing effects of a Crisis-type event on one ordinary citizen.
[/QUOTE]
Oh, geez, yes. Bawled like a baby.
[QUOTE=Lightray]
Anyway, I’d say that Death is more Gaiman’s Mary Sue than that poor schmuck, Dream. I think her viewpoint is closer to Gaiman’s than is Dream’s.
[/QUOTE]
Death is definitely more like Neil than Dream is. Dream’s a mopey, imperious git who throws a childish fit when things don’t go his way. Which…is not Neil at all. None of the Endless really seem to be a self-insert of Neil. If I were to compare him to them, I’d have to go with a combination of Death and Destruction, with a dash of Delirium for flavour.
Hokays…off the hijack, back to the topic at hand.
Legion of Superheroes has a few good deaths, through the course of the various continuities.
In no particular order, some of my favourites.
The death of Ferro Lad, pre-Zero Hour is one of the first comics to really wrench me. Ferro Lad was a fairly sad character to begin with, but he was one of my favourites. And then, he sacrificed himself to save everything. There isn’t much to it, but, it got me.
The death of Monstress, post-Zero Hour. Jan Arrah, AKA Element Lad has, due to the circumstances of the storyline, ended up godlike, and thoroughly insane. Monstress, kind heart that she was, refused to believe that Jan - also one of the kindest souls in the universe, before this story - could possibly have become the cold, even outright evil, being they’d been told he was. She steps forward, trying to remind him who he is. All the while, his train of thought scatters about, his memory of her, of all of them, slipped away, and he eventually destroys her, not even knowing who she is, hardly recognizing she’s there. Because she wasn’t one of his creations. Jan and Candi both lost, irrevocably, in one offhanded, absent act.
The last moments of the pre-Zero Hour Legion continuity. Their friends, their enemies, their world, everything they knew destroyed, or simply faded from existence, the last handful of Legionnaires (both adult and SW6) do the only thing they can do - say goodbye, accept their own ends, and ensure that there will be a universe - even if it isn’t theirs. Specifically, the Shrinking Violets and Lightning Lasses, adult Vi and Ayla holding hands, while they embraced their younger selves. Not only a sad moment, as the universe ends around them, but a very happy moment, in that Vi and Ayla went out together. The last two panels. (All the still-surviving couples got moments like that, except Chuck Taine and Luornu Durgo, which pissed me off - aside from Vi/Ayla, they were my favourite couple. But that’s beside the point.)
Speaking of Vi and Ayla, on a much less gut-wrenching note, the entirety of the 1994 Legion of Super-Heroes annual was beautiful. Ayla was deaging because of an accident while fighting Glorith. She’s scared, and upset by it all, so Vi…reads her a bedtime story. It sounds almost condescending when I describe it here, but it was really very sweet.
Not a lot in comics really touches me, but Supergirl sacrificing herself to save Superman during Crisis on Infinite Earths came close.
I was going to mention this one. I was suprised to see that someone else was as touched by it as I was.
Adding to the scenes from Sandman the one that I found most touching was the scene from World’s End where the patrons of the inn are watching the funeral procession in the sky. The narration in that scene, where the narrator ends up falling in love with Death, is one of my favorite passages from any comic book (and it ranks up there on my list of favorite passages from anything).
The Death of Gwen Stacy.
[QUOTE=silenus]
Not a lot in comics really touches me, but Supergirl sacrificing herself to save Superman during Crisis on Infinite Earths came close.
[/QUOTE]
Supergirl’s death didn’t effect me much, but the fallout over in Legion of Super-Heroes (yes, Legion again) did.
Soon after that issue, there was an issue of Legion, where Brainiac 5 mourns her - although he knew how she was going to die, still… The fact that he knew it was futile, but he still loved her, still studied temporal sciences to try to save her… I guess I’m a sucker for devotion in the face of tragedy.
Amazing spider man 50, Which the second movie was based on…the panel where spidey is walking away from the suit he just trashed in the garbage is a really amazing comic book moment to me.
Well, a confession, here - I agree that there were a lot of touching scenes in Gaiman’s Sandman, but when I sold my collection the only issue I kept was the Emperor Norton one. That story still just blows me away.
I’m only familiar with the Pre-Zero Hour LSH, (The fourth Legion book, I think?) and that had a lot of touching scenes. The incident I really found most touching was when the SW6 Jo Nah and Tinya Wazzo try to talk to the older Jo Nah. They’re thinking it’s still all a lark, an adventure, and the elder Jo Nah (Who had lost his Tinya.) is trying to keep his shock and pain from coming through to those two. The moment when they realize just how much he’s still shattered really gets to me. Especially when they accept that there’s nothing they can do to help.
“The Mock Turtle’s Tale” from Astro City, on discovering his beloved has just been using him to further her activities as the evil Red Queen
“You all probably saw that coming a mile off but me - I had no idea”.
Awww.
I can’t remember the issue number.
Sue Storm is about to go into labor. There have been all kinds of problems with the pregnancy. Banner and Morbius convince Reed that he needs the advice of Otto Octavius. Octavius is fine at first, but spotting a Spiderman bulletin board brings back the crazy. He telepathically summons his arms and begins fighting Reed.
Reed manages to immobilize the arms and says ‘I’m not plotting against you. I know you’re a better scientist than I am. I need your help. My wife and child need your help. You are the only person who can do this.’ Octavius begins weeping and you see who he was before the accident “Yes, please. Let me help.” They rush back to the OR.
Where Reed is greeted with the news that Sue lost the baby. The final page is a small panel surrrounded by blackness.
In Thor, Skurge the Executioner’s lone last stand at the Gjallerbru, the bridge out of Hela’s domain.
They sing no songs in Hel, nor do they celebrate heroes . . .
For silent is that dismal realm and cheerless . . .
But the story of the Gjallerbru and the god who defended it is whispered across the nine worlds . . .
And when a new arrival asks about the one to whom even Hela bows her head . . .
The answer is always the same . . .
He stood alone at Gjallerbru . . .
And that answer is enough.
Tengu – yeah, that last pre-Zero-Hour Legion scene was good. I think it was Garth who said “What better way is there to go…than hand in hand with the people you love?”
Another affecting Legion death was Laurel Gand, pre-Zero Hour. Several of her teammates are in the waiting room of the hospital when the doctor comes out, blood all over his scrubs, and simply says, “For what it’s worth, she put up quite a fight.” 
For me, though, the story that trumps them all is “Who is Donna Troy?” from New Teen Titans #38, in which she finally found out her true identity and that she still has a family. To this day, it chokes me up every time I read it.
The Ultimates, when everyone is having their fancy dinner party, and Hank Pym is at home beating his wife almost to death. It tears me up to not be able to tell the characters that they need to go check on her.
When DC allowed Rob Liefeld to pencil two issues of Teen Titans. It’s enough to make Nick Cardy cry.
