I think Star Wars Inc. ended up making a significantly greater amount of money than Nancy Sinatra and (probably) the Beatles added for good measure.
As a movie, “Phantom Menace” kicks ass. As a Star Wars flick, it’s easily the best one of the lot. And like it or not, the whole thing will be around for one hell of a long time, I assure you.
Waving it off as escapist tripe and doomed to obscurity isn’t being realistic. It’s being a bitter old turd.
Elijah: When you say the hype and merchandising were bad when ANH came out, I hope you were referring to the “special edition” reissue a couple years ago. When the first STAR WARS (later retitled A NEW HOPE) came out in May, no one expected it to be the hit it was, so the studio didn’t have all its merchandising in place. Fans who wanted action figures had to wait for months; there was some kind of goofy deal where you could pre-order them and receive a certificate or empty display box or something, and then hope you got the actual figure by Christmas.
Obviously, for EMPIRE STRIKES BACK, the merchandise was in place ahead of time. But it wasn’t until RETURN OF THE JEDI that it started to become more important than the films. The Ewok planet was originally supposed to be a Wookie planet, but George Lucas thought that toys of cute little furry creatures would sell better. So the film was changed in order to improve the sales of the merchandise. In effect, Lucas epic ceased to be a mythic saga and became instead a multi-million dollar commercial. The trend continues with PHANTOM MENACE, which must rank as this year’s GODZILLA in the category of overhyped disappointment.
{{When you say the hype and merchandising were bad when ANH came out, I hope you were referring to the “special edition” reissue a couple years ago. When the first STAR WARS (later retitled A NEW HOPE) came out in May, no one expected it to be the hit it was, so the studio didn’t have all its merchandising in place. }}
The first Star Wars movie made, Episode IV, was ALWAYS titled “Star Wars: A New Hope”. More emphasis has been put on the subtitle lately, but it’s always had that subtitle.
Lynn the Packrat
/ Hey, it’s “Star Wars,” /
Well, no, it isn’t. That’s the problem. In fact, it appears to be a lavishly produced episode of Battlestar Galactica.
/ OK – a big budget production created with the
primary intent to make a lot of money./
You know, like most interesting art.
/ We ain’t talking art with a
capital “A” here – it’s not like he’s mucking up “Citizen Kane” or
“Moby Dick.” /
Yeah, I think it is like he’s mucking up “Citizen Kane.” He’s created a diluting prequel to an acknowledged movie classic. You might actually argue that Star Wars is more of a classic than Kane, even if not as technically influential or self consciously arty. SW certainly has a greater generational defining quality to it, like the Beatles, or something. Woodstock, what have you.
So an awful lot of people were like “huh?” on the 19th. Really kids, it stinks on ice, does PM.
{\¶/}
RTA Okay! You’re on! I say in 25 years
STAR WARS will get a mention as being a big hit and it will lumped together with JAWS and THE ROCKY HORROR PICTURE SHOW as examples of late 20th Century movies. You say STAR WARS will have such a lasting influence, more people will visit George Lucas’ tomb than visit Graceland.
Actually I didn’t do that at all. I rarely if ever use the word “Graceland” at all, and I have no way of knowing what the public’s relationship will be with Skywalker Ranch (Lucas’ Marin Co. facility, assuming for one second that’s where he gets buried) after Lucas dies. If it IS opened to the public, it will get a shitload of tourists, that I do believe.
And I do think the Star Wars movies will survive longer than 25 years and be ranked higher than “Jaws” or “Rocky Horror” (isn’t that piece of crap dead YET?). What I’m talking is more of a “Lawrence of Arabia”/“10 Commandments”/“Gone with the Wind” sort of thing.
I have in front of me the original video tape (one that was made in 1992, but with the original cover) and A New Hope is mentioned nowhere on the box or the tape. However, the words A New Hope have always appeared on the opening screen (the one where they give you a short plot description).
Personally, I think the Star Wars movies were all good if you ignore the hype and cut out the cheesy, money-making, cutesy creatures. The Ewoks were but the first step in hopelessly diluting the interesting parts of the Star Wars movies with mindless drivel aimed at selling more toys to teenage boys.
TheDude
Obviously, merchandising is more of a trend than a new phenomenon for the SW universe. There were toys for A New Hope, and I’m sure my parents were sick of hearing me lament to get a Luke action figure.
But the thing is, at that age, hype just meant we were bombarded by coolness on TV. It took a while to realise ads were actually annoying, and not just there to show you a cool toy you absolutely have to have.
I suspect many SW detractors simply were too young to remember the previous SW hype. We remember ESB as a quality, dramatic film, yet I distinctly remember glasses, t-shirts, lunchboxes and a pile of action figures. Who didn’t have his own Bobba Fett or that twin seats orange horror passing as a vehicle for 3 seconds in ESB? It LOOKS like a toy so much it was probably put into the film directly from the toy designs.
But now, like then, I don’t care whether Pepsi is being cute. It seems there is more ‘I’m sick of the hype’ hype than actual SW hype.
If you guys REALLY didn’t buy into the hype, you’d simply ignore it. Bitching and moaning is just trying to ride the hype by being contradictory, with no regard for the actual quality of the product. Kinda like people who abandon music groups, as a rule, when they become popular.
Sorry, but STAR WARS became Episode IV: A New Hope only retroactively, after the release of Episode V: THE EMPIRE STRIKES back. It was at this time that Lucas gave all the interviews outlining his so-called masterplan and cluing us in to the fact that we were seeing episodes of a middle trilogy in what (at that time) was ultimately supposed to be a nine-part series. Calling STAR WARS “Episode IV” at the time of its initial release would have made no sense to any viewer.
In fact, it still didn’t make sense to some viewers when EMPIRE came out. I remember attending one of the first advanced screenings with director Irvin Krishner and the producer in attendance. During the Q&A afterward, people were still asking, “Why is this Episode V? What happened to episodes 2, 3, and 4?”
When STAR WARS was re-released after EMPIRE, new prints were struck, and the change was made.
{{Sorry, but STAR WARS became Episode IV: A New Hope only retroactively, after the release of Episode V: THE EMPIRE STRIKES back. It was at this time that Lucas gave all the interviews outlining his so-called masterplan and cluing us in to the fact that we were seeing episodes of a middle trilogy in what (at that time) was ultimately supposed to be a nine-part series. Calling STAR WARS “Episode IV” at the time of its initial release would have made no sense to any viewer.}}
Nope. I went to one of the first screenings of SW:ANH with my younger brother. I remember seeing the “Episode IV: A New Hope” on the screen, and discussing it with him afterwards. And neither of us understood the reasoning behind it at the time. Incidentally, as to how old I was when I saw it…well, I’m 41 now. You do the math.
Someone else said that the movie video packaging didn’t have Episode IV or A New Hope on it. This may be so. When it came out on tape, I didn’t have a VCR or the money to buy one, so I didn’t even go look at the tapes for sale. But when the movie was released for the first time in theaters, it was, indeed, released as Episode IV, and that’s what I was talking about.
Lynn the Packrat
I hate to correct a moderator, but on this point I must. When Star Wars was released in 1977 there was no mentioning of it being “episode IV”. Episode IV was not tacked on until it was rereleased in 1979, with a trailer for the Empire Strikes Back.
check out question #1 for a reference to this fact.
http://www.ncf.carleton.ca/ip/sigs/futurist/star-wars/faq/general
Probably the time you saw it with your brother was in 79, after they had already put Episode IV on.
Now, as far as video tapes go, they ALL say Episode IV.
And arguing about whether or not a movie is any good, is rather silly. I enjoyed The Phantom Menace, of course others might not. I can’t wait for the next two films to come out, others could care less… To each his own, I would say.
pat
Hmmm … I remember when I saw SW#1 the first time with my dad (when it was released the first time), the episode IV screen crawl was well in place. Like Lynn, I thought it was odd.
I’m with CFQ and Priciar… The initial run of STAR WARS had no “Episode 4” and no “New Hope.” That came later, albeit not much later. We had a (pirate) video in 1981 that had no mention of Episode 4. I can remember quite clearly when we took our son back to see the movie again and suddenly it was Episode 4.
Lynn could be mistaken… remember Star Wars was re-released in theaters, I know because I missed it the first time and begged my Dad to take me to see it when it came back… we still missed it. Anyway, I have seen the first 3, and they are modern classics to me, however I am put off by the hype. This is the kind of thing that makes me wait for it to come on video… I saw the Mummy instead.
I saw STAR WARS during its initial release in 1977 at least three times. It was not “Episode IV.” Everyone who remembers seeing “Episode IV” must be remembering a subsequent re-release, after EMPIRE STRIKES BACK. I suppose ten or twenty years from now, people will recall seeing Jaba the Hutt the first time they saw STAR WARS.
Lucas himself has said that at the time of the first release of STAR WARS, he did not expect it to become the blockbuster hit it did, and he had no idea whether he would eventually be able to any sequels or prequels. In effect, it was a stand-alone film, until success decreed that there would indeed be sequels. The nine-film masterplan then emerged in interviews given to promote EMPIRE.
OK, untill now, I’ve pretty much stayed out of the BBQ Pit, 'cause I wasn’t expecting anything but flames that had developed over other topics. But I gotta add my two cents to this.
First of all, I think PM is without a doubt the worst Star Wars film. Not that its not still enjoyable, but after the newness wears off, I think it’ll take its place behind Jedi. The plot is a rehash of A New Hope, the acting is stiff in many places, and as I’ve said before, Jar Jar and those damn Gungun are to the Ewoks what the Ewoks are to Baba Fett. The fight scenes, which everyone else seemd to love, I thought were to dance-y. In the earlier movies, it really looked like people going at each other with swords. The PM fights have too many pirouettes and fancy moves that make no sense in the fight and look too coreographed. Oh yeah, even worse than the damn Gungun, was that stupid announcer at the races. Every time the race started to get really tense for me, that two-headed idiot would start yapping and ruin it for me. It was like it was calculated to destroy any interest or suspense whatsoever. Finally, (though there’s more) Darth Maul was completely (and I mean completely) undeveloped. He barely had any lines. As a result, he was totally unthreatening to me. I never got the feeling that he was anything more than some henchman in bad clown makeup. Totally ineffectual.
Secondly, I can’t blame Lucas for wanting to make lots of money. If he gives some of it away, good for him. (Though I wonder how much it is compared to his actual income, or other people with similar incomes.) He does have total control over what people do with the merchandising, though. Pepsi, KFC (different companies now, according to something I saw on this board), Kenner, etc. all pay him to hock his movie for him. Does anyone really think KFC would have changed their minds if he’d said, “Don’t give the Colonol a lightsaber”?
BTW, Elija responded to Cheese Head by saying:
I think Cheese actually got this one right. Think about it. Everyone knows that Lucas always intended Luke to be him. Hamil admitted to basing his characterization on this; even the names are the same (Luke S.::Lukas). At the time of the first trilogy, Lukas was a young, idealistic, unknown filmmaker, who had to fight with the evil Hollywood studios to have hios dream realized. Now he’s making a trilogy about more recent events in his life. How he became seduced by the dark side and turned into the very power-hungry, ego-driven sort of producer he hated. Get it?
PS–If the 1977 release didn’t have the opening scroll, what did it have at the beginning? Do any copies like this still exist?
Leave it to one us old farts to clear up this titles mess. STAR WARS (that is what the 1977 movie was called when it was first released) had, like all the rest or the movies a “Long, long ago…” scroll. It absolutely DID NOT have Episode IV on it though. I won’t stick my neck out too far on the “A NEW HOPE” subtitle, but I have no recollection of it in the original titles. I’m positive about the absence of “Episode IV”, though, because everybody in the theater would have gone, “Huh? Say what?”
(later in same post)
Yeah. As opposed to the oh-so-dripping-with-development-and-depth-we-feel-like-we-know-him Boba Fett, who most fanboys seem to feel the entire trilogy was actually about.
PapaBear, if you saw the Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi during the late 70s/early 80s, did they have episode numbers?
I was in diapers at the time, so I’m just curious.
“[He] beat his fist down upon the table and hurt his hand and became so
further enraged… that he beat his fist down upon the table even harder and
hurt his hand some more.” – Joseph Heller’s Catch-22
Yes. All the following films had episode numbers. I think it was about a year after STAR WARS was released (but still in theaters, IIRC) that word of a sequel and even a 9-part series came down from on high. I remember that the concensus among my friends was that all the movies would be completed by 1993!