From an American point of view, it seems peculiar to have a major party explicitly labeled as “Christian”, especially one that’s not far-nutty-right.
It’s close to bedtime for me so I don’t have the time to lay it all out, but the CDU has a long history and a predecessor party called the Zentrum (which not unintentionally means center) which dates back to the Kulturkampf of the Empire formed in 1871, mostly declared by the protestant Prussian regime and its chancellor, Otto von Bismarck, against the Catholic church in Germany. Yes, there have been culture wars in Germany already 150 years ago, but that was a different culture war than today. After WWII, out of the remnants of Zentrum, the CDU emerged, but they we’re already more inclusive than before and also welcomed protestants or even atheists/agnostics (if they weren’t vocal about it, of course) with a center-right mindset. Nowadays, they even have Muslim members, and the label “Christian” is just that, a label.
tl, dr: the “Christian” label of the CDU isn’t their selling part anymore, at all.
I always thought the “Christian” part of the name was there to rule out Communism but was otherwise not religious. At least that was true of the Christian Democrats of postwar Italy.
…the CSU, on the other hand…
You guys probably don’t think of it that way, but 70% of the population pays a mandatory church tax. By US standards, that’s highly theocratic.
Actually, it’s a bit less than 50%, but how is it mandatory if can just choose not to pay it? As soon as you quit your affiliation with one of the religious groups involved, you’re done. It’s just much more convenient for both sides as opposed to putting the same amount in the collection plate each week. It does not make Germany, in any way, shape or form, a theocracy. (BTW, to hear that accusation coming from the USA, of all places, seems rich…)
The practice is very old and just works for this country, though I’m sure it seems odd from the outside (just like „registering“ with a political party in a supposedly secret election seems very odd from our perspective).
The figure I saw was from 2019, so maybe the numbers have collapsed since then.
The worrisome bit I saw was from this page.
Even if you declare that you are not religious when completing your address registration in Germany, this is not foolproof as the churches share data internationally. For example, if you are registered as Catholic in Spain, the Catholic Church in Germany may be able to get hold of this information – in this instance you will receive a bill for the backdated church tax that you owe since your arrival in Germany.
Yikes!
I can’t see why. We have a strong separation between church and state here. The government has zero idea of my religious affiliation. None of their business. And they certainly can’t tax me based on that.
Well, I suppose we have different views of theocracy. Our leaders go on and on about Jebus this-and-that, which is slightly embarrassing but doesn’t affect me in the slightest. It’s unequal treatment based on religious affiliation that’s offensive to me. Even having to declare an affiliation, or opt out of one, feels like a violation.
BTW, you don’t have to register with a party. The only thing that gets you (and this is not even universal) is the ability to vote in that party’s primary (i.e., pick that party’s candidate). Otherwise, you can just register as independent. With respect to the election itself, there is no difference.
In fact, they can’t tax you as soon as you declare that you are a church, no matter how loony, right? Scientologists, davidians, shakers, mormons, you name it. Tax exempt. And the government prays before attacking the Houthis. I could go on, but I wholeheartedly support Pitchmeister’s BTW observation.
In another BTW, Spain also collects the so called Church-Tax by the state and distributes it to the different denominations, but covers more ground than Germany. No time to search it, but I believe there is also the possibility to declare oneself Hindu, Muslim, Buddhist and other creeds who then get state money in accordance to the number of believers.
Spain used to be a theocratic state, I was born under Franco, so believe me: both states today are no theocracies. Even if they grant churches privileges with which I disagree. But there is worse.
Well, you won’t get me to defend the tax exemption of religious orgs, but it’s because they all fall under the banner of non-profits. Charitable and political orgs are also tax exempt.
The US, Germany, and Spain are obviously not theocracies. But individual laws or policies can be theocratic in nature. And a church tax is one of them.
Just to be clear, in some states in the US, registering with a party will determine which party’s primary you can vote in, and of course it will put you on mailing lists for candidates begging for donations, but it has no other effect. You can register as a Republican and then vote straight-ticket Democrats if you want, or vice-versa, or any combination.
I’m aware, thank you. It was just meant to illustrate how things that seem completely natural to you can really baffle someone looking in from the outside. As a German, the very idea of registering to vote in the first place (let alone as a Democrat) is very foreign, as due to our centralized record keeping you are automatically sent an invitation to vote, without any effort required on your part. Also, the concept of „primarying“ someone doesn’t exist, as candidates are chosen by, if you will, „card-carrying“ (=due-paying) members of a party, which quite effectively prevents the sort of yahoos you currently see in power in the Republican Party from being elected to office. (However, as the very existence of this thread shows, that’s by no means the answer to all of life’s problems, either. Stupid people gonna stupid, no matter the country.)
Which sounds to me a lot like our primaries and party registration. I guess the difference is just in paying dues?
Meanwhile, multi-party systems always seem unfamiliar to Americans, except that, in practice, we get much the same effect (informally) from factions within our two parties.
My feeling is that, as conditions in general worsen globally and people/nations are under more and more economic, social, and political stress, nations will continue to move to the right. As an example, the Treaty of Versailles with its harsh terms and devastating reparations planted the seeds for perhaps the worst Fascist dictatorship in history.
Once this happens, the ruling force has massive forms of communication available to mentally condition its populace, and pinpoint tracking abilities to find and eliminate all of its enemies.
My read of the middle of the 20th century was that all nations were flirting with fascist ideas, then a few plunged all the way into fascism, and then once those few did that, the rest saw just how horrible fascism was and went reactionary antifa in response. And I think that’s what we’re starting to see today, except with the US cast in the role of Germany.
Wait until you tell them how you actually vote twice, once for the candidate, once for the party.
I heard a report about that. Canada is is moving away from the Trump sound a like who had been winning before. It may even take some wind out of LePen’s sail in France where she’s been looking likely to dominate next cycle.
Well, the process sort of prevents any yahoo who used to be a game show host, or „news“ anchor, or anybody who isn’t a career politician who spent their whole life serving their party, from holding political office. Some might say that’s a bad thing, but I prefer this system. There are a lot less surprises, and the parties deal out who their candidates are more or less internally.
Well, one the one hand we do, but with the recent election reform to reduce the size of the parliament, that’s actually not 100% true anymore. It has happened multiple time in the last election that a candidate was elected directly in their district, but since their party didn’t have enough „party votes“ in their state to cover all their direct candidates, they don’t get a seat after all.
Oh, now that’s really interesting, I need to go read up on that. If you offhand know of any articles (German is fine) I’d appreciate it, otherwise I’ll poke around.
From the horse’s mouth itself, the Bundestag: