Ummmm… I’m not a big “ghost” fan (terrible movie(’;)’) but placing one “frame” of a surveillance video on a par with a photographic image is ridiculous. Even a grainy 800asa 35mm filmstock will capture at least an equivalent of 5 megapixels worth of detail. A surveillance video on the other hand would be highly unlikely to have even 1 MP worth of resolution. That’s not even taking into account the sharpness of the respective lenses. So despite the fact that your quantity of video image argument makes sense, the “… thing about the photographic medium that makes it more likely to capture an image of…” let’s say a squirrel in the corner of the frame, of a quarter on the floor, or, I suppose, a ghost(’:eek:’) is QUALITY.
Anwering only to the foto presented… he sure seems to be holding out to grasp the guard rail… ghosts don’t need that kind of support.
Since this happened in October... I blame Halloween.Chickdigscars… not to be cruel… but the HSP site and their test seemed very repetitive. There were a lot of different wording questions. Seems inducing. About sensory input for example:
-
I am easily overwhelmed by strong sensory input.
-
I am easily overwhelmed by things like bright lights, strong smells,coarse fabrics,or sirens close by.
-
I am made uncomfortable by loud noises.
-
I become unpleasantly aroused when a lot is going on around me.
-
I find it unpleasant to have a lot going on at once.
-
I am bothered by intense stimuli, like loud noises or chaotic scenes.
Basically very similar questions. If you tend to be shy and hate loud noises you would have clicked on a dozen questions right out. This rang a bell for me… I would suppose shy people would more easily buy into her ideas.
I know half a dozen mediums and several other people that claim they are sensitive to the supernatural. So I am not criticizing you… but the site you indicated seems more made for selling books to very shy people than legitimate stuff.
As for my fellow skeptics… they will naturally consider the photo a bogus first until something else might indicate otherwise. Rightly so. Its easier to find humans in costumes than ghosts with a need for celebrity status.
A couple of months ago on Channel Four (UK channel) there was a programme where a bunch of movie special effects guys were set the challenge into fooling people into thinking they had seen a UFO. http://www.apra.org.uk/A_Very_British_UFO_Hoax.htm
It worked. Sky News, BBC News and ITN news carried the story (UK major news groups). The movie effects guys were all happy and laughing around, happy that they had fooled all these people with their remote controlled silver balloon filled with air thing (although it did look pretty good!)
In my opinion it could probably turn out to be another story like that one… a bunch of movie special effects guys were set the challenge to fool the world into thinking it had seen a ghost on CCTV at Hampton Court Palace. They are probably all sitting around there televisions and newspapers laughing about it now.
(P.S – The timing would work too! If that programme aired on October 7th and this “ghost” appeared at the end of October, wouldn’t that be enough time for the channel executives to say “Right, that got good ratings, lets do another! Maybe a ghost this time? Who wants some tea???”) There you go! Solved it :))
I am so smart, I am so smart, I am so smart 
Rule #1 for sites that claim to have some facinating, life-changing and previously “Secret” information.
Are they selling something?
If so, it doesn’t make it BS, but it certainly gives them an agenda,other then the advancement of knowledge, for pushing it as hard as they can.
After viewing the sequence of frames of that video, I have concluded that this is not a ghost, but a solid person. Why? Because the figure (especially the face) beomes much brighter when it moves from within the doorway to outside the doorway, where it is exposed to brighter light. The only way this can occur is with an object that reflects light, and that means an object with mass. By any popular explanation, ghosts are supposedly pure energy (which cannot reflect light), not objects with mass.
Also, I agree that this is not a security camera video; why is it so jumpy? Looks handheld to me.
Chickdigscars, if you wish to continue arguing that this picture is of a ghost, you must address this discrepancy. Otherwise, this video sequence is the strongest evidence against this figure being a ghost.
Well, HSP is all about sensory input, hence so many questions on the subject. And I apologize for my lack of evidence regarding my experience with ghosts. I was busy defending myself against a charge of schizophrenia. And if you guys doubt the scientific legitimacy of high sensitivity, ask yourselves why the venerable publisher Oxford University Press would publish a treatise containing references to it. And it would be more helpful in the future if you would tell me just exactly what you think I need proof of instead of slinging insults at me. I offered the hsp website, along with its references, but that wasn’t enough proof for you. And yes, part of the problem is that this trait hasn’t been researched widely, so a lot of skeptics are going to call it bogus. I’m sure researchers in other fields have come across the same skepticism.
The HSP website or book is not peer reviewed and looks suspiciously like an attempt to sell a book rather then break scientific ground.
Peer Reviewed means it offers it’s methods and data up to legitimate scientific studies to make sure it’s proper(ergo, the data isn’t being pulled out the sky), if I’m not mistaken(somebody please correct me if I’m wrong).
Cite!
Where did anyone here ever doubt the existence of high sensitivity?
All that anyone has called into question is the so-called “HSP” syndrome. No one has disputed that high sensitivity exists, in humans, rats, mice and TV antennas. So fricken’ what? That doens’t make the existence of “HSP’s” true. Unless you have read that ‘treatise’ and can show us where it references HSPs then I am going to have to conclude that this is a starwman.
Do not be fooled by doubletalk chicksdigscars. That webpage only mentions OUP once: “E. N. Aron (2000). “High Sensitivity as One Source of Fearfulness and Shyness,” in Extreme Fear, Shyness, and Social Phobia: Origins, Biological Mechanisms, and Clinical Outcomes. Eds. L. A. Schmidt and J. Schulkin. New York: Oxford University Press,pp. 251-272.” Unless you have read the article you have no idea what type of sensitivity that refers to or whether it is related to what is on that webpage at all.
-
As we have pointed out repeatedly, no one has insulted you. Personal insults are verboten in GD and if you believe that anyone has personally insulted you, you may contact a moderator and they will be forced to refrain.
-
I have repeatedly told you what proof you need. Something objective is the minimum starting point. Anything, anything at ll that is objective and not confined to your head.
That’s because it isn’t proof of anything at all aside form the existence of the HSP website. It never mentions ghosts.
Chicksdigscars, you claimed that ghosts exist. If you cannot produce your evidence for this then acknowledge that you have no evidence. Stop introducing irrelevant red herrings like HSP that have no relationship to ghosts whatsoever.
And stop treating schizophrenia as an insult. That is highly offensive to schizophrenics. It is no more offensive to be asked if you have schizophrenia when you display a symptom like repeated hallucinations than to be asked is you have a cold when you are sneezing and your nose is running.
The existence of ghosts in general is not entirely relevant to this particular issue. One can believe that ghosts exist and still think that the Hampton Court apparition is a guy in a cheap costume (which, IMO, it quite clearly is).
I brought up HSP because someone questioned why some people can see ghosts and others can’t. I never said you had to be an HSP to see a ghost; I posited that is more likely that someone who has seen a ghost is an HSP, not definitely an HSP.
If you don’t doubt high sensitivity, then why are you calling into question this “syndrome?” Which by the way, it is NOT a syndrome. Blake, you yourself said that high sensitivity is apparent in humans, rats, etc. HSP is merely an acronym for HIGHLY SENSITIVE PERSON. You just contradicted yourself, buddy.
As for my repeated assertion that whatsishis name asking if I was schizophrenic was an insult, well it was an insult to me. The tone of the questions makes it an insult. Kinda like asking a a guy,“So have you stopped beating your wife yet?” That kind of insult.
And for the last fucking time, I NEVER said that the HSP website contained anything remotely paranormal. That was MY theory, not Elaine Aron’s.
Let’s see, a few points here.
-
That footage is fake. Take it from a special effects artist, that “Ghost” is solid and easily reproduced. After costume rental I’d wager the cost of the get-up at roughly 20.00-60.00 dollars; depending on either a mask or some nifty DIY prosthetics.
-
I am positively diagnosed “Hypersensitivity disorder”. For those who are not familiar with the disorder, it is nothing more than an inability to filter out stimulai that normal people would ignore. Side effects can include (but are not limited to) migraines from flourescant lights, and reactive sneezing at strong scents, (which I have), and violent nausea from scents/ tastes/ sounds. (which I do not have)
-
I have seen things which I cannot explain, and several of them in places where others have reported similar phenomena.
-
I have NEVER simply seen these types of phenomena just walking about.
-
One possibility is that my condition allows me to experience stimulai that most simply don’t notice. Another explanation is that I have a mental condition that is forcing me to see things. Both are logical, only the latter is provable; at least in relation to ghosts and such.
-
If you DO see these types of things, a mental evaluation is a positive tool to help you figure out what is going on. You MAY or MAY NOT have a MEDICAL condition that causes you to hallucinate. If you do not have one of those conditions then it is only logical to state that you experience phenomena that cannot be explained. The only way that you can be sure of this is to HAVE a mental evaluation. <Which I have had and passed> Taking offense to the question that you may have a disorder is juvenile at best.
-
Since I know that there is nothing medically wrong that is causing these experiences; I believe in the existence of phenomena that we are CURRENTLY UNABLE to empirically verify at the moment. Our level of technology may not be sufficient to positively put to rest the existence of ghost phenomena. As far as I know, we are unable to DISPROVE ghostly phenomena where a hoax is not involved.
Cheers!
No you didn’t.
I was the only person to address you between your initial and your mention of HSP, and I certainly never questioned why some people can see ghosts and others can’t. My entire post basically consisted of “CITE”. I was asking for references to support your assertion that ghosts exists and some people can see them. I couldn’t care at that point ( or at this point ) why some people can see ghosts and others can’t because you still haven’t established if some people can see ghosts and others can’t.
It doesn’t matter either way because the reference you provided to HSP never mentions ghosts. It is totally irrelevant to ghosts. You might just as well claim that people who eat Twinkies are more likely to see ghosts and then link to the Twinkies website to prove that Twinkies exist. It is a total non-sequitur. It does not follow that because Twinkies exists people who eat them are more likely to see ghosts.
Are you sure you want to say that? Medically speaking a syndrome is a group of symptoms that indicate a condition. Are you saying that a HSP does not have a group of symptoms that indicate their condition? If they don’t then how can you make any collective statements about them?
Aron seems to be having a bet each way on the issue: “Sensitivity is not some new syndrome I made up. It’s based on solid research, my own and others. I just gave the trait a better name and description, from the inside.” http://www.hsperson.com/pages/cz_art5.htm
But I’ll happily take it either way quite happily. You tell us whether it is a group of symptoms that indicate a condition or not and I can demolish it from there.
:rolleyes:
What you apparently don’t understand ‘buddy’ is that there is a difference between being highly sensitive to one or a range os specific physical stimuli and being one of Aron’s “Highly Sensitive People’ who are supposedly generically sensitive to physical and mental stumili. I am personally highly sensitive to shellfish UV light. That does not qualify me for Aron’s HSP syndrome.
See the difference?
That statement is bigoted and displays an almost incomprehensible level of ignorance. Schizophrenics do not voluntarily desire to hurt other people and comparing someone suffering from a disease to a physically violent criminal who indulges in the act for his own benefit is despicable.
Now I feel like insulting you. I won’t do it here though.
Follow the link if you want to continue talking such rubbish about the mentally ill.
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=230724
So why did you post it when I asked for a reference to support your ridiculous assertion that ghosts are real and that some people can’t see them? You are now saying that it doesn’t support that statement at all.
So we are right back where we started.
You said “I know ghosts are real. Some people just are not able to see them for various reasons”
This is GD so I am calling you out. Either post the evidence and reasoned argument that supports that outrageous claim or admit that you were talking shite.
This type of high sensitivity is about sensory input. Overloading stimuli. TOO MUCH FUCKING NOISE. Not about shellfish.
chicksdigscars is right. Some people can see things that others cannot. I have been blessed with some extraordinary experiences and I have no doubt that we share this world with beings of pure energy.
So you did get my point. The existence of high sensitivity does not make Aron’s HSP syndrome credible. there is a difference between being highly sensitive to one or a range os specific physical stimuli and being one of Aron’s “Highly Sensitive People’ who are supposedly generically sensitive to physical and mental stimuli.
I notice that you ignored all the more important issues, like why you posted that HSP site in response to a request to provide evidence for your ridiculous claim.
And either posting the evidence and reasoned argument that supports your outrageous claim or admitting that you were talking shite.
But I think it’s clear to all by now that you have no evidence to support your claim.
This is GD, not IMHO. Present your evidence for that extraordinary claim.
And dear Blake, just because you are only sensitive to shellfish or whatever doesn’t mean that Aron’s theory is baseless. There are different kinds of sensitivity.
I don’t think I ignored your point. I said that I should not have posted the site. And since you want to continue this fucking argument, I have not had time to find sources for you.
You can call Aron’s theory ridiculous. You, however, are not the final word on it, thank God.
Blake
easy enough. bugs I want to know about his energy people. Sounds like fun.
Millions of people have witnessed things and written about them. You cannot wish the evidence away.