**clairobscur ** and BF, thanks for your responses and comments.
For what it’s worth, from a South African perspective there is a strict liability attached to animal ownership called actio de pauperie. To quote an SA case, “If the animal does damage from inward excitement or, as it is also called, from vice, it is said to act contra naturam sui generis; its behaviour is not considered such as is usual with a well-behaved animal of the kind.”
On the face of it, an attack by a domesticated animal is against its nature and therefore unreasonable and wrongful. However, there are a number of defences available that can be used against a plaintiff, namely that the plaintiff was to blame for the animal’s action (quite a wide scope here, IMO); negligence on the part of the animal’s controller (as opposed to the owner); provocation of the animal by someone else or something else; that the plaintiff was not lawfully on the premises (a burglar); and that the plaintiff was a willing participant.
I think the OP did everyting reasonable to secure her dogs. The only gap in her fence was a small one only accessible from her own property. In hindsight, a chicken wire covering might be a good idea, but goes above and beyond IMHO.
For those posters who believe that the OP is at least somewhat at fault, I’d like to ask where the line should be drawn. This child has already entered her house uninvited. Is it the OP’s responsibility to now childproof her house? Must she move all electrical outlets higher on the wall and lock up all her prescription drugs and cleaning supplies? If she is liable when the child trespasses to harass her dogs, is she also liable if she trespasses in the house and burns her hand on the stove?
In short, where is the point where other people’s children are no longer her responsibility? If it is not on her own property, where is it?
I’m getting that you don’t like pets, and don’t think people should have them, full stop.
So, for a minute, take pets out of it. What is my responsibility as a homeowner to protect other people’s children when they tresspass on my property? I live in a 135 year old house under renovation. It is DEEPLY dangerous to children. You could find anything from exposed wiring to lead paint to caustic chemicals to powertools & saws, not to mention ladders and the regular sharp edges of an un-childproofed house. Often, tools are in my garage or out in the backyard (which is fenced)-- with all sorts of dangerous, sharp gardening tools. My cleaning supplies are full accesable to anyone capable of opening the undersink cabinet. Any kid getting into my home/garage/backyard could seriously hurt themselves. Am I responsible? I don’t NEED powertools. Surely my neighbor’s kid who might get into my yard is more important than my desire for crown molding.
My dad’s ex-next-door neighbor’s kid wandered into his house a number of times. She was a normal 5 year old and did it repeatedly. Lucky for both of them he wasn’t strolling around naked :eek: . It happens. I’m not saying there isn’t some cause for concern (the possibility of geriatric nakedness springs to mind) …but it’s also not the end of the world. They’re KIDS for crissake! I certainly wouldn’t call the police.
The OP could have tried to forge a more cooperative relationship with his neighbor. The fact that he feels so angry toward this retarded kid is more alarming than the child’s behavior.
Not to answer for clairobscur, but in my opinion a reasonable barrier would be sufficient. A fence, a gate, a wall, or a moat with crocodiles. Then again, I generally have a rather pragmatic view on life.
As a kid I grew up on a farm, where the house was close to the boundary. The fence was a typical 5 strand farm fence, meant only to stop cattle and sheep. To a human it was no meaningful barrier. However, I was taught from a very early age to respect The Fence, and to climb through it was punishable by Castration. I watched many would-be bulls get the chop, needless to say, we never climbed through the fence. Except to put out a fire, which started on our side. Twasn’t me, I swear.
As an aside, kids wandering onto private properties in suburban South Africa is virtually unheard of. The crime levels in this country have resulted in impressive Camelot-style perimeter protection, and the only kid that will arrive at your door will either be bleeding from razor wire, or speaking in tongues. Electric fencing has some interesting side effects.
Now we get down to real issue. IT’S NOT UP TO OUR OPINIONS.
Has anyone actually looked up the laws for the OP’s area? (I haven’t either. Bad NCB!) Our OPINIONS mean shit here. Even the OP’s. What matters is “What does the Law say?” Until that gets answered, we’re all just playing with ourselves.
Oh bullshit. Being understanding doesn’t mean I can’t say that this little girl’s parents (NOT your’s, btw, since I know nothing about your situation) have failed if their daughter is constantly wandering uninvited into people’s houses like this. According to the OP, this has happened more than once. You don’t think the parent should be a bit more concerned that her daughter is doing this?
And yeah, I have OCD and ADHD. Doesn’t mean my parents didn’t make it clear that ADD was NOT an excuse to misbehave. Or if I did fuck up say, “Well, do you know how hard it is taking care of a kid with ADHD?”
When the OP described the little view window in the fence, I’m picturing something similiar to a mail slot. AND it was on her property. Where the little girl should NOT be allowed to wander unsupervised and uninvited. That’s just a recipe for something bad to happen.
Oh, and just to be clear, I’m not saying that disabled children need monitoring 24/7. However, if she’s going into people’s houses uninvited to snoop around, she obviously needs more supervision than she is currently getting.
I’ve been wondering that myself, Couldn’t they just have a wire fence in that section? I still the parent is unreasonable to blame the Op if she does, but I don’t understand the open peephole.
This is interesting and I’d like to touch on it a little further. This child has, on several occasions, been found not only in light strand’s yard, but in light strand’s home. So what would have happened if the child had turned on the stove, burning herself and causing major damage to light strand’s home? Would it be light strand’s fault for owning a stove? I think that if the parents are unable to teach their child appropriate behavior, they need to keep a better eye on her. It’s difficult to believe that a Down’s child of that age could be missing long enough to be discovered in a neighbor’s home without the parents franticallly searching for her. If that happened to me, I’d be terrified!
Gah. That should say, “So what would have happened if the child had turned on the stove, started a fire, and burned herself, and caused major damage to light strand’s home?”
Since the neighbourhood child has wandered into light strand’s house before, what would adequate restraint for the dog be? Just putting chicken wire over the hole in the fence is not enough, since the child can wander into the house, get into the fenced area, and be bitten by the dog.
It seems that light strand’s options are:
a) Move
b) Get rid of the dogs
Nothing else can keep the little girl safe.
What if she covers the hole in the fence with chicken wire, and always keeps her house doors and garage doors under lock and key, but the little girl finds a ladder, drags it over to the fence, climbs over the ladder, gets in the fenced yard, and is bitten by the dog?
Mellivora, I am assuming that you are making a Matrix reference, and implying that a 7-year-old girl would need superhuman agility to be able to climb a ladder? In that case I will disagree, I have seen a three-year-old drag over a chair and use it to climb up on to reach something. If a three-year-old can drag a chair, I am sure a seven-year-old can carry a stepladder of sufficient height to allow the seven-year-old to climb over the fence (I am assuming a 5 to 6 foot fence.)
If you were only making a witty one-liner, then I will throw in a LOL.
I am a dog owner as are most of my neighbors, including the daycare neighbor two doors down, who moved recently and we don’t miss in the least. She has two dogs and two small boys, plus several children in her in-home daycare operation. The kids used the culdesac as their playgound and my husband and I were really concerned one of them was going to get run over sooner or later. It’s just too hard to see a two year old on a little trike.
What happened was her two-and-a half-year-old walked onto our next-door neighbor’s property and stuck his hand through her chain-link fence and her 15 year old lab mix bit him, resulting in a small puncture wound. The boy was OK, but the ancient dog had to spend two weeks incarcerated at the pound. He was so stiff from laying on concrete and no excercise when he got out. It was awful.
The next-door neighbor built a secondary wooden fence around the exposed chain link fence on her property and that took care of that.
For a couple months.
My husband then busted the four-year-old letting the little brother into the yard through our next-door neighbor’s gate. He chewed them out and marched them back to daycare lady’s house. She was too busy vacuuming her vehicle to notice they had tresspassed. Hubby chewed her out.
I swear, that woman was only outside with the kids when she was vacuuming her SUV and all you could see was her fat ass sticking out the door. Otherwise she was inside. She also regularly made a boy with behavioral difficulties stand outside in the rain for hours waiting for his bus because she didn’t want to deal with him.
