Good Samaritan saves baby - in spite of security guard's warning.

[Doctor_Jackson]

@iiandyiiii

This is trivially easy – a parent stops for 2 minutes, perhaps to pick up a prescription or something – and rather than go through the 5 to 10 minute evolution of waking/comforting the baby, putting them in the stroller, etc., they leave them in the car for a few minutes.

Trivially easy, and potentially deadly. That 2 minute prescription pick up can easily turn into 15 minutes. What can happenin 15 minutes (besides saving 15% on your car insurance)?

Even outside temperatures in the 60s can cause a car temperature to rise well above 110° F. When the outside temperature is 83° F, even with the window rolled down 2 inches, the temperature inside the car can reach 109° F in only 15 minutes. “Within the first 10 minutes the temperature in an enclosed vehicle will rise an average of 19 degrees or 82 percent of its eventual one hour rise.”[sup]28[/sup] In warm weather, a vehicle can warm to dangerous, life-threatening levels in only 10 minutes.

Very young children (age 4 and under) are particularly susceptible to hyperthermia.

[carnivorousplant]

@Doctor_Jackson

Trivially easy, and potentially deadly. That 2 minute prescription pick up can easily turn into 15 minutes. What can happenin 15 minutes (besides saving 15% on your car insurance)?

Then you get out of line and bring the kid in in six minutes.
:rolleyes:

[Sailboat]

Anecdotal, but we have stopped numerous times to assist dogs left in closed-up cars. Sometimes it’s been cool enough we could wait for an animal control officer, taking 20 or 30 minutes. In each and every case, without exception, when the driver returns, he or she indignantly insists on having been gone fewer minutes than I’ve been counting off on my watch or phone.

Either they’re all lying, or they’re terrible judges of how much time has passed…with a life at stake. Either would be just as deadly to a child as a dog.

It’s possible we have flukishly encountered only the worst cases. But logic suggests, since we’ve uniformly seen that time discrepancy in all cases, that lots of people are dangerously bad at this.

[Dangerosa]

@Marley23

That. It’s not dangerous to leave a child in a car. It’s commonplace and my parents did it reasonably often. I assume most people’s parents did. On the other hand leaving a small child unattended in a car for too long on a hot day is dangerous and stupid.

Prior to pay at the pump (yeah, I’m an old fart), you pumped your gas, left your kids in the car, and ran into the store to pay. There was not a rash of dead kids or car jackings involving kids - it was what nearly everyone did (unless you had particularly impish kids who were likely to put the car in gear).

[carnivorousplant]

@Dangerosa

Prior to pay at the pump (yeah, I’m an old fart), you pumped your gas, left your kids in the car, and ran into the store to pay. There was not a rash of dead kids or car jackings involving kids - it was what nearly everyone did (unless you had particularly impish kids who were likely to put the car in gear).

Hell, Mothers used to leave strollers with kids outside the grocery store.

[Wile_E]

@Spiderman

I’m an EMT who’s also certified in Vehicle Rescue. I’ve broken lots of car glass, both in training & on the scene of rescues. Good on her in theory, not great in execution.

The windshield is different than the rest of the windows in a car. Being on the front of the car, windshields are subject to much greater forces (hence their name) & are made differently than other car glass. They are a laminate of multiple layers which are very hard to break, & when they do, contain sharp edges that will cut you. They make specialized windshield saws that cost a few hundred dollars.

Other glass is safety glass which can be broken by just pushing hard enough with a pointed object, like a window punch or a rescue hammer (2 for $6 on Amazon). Once the glass is shattered, pushing on it will cause the little pieces to fall harmlessly to the floor/ground.

If you ever find yourself in a similar situation, go for side glass furthest from the ‘victim’ as it’s both easier & safer to break.

Thanks for the backup. Since you’re an EMT have you ever told the people you rescued that they were saved by Spiderman?

[actualliberalnotoneofthose]

@t-bonham@scc.net

Breaking the windshield might be better!

I know someone who had this happen to his car, only they broke a side window. Then the insurance company refused to pay for it, saying that the state law requiring no-deduction coverage for auto glass only applied to the windshields, not the side windows. (And the side windows were surprisingly expensive, not that much cheaper than a windshield. Had to disassemble the door, with the power locks & windows, and the installation work was much longer than doing a windshield.)

I don’t have glass coverage, but my car was broken into through a small “vent” window a couple years ago and it cost a lot more to replace than the windshield. All they took was a 10 year old CD player that was $99 brand new. I just leave it unlocked now.

[Spiderman]

@Wile_E

Thanks for the backup. Since you’re an EMT have you ever told the people you rescued that they were saved by Spiderman?

No, because they might want to thank/reward me & that goes against my theme song:

♪♫ *Spiderman, Spiderman
Friendly neighborhood Spiderman
**Wealth and fame
He’s ignored
Action is his reward. *** ♪♫

[grude]

@Dangerosa

Prior to pay at the pump (yeah, I’m an old fart), you pumped your gas, left your kids in the car, and ran into the store to pay. There was not a rash of dead kids or car jackings involving kids - it was what nearly everyone did (unless you had particularly impish kids who were likely to put the car in gear).

That is a totally different scenario from the incident in the op leaving a infant in a sealed car for 40 minutes, where the kid isn’t even in your eyesight.

My dad did the same thing when I was beyond a toddler and he was getting gas, but he usually left the windows down. I’d also wait in the car for him sometimes while he ran into a store, but again the windows were down and if I got too hot I could roll em up and lock the doors and go in the store.

[Dangerosa]

@grude

That is a totally different scenario from the incident in the op leaving a infant in a sealed car for 40 minutes, where the kid isn’t even in your eyesight.

My dad did the same thing when I was beyond a toddler and he was getting gas, but he usually left the windows down. I’d also wait in the car for him sometimes while he ran into a store, but again the windows were down and if I got too hot I could roll em up and lock the doors and go in the store.

Yes, but that is not what muldoontheif was asking for examples of, nor what Marley and iiandyii and I gave examples of. Its a sub conversation where muldoonthief is saying “there is no safe time to leave your child unattended.”

And perhaps he is right - but there is no safe time to eat - you might choke; drive - you might have a car accident; or walk across the room - you might trip and hit your head. Everything we do involves risk - the question is - is it a reasonable risk. Leaving a child in a hot car for 40 minutes is NOT a reasonable risk. Running into the gas station to pay for your gas - or because your tummy says you need to reach a toilet NOW - MIGHT be.

[Tim_T-Bonham.net]

@Dangerosa

Prior to pay at the pump (yeah, I’m an old fart), you pumped your gas, left your kids in the car, and ran into the store to pay. There was not a rash of dead kids or car jackings involving kids - it was what nearly everyone did (unless you had particularly impish kids who were likely to put the car in gear).

A relative once left the kids in a car while running into the store “just to pick up one thing” only to have it take longer than expected. Nothing serious happened, but when they heard about it, other relatives upbraided her, with lengthy family drama ensuing.

I stayed out of the family drama, and dealt with it in another way – I took her toddler outside and showed him how the horn worked, and what fun it was to honk it whenever mommy was taking too long.

[Aspidistra]

@Dangerosa

Yes, but that is not what muldoontheif was asking for examples of, nor what Marley and iiandyii and I gave examples of. Its a sub conversation where muldoonthief is saying “there is no safe time to leave your child unattended.”

Personally, I wouldn’t count going in to pay for petrol “unattended”. And I’d say that the parenting debate is still about 50/50 between parents who totally take their kids in every time (“the car might get stolen!”) and those who don’t (“fuck it - who knows if we’ll all get run over on the forecourt?”). With much angst on both sides, of course

[Melbourne]

@Marley23

That. It’s not dangerous to leave a child in a car. It’s commonplace and my parents did it reasonably often. I assume most people’s parents did. On the other hand leaving a small child unattended in a car for too long on a hot day is dangerous and stupid.

At 6y, my parents used to put me and my sister (7y) into the car to sleep at night, to make it possible to get an early start in the morning without waking us.

No, not the same as killing your baby. Still, I think that sometimes the fear gets a little shrill.

[Bad_News_Baboon]

The difference between running in to pay for gas and running in to a grocery is time.
If I run in to the gas station, at least the ones here, I can park directly in front of the station. I can be in and out, my eye the whole time on the car.

I’ve never known there to be a small sized HEB. Even the nearest parking spots would require a walk across the parking lot and these stores never have large windows to see out of. The walk to the pharmacy alone would take two minutes: park car, walk across, enter store, make way to pharmacy.

I’m in Texas and I can assure you that despite it not being hot out (to us Texans, anyway), your car will start getting very warm fast. When I’m early to pick up my daughter at school, with a couple of minutes, the car is unbearable when the windows are closed.

[Dewey_Finn]

@t-bonham@scc.net

I stayed out of the family drama, and dealt with it in another way – I took her toddler outside and showed him how the horn worked, and what fun it was to honk it whenever mommy was taking too long.

Isn’t the toddler going to be belted into the car seat?

[Fuzzy_wuzzy]

@Melbourne

At 6y, my parents used to put me and my sister (7y) into the car to sleep at night, to make it possible to get an early start in the morning without waking us.

No, not the same as killing your baby. Still, I think that sometimes the fear gets a little shrill.

Absolutely. I haven’t clicked the link. I think the rights and wrongs of this particular story depend upon the weather and how long the baby was left in the car; how “hot” is hot?

[Dangerosa]

@t-bonham@scc.net

A relative once left the kids in a car while running into the store “just to pick up one thing” only to have it take longer than expected. Nothing serious happened, but when they heard about it, other relatives upbraided her, with lengthy family drama ensuing.

I stayed out of the family drama, and dealt with it in another way – I took her toddler outside and showed him how the horn worked, and what fun it was to honk it whenever mommy was taking too long.

The risk there might be in letting your family know about it and inviting the commentary and ensuing drama Frankly, some people don’t use the sense God gave them - and not about leaving kids in the car for a few minutes.

Toddlers are worse than infants to leave “for a few minutes” - they lack any sense at all, and the little monkeys are perfectly capable of figuring out how to undo their car seat, open the door, take off their diaper, and run nude around a crowded parking lot while singing the last new word they learned - “fuck.” Which isn’t safe for them and is really embarrassing. And if they don’t do that, they are perfectly capable of communicating to Grandma that Mom left them in the car alone for HOURS.

[Doctor_Jackson]

@carnivorousplant

Then you get out of line and bring the kid in in six minutes.
:rolleyes:

Glad to see you have a complete command over tracking time while distracted. Look, I provided a reliable cite that basically says no amount of time is safe at any temp above 60 degrees F for infants and toddlers. Whether you choose to heed that factual tidbit is completely up to you.

[carnivorousplant]

@Doctor_Jackson

Look, I provided a reliable cite that basically says no amount of time is safe at any temp above 60 degrees F for infants and toddlers. Whether you choose to heed that factual tidbit is completely up to you.

Surely that is a typo. I spent most of my life indoors at 72F.

[Marley23]

@Doctor_Jackson

Look, I provided a reliable cite that basically says no amount of time is safe at any temp above 60 degrees F for infants and toddlers.

You provided a cite that a car can become dangerous in 10 to 15 minutes depending on the ambient temperature. That’s something parents should know because it would create a real danger for children, but this is the kind of inflated idea of risk I was talking about. No, you did not show that any temperature above 60 is immediately dangerous. A moment’s reflection shows that that’s absurd. The reality is that parents should be very careful with their children and so should outsiders who are thinking about intervening to “rescue” a child.