GQs about growing herbs

Cafe Society
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…and best ways to prune, harvest, and care for them.

In my container herb garden, I currently have catnip, mint, cilantro, basil, and golden sage.

While I know it’s recommended to not let basil flower as then the leaves get bitter, is there any restrictions on allowing catnip, mint, or sage to flower?

Actually, I’m brand-new to sage, so how quickly does it grow, when would it flower, how often/how much should I prune (I often feel like I can’t eat my plants as fast as they grow, actually :slight_smile: ), will it attempt to “spread” from its pot, or will it be happy to grow vertically instead?

My cilantro is currently going to seed, so for reseeding, is it best to wait until the seeds are dry before replanting, or can I pull off the green seeds and plant?

I’m sure I’ll think of more later…

2

Moved from General Questions to Cafe Society, where you’ll get many more responses.

samclem, moderator

3

Oh snap, since this started in GQ I didn’t see it when I started an herb thread here just twelve minutes after this OP. I’d have just added my own to it.

4

I keep a wooden planter full of herbs on the porch right outside the kitchen door which makes it easy and natural to use them. Cilantro should be used before it goes to seed, if you use it a lot you should start a few seeds every week because it matures so fast. Oregano, thyme, chives, and parsley do great in pots, you can grow and use them all season long w/o worrying about them flowering out. Bugs don’t eat herbs! Go figure.

5

Bump. Anyone?

Also, since we’ve moved from GQ, now I can ask if anyone has ideas for how to use sage in food. I know it’s commonly used in meats, but we are a vegetarian household, and I’m eager for ideas on what kinds of veggie foods it might complement.

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Sage won’t spread out of a pot, it grows like a mini bush, rather than spreading like mint or something. It’s not a very fast grower, so don’t worry about it going crazy if left for a while; I’ve had one in the ground for two years, and it’s still only about 15" tall and 18" wide.

I’ve had some very nice sage and mushroom roasts, I think it goes well with nuts too.

I just let mine get on with flowering- the strength of the flavour changes through the year a bit, but it doesn’t die back or anything after flowering.

7

Basil and cilantro are ‘live fast, die young’ type herbs. Once they go to seed, they will die soon after. You can postpone this by cutting off the flowering stalks regularly, but also just plant new ones every few weeks, so that they are ready to take over when the old ones die.

Catnip, mint and sage you can cut back as often as you like, and at least after flowering. Cutting them back encourages bushiness and leaf growth (for basil and cilantro as well). My sage grows a lot faster than Filbert’s, it seems (the climate here is probably warmer) but it doesn’t get out of control or anything.

I’ve never tried planting green seeds. I have a feeling it’s better to wait till they are dry.

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Much better to let the seeds (and the rest of the plant, really) dry all the way. By the way, the seeds are called coriander in American English (which makes the distinction that leaves = cilantro and seeds = coriander) and they have a completely different taste from the leaves: very citrus-y. You can lightly toast and grind them to use in recipes that call for it.

Side note: cilantro/coriander seeds need darkness to germinate, so make sure they’re covered by at least 1/4" of soil when you’re re-planting them. Otherwise, they’re pretty quick & easy to sow (unlike, say, parsley, which takes for-frigging-ever to germinate. I read somewhere an old-timey saying that parsley “has to go to the devil and back seven times” before it can come up into the sun.)

The same essential oils that humans find so captivating are unpalatable to bugs. I believe that in some cases, such as rosemary, they’re downright toxic to insects.

Try frying them in olive oil and using them as a tasty-yet-fancy garnish.

ETA: just noticed the username/post combo above mine. LOL :smiley:

9

Sage will eventually take over your garden, as will mint. I don’t know where you live, but both of those will survive a mild winter, if covered. Thyme will also take over, once it gets a foothold, and is equally hardy. So is oregano. At present we have enough of all four of those to feed a small country.

Cilantro and basil are somewhat fussy, especially basil, which will sometimes swoon if you look at it funny.

If you plant chives, they’re very hardy and also produce a nice flower when they bolt (like many alliums).

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Yeah, sage and mint have survived all my Chicago winters, so they should be fine. Sage doesn’t take over the garden the way mint does, though. At least not either of the two sage bushes I’ve had (I tend to replace them every six years or so.) They just grow into big bushes. Mint goes all over the friggin’ place through its runners. You might plant some mint in a little corner of your garden and within a year or two, it’ll just take over a 10’x10’ plot. Chives are pretty crazy, too. Mine are fairly isolated, but the current crop of chives is about 60 feet from where they were originally planted years ago.

11

According to “Cooking with Herbs and Spices”, Sage is good with:
Cheddar cheese (blend together, server as canapes and sandwhiches)
Cottage cheese (same)
Fish
Game
Meats
Poultry
Sauces (Brown sauces)
Soups (cream soups, fish chowders)
Stews
Stuffings
Veggies (Eggplant, lima beans, onions, peas, tomatoes. Place safe leaf in water with veggies that are boiled or stewed).
It also mentions using it in a flavored honey or jam, or an herbal tea.

12

It would go well with mushrooms. Beans, as well, especially green beans. I also wouldn’t hesitate putting a big of sage butter on roast vegetables. Basically, anywhere I’d use “earthy” types of herbs like rosemary, thyme, or marjoram, I think sage would work well as a twist.

13

Given the right conditions, oregano will crowd out sage and thyme. Trust me, I know!

Flowering on any of the 3 doesn’t seem to make a bit of difference.

Mint is something you’ll want to plant in it’s own container- it’s basically an invasive weed that happens to smell and taste good. With adequate water, it’ll crowd out just about anything else. Consequently it’s stupid-easy to grow and keep alive. If you like mojitos or mint juleps or anything that uses a fair bit of mint, it’s well worth getting a mint plant (seed doesn’t grow true apparently) and growing it.

Sage goes really well with beans, actually. It’s also very good (I think) with pork.

Thyme is probably the most versatile of the garden herbs- most everything has thyme in it, I’ve come to find out.

Cilantro and basil both grow really fast, go to seed and die, with cilantro doing it at about 2x-3x the rate that basil does- you can plant basil in the spring and it’ll go to seed in July around here, but cilantro will have already gone to seed and resprouted by the time the basil goes to seed.

You can “deadhead” both of them by snipping the blooms off, and keep them from dying, but it’s a total PITA if you have more than one plant. One year, I took to using my weedeater on my basil plants because they were so big and there were so many to try and deadhead on my own.

14

A couple of notes on sage tea: it’s influential on women’s, uh, bodily secretions.

It’s best avoided by most nursing moms, especially if the milk production is low. On the other hand, if you’re weaning suddenly or you’ve got too much milk production and are getting engorged despite the best efforts of your baby to adjust it, then a little sage tea can help dry up the excess milk.

Sometimes women who are menstruating find their flow heavier but their period shorter if they drink sage tea just before and during menstruation. I’ve done this when I’m due 2 or 3 days before I leave for a camping trip; it takes about a day and a half off my normal time frame. But it’s not a particularly pleasant period, so I don’t do it every month.

Catnip tea is great for soothing headcolds and calming upset tummies, but it tastes like ass. Add honey and lemon, it helps.

Most herb seeds need to be fully mature, which generally means dry, before they will germinate. Pulling them off the plant while green means immature seeds, which generally won’t germinate. Wait until they fall off or until the plant has died back, leaving the seeds behind. (This is a general rule of thumb, and exceptions do apply, but it will work for what you’ve listed.)

Sage - is phenomenal in veggie stew. It dries well, either in a dehydrator or laid out on some clean brown paper grocery bags in a single layer and turned daily to thwart molding.

Basil - doesn’t dry or freeze well, but basil *pesto *freezes well.

Cilantro - one of those love it or hate it herbs, so I generally keep it to the side and let people add it on their own. It’s best added at the end of cooking most dishes anyway, as the essential oils are delicate and evaporate quickly. It’s wonderful with onions on (not in) chili. And chimichurritastes like life. (That recipe also works really well with grilled marinated tofu for the vegetarians.)

Rosemary - Cut up one or more of the following: sweet potatoes, regular potatoes, carrots, beets, turnips, rutabagas, parsnips, winter squashes (pumpkin, acorn, butternut, etc.), red onions, and/or sliced Brussels sprouts in half through the stem. Toss with bacon grease or cooking oil (not olive, though - olive’s smoke point is too low), kosher salt, whole peeled garlic cloves and a couple of rosemary sprigs. Lay in a single layer on a cookie sheet and roast at 425 for an hour or so, stirring every 20 minutes until the edges are browned. When it’s out of the oven, taste and adjust the salt and add some fresh ground black pepper (pepper burns, don’t add it before you roast!) Absolutely divine. Serve as a side dish or over a bed of quinoa for a complete vegetarian meal.

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Oh! And don’t throw away those basil flowers! You can cook with them, too, in any dish you’d use basil leaves for. They’re a little more delicate and complex in flavor, but very yummy. Or, for a more unusual presentation, try these Lemon Basil Flower Shortbread Cookies. So yummy. (It uses lemon zest and basil flowering tops, but I’d like to try it sometime with Lemon Basil!)

16

Culinary sage does not spread rampantly in a garden (or in a pot, for that matter), at least not remotely like mint.

African blue basil is a terrific ornamental and easily propagated by cuttings. The taste has camphor overtones compared to culinary basil, but some people make pesto out of it.

17

We never have that sort of trouble with our basil. We buy 6-8 seedlings of different varieties, chuck them into pots on the patio with twice weekly waterings if it doesn’t rain, and they thrive like crazy right up until a heavy frost. We harvest it or prune it when watering often enough that it pretty much never gets a chance to flower, though, so that’s probably a lot of it.

The couple of times DoctorJ has tried to grow cilantro, though, it’s been an epic fail. I’m not sure he’s completely convinced I don’t sneak out at night and dose the stuff with Roundup. (I promise, I don’t dose his ass-weed with Roundup.)

Herbs are pretty easy keepers, really. Put them in a bigger pot than you think they need, put them in full sun, and water them periodically. Most of them will grow like the weeds they are. Mint, oregano, rosemary, and thyme all survive Kentucky winters uncovered, at least for a few years. You’ll have to cut out a bunch of the mint roots and replenish the soil to get it to grow all that well the second year, though.

18

CrazyCatLady, I meant that basil is not a perennial like sage that lives from year to year. I used to work in a plant store and sometimes people would come in upset because their basil had died at the end of the season. You can prolong its life by cutting it back a lot, but it is always going to die when it gets cold.

Cilantro doesn’t always transplant well, so you might have more success with growing it from seed, in the spot where you want it to grow (cue ten people turning up to say they have never had any problems planting out cilantro seedlings). If you use seedlings, it can help to water them daily or so, until they are established.

19

Thanks for all the info and ideas. I figured the cilantro seeds would have to dry out first, I’m just impatient and was hoping I could speed the process. :slight_smile: It looks like the plant it drying up now, so I should be able to replant soon, and then I can hopefully do so in rotations so I always have some ready to harvest at any given time. My only issue this time around was that, oddly, out of all the seeds I planted in the pot, I got exactly one to germinate. (Had the same problem with the basil, but I did cuttings when it was big enough and now have a fairly bushy plant.)

I can’t keep up with my catnip and mint. Clearly I need more mint recipes. :smiley: I just harvested and again they are attempting to escape from their pots already. The catnip is for the cat, so perhaps I should figure out how to dry some. What’s the best way to do that? Just on paper towels in a sunny place?

BTW, I had to move all my pots indoors when I moved last year, as the back deck in the new place gets no sun or rain at all. It is literally an inch away from the neighboring building, and covered. I remain saddened that I had to give up my tomato plants because of this. Anyway, the herbs currently reside in a west-facing window in the dining room (the kitchen overlooks said dank back deck).

Oh – given that my basil is an indoor plant and will not be subject to any cold outdoor temps, when could I generally expect it to give up for the winter? I’m thinking about letting it go to seed at the end of the season so I don’t have to buy new seeds/seedlings next year, but I also want as much food as I can get out of the plant before its time runs out.

20

Herbs can pretty much be divided into two groups: soft (annuals) and woody (perennials).

Your soft herbs will flower and die off , but you can still use the leaves until that happens. If you’re growing them in containers, the best way to save the seeds is to pop a small paper bag over the flower heads after blooming and as the seeds ripen they will drop into the bag and dry out. You can then use them for future plantings. If growing in a garden bed, the seeds will drop and self-germinate so you don’t need to save them as such.

Woody herbs (like sage, rosemary, lavender etc) flower sometimes constantly, but it can be difficult to propagate from seed. The easiest way is to ‘layer’ the plant, which means bending a branch of the plant into the adjoining soil and weighing it down with a peg, or rock or whatever. You might want to put a small nick in the stem where it goes into the dirt as this encourages quicker root development. After a few weeks you can cut the new plant off the mother-plant and then transplant to another part of the garden or into a pot if you prefer.

One thing I’ve heard (and I come here for advice) is that for propagation purposes, you should never take a cutting from a plant whilst it is flowering. Is this true, or just a furphy?