Does anyone know whether the word like, used to mean similar to, takes the accusative or nominative form of a pronoun? Should it be, “He should do it like me,” or, “He should do it like I (do)?”
The correct form is “like I (do).”
However, this has fallen so much out of use that it will probably only impress your english professor. Everyone else will think you are a pretentious jerk. However, if you actually say the implied “do,” it sounds much more natural.
Similar phrases that are grammatically correct but not used are: “woe is I” and “It is I.” “Me” is almost always used in these cases, but is not correct.
I have a client who calls me every six or eight months, and doesn’t give his name, he only says, “It is I.” I always know who it is, 'cause he’s the only one of my clients punctilious enough to be so annoyingly correct.
Iberii, shouldn’t your sig be “Me am the Walrus”?
I think “woe is me” is correct. It doesn’t mean “Woe and I are the same thing”; I see it as a contracted form of “Woe is being heaped upon me,” or some such.
The phrase “woe is me” is technically incorrect. It would be like saying “sad is me” instead of “sad am I” (meaning “I am sad”).
But “woe is me” is much more poetic.
What bugs me is someone will say “just between you and I” thinking that “you and I” sounds proper, and then says “It’s you and me for dinner”, when “you and I” actually would be proper. Maybe I am a snob, but I cring when my friend answers the phone with “This is her”.
OP: *Does anyone know whether the word like, used to mean similar to, takes the accusative or nominative form of a pronoun? Should it be, “He should do it like me,” or, “He should do it like I (do)?” *
iberii: *The correct form is “like I (do).” *
No, not really. Strictly speaking, “like” is a preposition and thus should be followed by the accusative: “His son looks a lot like him,” “It would be just like her to do that stupid thing,” “My mother’s like me: we both hate loud noises.” “Like” is strictly proper only for nominal comparisons: comparing the nouns (or pronouns) “son” and “him,” “it” and “her”, “mother” and “me”.
To compare verbal phrases, you need a conjunction, namely “as”. “As” compares two verbal clauses, both in the nominative. Since you want to compare what you and he do (instead of “He should be like me,” which would compare you and him directly), you need to use “as”: “He should do it as I (do).”
I’m not saying that this won’t make you sound like some effete intellectual who’s just begging for five in the mush. I’m just telling you what’s formally correct.
(This always makes me think of that number from Singin’ in the Rain, probably the world’s only example of a grammatically impeccable popular love song: “He’ll kiss her with a sigh; Would you, would you? And if that girl were I, Would you, would you? And if I were to say, `Let’s do the same as they,’ I would…would you?”)
Woe worth those who confuse nouns and adjectives.
Woe is a noun. Thus, “Woe is me!” is correct. The meaning is “Woe be to me”. I suppose it’s actually dative case if anyone’s counting.
This is unlike ‘sad’, since ‘sad’ is an adjective. It’s correct to say, “Sad is I!” or “I am sad!” but not “Woe is I!” nor “I is woe!”.
panama jack
wishing well, not woe, to all
There is nothing worse than the Doors’ Light My Fire. If I hear Jim Morrison say “if I was to say to you” one more time, I think I will do something very naughty.
MR
I always thought “woe” was a variation of “woeful,” as in “Woeful am I.”
panamajack is correct that it is a noun, although it is first listed as an interjection in my dictionary. I still don’t think “woe is me” is perfectly correct in the most technical of senses, since if I were to substitute the meaning of “woe” for the word itself, the sentence doesn’t make sense: “A condition of deep suffering from misfortune, affliction, or grief is me!” But the substitution does make sense using the construction “Woe be unto me!” Hmmm. I think Safire wrote a column on this a while back; anyone know right off the bat where to find it?
I guess it’s up to me to give the straight dope on this pronoun thing. First we do some exercises.
OK, everyone who thinks that “It’s I” is right or should be right (although it sounds stilted) repeat after me:
“English is not Latin!”
Again
“English is not Latin!”
I can’t hear you!
“English is not Latin!”
Better. Now 100 more times.
“English is not Latin!”
…
Very good. Now, repeat this 50 times:
“To be is not an equal sign!”
OK. It was a bit ragged at the end there, but I think you’re on your way to being deprogrammed, so maybe we can discuss this rationally.
The idea that the predicate of the verb to be should be in the subjective case is another one of those Latinisms, similar to the infinitive not being split (and I hope we all agree that that is a bogus rule).
The rules for the use of the subjective and oblique (or objective) cases in English are really simple. Subjective pronouns are only used for a simple subject of a verb. And only when the verb is present. In all other uses, the oblique case is used. That includes compound subjects: “I am going to town.” vs. “Me and him are going to town.” but not “He and I are going to town.” And also when the pronoun stands alone: “Who’s there?” “Me”, not “I”. “It’s me.” or “I am.” are also OK, but not “It’s I.”
So the answer to the OP is quite simple. In “He should do it like me”, ‘me’ is not the simple subject of a verb, so it should not be in the subjective case. If you were to add a verb after it, then the subjective case would be correct.
Half of you are probably reaching for that followup key (your deprogramming didn’t take) to blast me to smithereens for blasphemy. But let me say a couple things in defense.
Firstly, English usage as I described above is virtually identical to French usage (allowing for different words, of course). That includes using the oblique case in a compound subject. Now we know that French descends from Latin, so why doesn’t it follow Latin rules? And if it doesn’t follow Latin rules, why does a non-Romance language like English have to?
Secondly, I didn’t make any of this up. I got it all from Word on the Street by John McWhorter:
I recommend this book, although some of stuff at the end in defense of Ebonics I find questionable. The stuff before he gets there is quite good.