Guitar amp shopping!

[WordMan]

On BlackBerry, waiting to pick up Indian food. I will try to do a speaker brain-dump sometime tomorrow…

[WordMan]

@squeegee

Anyway, both amps sound good and tubey (overlooking the Traynor’s drive channel), they both seem very well built and solid (the Traynor feels like it could survive a drop down a flight of stairs). I just enjoy playing the BJr more. I think this may rest on the Blue’s Junior NOS’s speaker. I played some BJr’s with the stock speaker in the store, and if I’d tested one vs the Traynor, I think I might have chosen the Traynor.

Any thoughts on why that Jensen vs the Celestion might sound better? Or just guitar speaker observations in general? I know next to nothing about that topic.

I don’t know what to say - I mean, your discussion of their circuits supports your point: they’re both tube amps. But yeah, those “chips and circuit boards” may make a difference - but I don’t know enough to provide credible specifics. And yes, speakers are part of the Holy Trinity - pre-amp, power amp, speaker - of Tone, i.e., the 3 most critical components (and yes, I will try to do that speaker dump in a paragraph or two)…so for now, let’s just assume that they are both entry-level simple-tube circuits and this combo of components takes the BJr up a notch.

As for why Jenson vs. Celestion - no specific answer; specific models have widely varying specs. Also, I have not spent a lot of time A/B’ing speakers over my guitar lifetime; like effects pedals, it is an area I have not delved into deeply. I have found what worked for me and stuck with it.

Here are some basic points of “conventional wisdom” about speakers -

• There are American Voiced and British Voiced - i.e., Fender-style, traditionally Jensen, Weber, etc. and Marshall/Vox style, typically Celestion. One is not better than the other but people have clear preferences. Dialing in your tone involves making a choice and from the sound of it, you picked Jensen - now, that may be because the speaker model is a step up vs. the Celestion in terms of speaker quality, not due to a preference in the voicing, but we’d have to geek a bit harder if we wanted to go that far.

But Jensens contribute to the overall Fender / American voice - i.e., more open bell-like cleans and an overdrive that comes on more smoothly, with a steady increase in warmth and grit until you end up in crunchland. The speakers aren’t as “tight” - typically because they are part of a Fender open-back cabinet design (because the cab is open, sound pours out the back, adding more sound in a slight delay from the sound in front - so it is thickened up with that slight delay and tight lows get blurred a bit…).

British-voiced speakers are heavier built as a rule and break up earlier and with a more aggressive crunch. They are part of a closed-cab system, so the sound is more focused out of the front, and the speakers have a tighter travel, because the air stays in the back, providing a bit of resistance to the cone. All of this contributes to the tighter lows, even gained up, of a guitar through a Marshall stack.

• Magnet size matters - as a rule, the bigger the magnet, the more responsive the speaker is. I am not sure why.

• Obviously - cabinet design matters; see above. With amp circuit, speaker type and cab type, geeks like me mess around. I like Fender circuits coupled with Marshall speakers. I really like closed-back cabs, especially in a 2x12 or a 4x12, but for my small rig, I use an open-backed Tweed design (i.e., based on Fender’s “Tweed” amps from the 50’s) fitted with a Celestion Blue…

• Celestion Alnico Blues rock - they are a small-watt speaker (I think they can handle 15 watts vs. 30 for the Vintage 30’s, but there is a new Celestion Gold which is supposed to be like a Blue but rated at 50w). They were originally in Vox amps and so have that clear articulate tone that crunches up really smoothly and nicely.

So, my friend, that’s what I’ve got for now - process it and see if anything clicks in your head based on what you’ve been experiencing and/or push back as needed…

[squeegee]

Wow!! Thanks for the detailed guitar speaker primer! Maybe this should be also posted in the Great Guitar Thread. It seems like something that is generally useful knowledge for players.

Re: open v closed cabs - Are there closed cab tube combos? I’d think no, because the tubes need air to cool them. OTOH, I suppose you could just make the combo taller to give the tubes some space, and have an open, upper part that has the tubes n chassis, and a sealed lower part where the speaker lives. I poked around on Marshall’s web site and couldn’t find any pix of the back of one of their combo amps, nor on Musician’s Friend.

[WordMan]

Yes, there are closed back tube combo’s - you will see where the amp head/chassis at the top has an opening for the tubes to cool, but the speaker section has a full back…