ETA: I take that back – the control layout doesn’t match that picture link above. There seems to be five knobs and two switches on that puppy (the hell?). But the plastic panel that the controls sit on is pretty much the same shape/position as on my guitar.
That instrument has no place in a church. I mean, it has horns, for God’s sake!
Don’t even Know what a Dr Z is - and don’t have time to search right now (or read the rest of the thread probably).
My kit isn’t custom or flash, just old. The “practice” amp is about 20 years old, all valve and is badged Park which I believe translates as old Marshall*. I used to have two (stereo!) but I was an idiot and sold one.
The Marshall is 1970 or 71, I bought I from a guy who was using it as a disco amp(!?) with two 2 by 12 cabinets loaded with Vox blues.
The Laney (which was too bloody loud anyway) got px’d for a guitar I think.
Gotta go - there’s a PRS soapbar in the guitar shop waiting for me. I’ll catch the rest of the thread later.
- Marshall have started using the Park name again, my amp is not one of the new ones.
**squeegee ** - here’s what I got:
- I know your guitar, but don’t know the official name - a fella I work with has a similar one with soapbar pickups. They were made in the early 70’s. I tried checking here:
Vintage Guitars Info - Gibson solidbody vintage guitar collecting
but didn’t see a lot - but that guy and his website is a huge trove of info on vintage Gibson - you should also try the Les Paul Forum and check the Other Gibsons section.
- Your SG is only a bit collectible - but that may be increasing. Unfortunately, it has the rep of not being particularly attractive due to that control plate vs. rear-loaded SG’s.
- at the LP forum there is a bunch of info on serial numbers if you search the boards - certainly in Other Gibsons and the Vintage forum. They were a bit varied back them - my '73 has an LE serial number (Limited Edition - oooo; ahhhh) which is a different scheme than yours. Again, there a lot of geeks on the LPF who know this stuff - better they steer you than I do.
The one I have played from the guy at work was a nice guitar - the neck is on the slimmish side, which isn’t my preference, but for a slim profile neck, it was super comfortable and it has a great, woody, SG tone - I hope you enjoy yours.
Sorry I can’t jump straight to the answer, but if you have other questions, I am happy to try to point you to the right direction. I know a lot about web resources for the research…
An old Park?! Some of those totally rock - and from the sound of it, yours is one - very cool! Those are really going up in value as vintage amps get snapped up. I love their tone.
And a PRS Soapbar? A Korean SE one? THose are suprisingly well-made for the money; although I am a Gibson guy, it is very easy to say that PRS build quality for the lower-priced models is superior. If it is one of the McCarty Soapbar - a McSoapy to the aficionados (sigh) then I would love to hear more about it…
Wow. Thanks for posting that clip. I just bought one of her albums off iTunes (yay instant gratification.) Her voice is great, and I can’t believe I never heard her before.
**Idlewild ** - we await a full report!
**squeegee ** - here are some threads from the LP Forum on SGs - includes some tributes to the “ugly” ones from the 70’s (sorry - that’s the lingo) and some SG reference sites…good lord, am I a geek.
Wordman - Thanks much for all the vintage SG links!!
I’m betting my guitar is a '71 SG Deluxe. It looks (well, looked) exactly like this one, and also this one, including that horrid Bigsby tailpiece that I’d removed.
I like the guitar OK, but mixed feelings. I really like the flat & slim neck; my hands aren’t that big, so its a good fit, and for some reason I like the flatness better than the roundness of my Strat-clone. Unfortunately, I’m not that happy with the tone – its somewhat tinny and thin sounding (though others might call it twangy and like it just fine), and has little sustain (probably a combination of the light body – it’s so light it feels like a good wind will loft it – and my frankenstein tail-piece work).
I don’t really care all that much if it has vintage $$$ value (though that would be nice), but I don’t play it much and would willingly unload it on someone who could love it more than I do. But I wasn’t looking for profit, just curious about the provenance.
Thanks so much for the pointers and help.
Sure! Happy to help.
(you might try playing it with the Tone knob on your guitar rolled off to about 6 - takes the biting highs off the top end - if the guitar has good components…)
OK, I’ll do that. Thanks.
Well, it has the same electronics stuff in it that Gibson put in originally. Dunno if that’s considered “good”.
That’s a whole 'nother area of geekery. With your guitar being from the 70’s it is unclear; that is right when they were “upgrading” to more modern electronic components, to the detriment of tone. Very similar to the switch from tubes to solid state back then - more modern component, but crap tone. Just like tubes, the old-style capacitors (part of the Tone circuit) were inefficient - but inefficient in a musical way; the way they reacted inefficiently happened to reduce bad-sounding harmonic overtones and emphasize good-sounding ones. So you could roll off the Tone control and it would lower the highs, but “leak” out the good frequencies just enough so that the bass-heavy tone didn’t sound flat and farty. Clapton’s infamous Woman Tone (on Sunshine of Your Love, for instance) is the ultimate version of this - neck pickup with the Tone rolled off completely. Given the old guitars he was playing, they had the good components, so it sounded rich, rounded and tubey. When a guitar has modern components, they are so efficient that they lop off the highs clean - which leads to yuck.
All I am saying is that a judicious roll off your Tone control is a worthwhile experiment. With P-90 pickups, to cite an extreme example, having the Tone on 10 is pretty much the worst tone the pickup offers (unless you are wailing a lead and want that much hairy feedback on your tone). Gibson humbucker pickups can also really sound different. It may simply sound like another version of crap, but given the era of your guitar, it is worth a try - roll the Volume off to about 8.5 and the Tone to about 6 and see what you hear. Play AC/DC chords - big, hard-stroked open A’s and D’s - and see if it makes your arm hairs stand on end - you may be onto something.
oh, and squeegee, my buddy at work replied with an online link to an SG book:
Paste this into your browser - I think it shows info on both your SG and his…
I noticed that both of the pics that Squeegee provided of a similar looking SG to his own both show the strings top wrapped. I called my brother last night to tell him about that as he has a Les Paul double cut and I’m waiting to hear back from him to see if it makes a differance.
But thats a Bigsby tail piece… I’m not sure there’s any other way to wrap the strings and still get tension on that intermediate “leverage” bar between the tail and the bridge. Does that count as “top wrapped” ? OTOH, I discarded my bigsby way long ago, so what do I know?
Yep - that’s correct. It doesn’t really count as top-wrapped; a Bigsby presents its own variation to what is happening behind the bridge. Since it is a form of whammy bar, it floats; it is not the stationary anchor that a stud tailpiece is. Different beast - it’s free-floating mechanics absorb some vibrations, but completely different ones - and some folks like that, even over and above the fact that a Bigsby offer whammy-ness. Elliot Easton of the Cars hangs out at the Les Paul Forum; when he was talking about his Gibson signature SG he specifically mentioned that it comes with a Maestro vibrato bar (a variant from a Bigsby used by Gibson) but he takes the bar off his; he just likes what the tailpiece does for the tone…)
Fill us in on what your brother says.
Well…darn. I just tried top-wrapping the frankenbridge on my SG, but the tail piece, screwed all the way down flat, is actually slightly taller than the saddles on my bridge. I could raise the action really high to compensate, but… well the action would be insanely high. I think I’d need to replace the tail piece with a lower profile equivalent to top-wrap that guitar. If I can find a tail piece that can set in the same adjustment screw width as the one currently on there, and I’m not sure those were very standard in width. 
Hmm, that doesn’t sound correct; it really sounds like something is out of its proper position. The break over a T-O-M down to the normal TP position is pretty severe; top-wrapping shallows it out, but there is still plenty of break over the saddles to function properly and keep the strings in their saddle grooves.
I don’t know if your T-O-M should be raised (which of course has implications for the action over the fingerboard, which means you really need to check neck relief, and so on…). That relationship is a critical part of a larger system and so trying to change it without regarding the whole system and figuring out what needs to happen to bring it into true is premature. I would recommend getting it set up by a guitar tech in your area - should be $50 - $75, plus the cost of a set of strings and any other parts and labor for any more significant adjustments. If you plan to try 10’s, top-wrapping and/or de-tuning down a half-step to Eb, tell the tech; they will set it up with those in place and tune the whole system taking them into account…
oops