Has "Lost" Lost It?

This is exactly right. The character development has IMO been rather stunning through most of the series; Locke’s ineffectiveness, Ben’s sympathetic villainy, Jack’s disillusioned leadership–the series has masterfully developed these character traits and set up plot situations that tests their realtive advantages and limitations.

The details of the Dharma initiative and who Hanso is has never been that important for me; sure I’d like them to make sense, but not at the expense of dumping the fascinating complexity of the drama. The mysteries and various plotlines are interesting only inasmuch as they set up good (and plausible) dramatic situations; putting them front and center is like criticizing an artwork based on the chemical properties of the paint used.

Lost has been great throughout, imho. While it certainly meandered a bit in Season’s 2 and 3, these meanders are only really irritating when you wait for new episodes week to week, and then get stuck with a character or story you weren’t as invested in. On DVD, this frustration really isn’t there as much since you never have to wait, and a lot of the diversions (aside from Nikki and Paulo, ugh) are actually pretty rewarding.

I think too many people have M Night Shamalyan syndrome, where all they seem to care about is figuring out the trick, and that’s all they’re really there for. That’s fun, of course, but it’s a really shallow way to enjoy a drama. And the show has always been about the great writing, the twists and turns in the characters, and so on.

I can sort of see SenorBeef’s point about the diversions from characters explaining things to each other, but the thing is, either you get over that or you don’t. The writers have done a pretty good job, I think, of mostly providing both plausible character reasons for why certain characters don’t WANT to reveal certain information and also letting actual characters on the show express frustration about the secrecy directly (Hurley is a good example). No, these reasons aren’t airtight, but they’re more than enough to allow a viewer to simply accept them in process and buy the characters… if they want to.

In Dharmaville, for instance, the characters have been slowly talking to each other, but they don’t get much time especially since they are all supposed to be pretending not to know each other and having other big events happening.

Again, you either accept this or you don’t, as part of the story and the larger mythology of the storytelling. I think getting too hung up on it is a waste of what is really a great show: one of the best in a looooong time.

I mean, a lot of the odd plot devices (time travel) and things that are used on this show could easily come off as gimmicks. But they are often used to full effect to tell great and creative stories.

If they hadn’t given us an end date, I would have abandoned it. As it is, I am happy to watch and see how they wrap things up.

(Still wondering if my first-season prediction that Adam and Eve are a time-traveling Jack and Kate will come true.)

Lost was lose at about the second season. They had an interesting plot and a big cast of characters, and then you find that the other half of the plane lives, and the smoke monster is a good guy…sometimes and that the island is a maaaaaagical place where people learn to walk again and people come back from the dead all the time and…
Yeah, I stopped watching early in. My girlfriend loves the show, though.

The whole ‘why don’t they talk?’ complaint, as in SenorBeef’s post, while I get it, it still kind of bugs me.

I mean, what exactly do you want them to say? With the amount of commercials that are added into the episodes and as complicated as the plot has become(and really always has been), there is not a whole lot of time for exposition. Spoon feeding the story to the audience would be the only real purpose of showing such conversations; I’m sure many, or most, shows might go this route, but I’m glad Lost doesn’t.

Who’s to say that they don’t talk about these things along their walks? It’s not as though we have the camera on them for the whole trek. Speaking of scene changes, it seems that many of the questions that people want the characters to ask each other, should really never occur to them to ask. They simply aren’t seeing what we, the audience, are. Sure they have been on the island or in the Dharma camp longer than the viewer, but they are probably still a lot further in the dark.

As well, I don’t see why Sawyer, even after three years, would be privy to all sort of pertinent information about Dharma. My workplace for example, security knows just about all there is regarding the general day-to-day operations, but wouldn’t necessarily know what specific projects and objectives are trying to be reached in the labs; and we aren’t exactly the uber-secret Dharma initiative.

Besides, if I were to put myself in their situation, I think I’d be more inclined to adopt the Locke mentality of just going with the current and just waiting to see what happens. At a certain point, probably somewhere between pure survival, miracle healing, tropical polar bears, smoke monsters and hostile natives, though still long before even the thought of time traveling, are the questions even going to be worth asking if the answers are so limited? To pull a relevant quote from a completely unrelated movie, Cannibal! The Musical:

Shpadoinkle!

The monster is invisible and it lifted a 200 pound man into the air and slammed him back down, killing him instantly.

Things like that don’t exist.

I should add that I love this show, from start to present, and would apply the Oklahoma version of that quote to myself. Though, from the characters’ stand point you can’t exactly say things are getting better; plus, they can’t even build a snowman!

Just because we (the viewers) never saw it, doesn’t necessarily mean it was invisible.

Although I do have to agree that the monster has changed from the roaring, tree-stomping whatever-it-was that we saw (or didn’t see :)) in the first few episodes.

I still love it enough to count the days, read all the threads, force myself to stay away from spoilers and see if I can find any secret messages in Jorge Garcia’s blog. :slight_smile:

That said, my SO has given up on it, saying it’s too crazy for him. My daughter still enjoys it but not enough to watch it with me; she watches it when she gets around to it, preferring a few episodes in one sitting. I don’t know a single person other than me out here in the real world that watches it. So maybe it’s lost something.

Just not…me. :slight_smile:

Agreed with this. Of particular annoyance were the scenes the oceanic 6 had with Eloise Hawking. She tells them they must go back to the island. And not one person asks her why they have to go back. Completely unbelievable.

Then there’s the cover-up where the six lie about the rest of the castaways left behind on the island. Ostensibly, it’s to protect them from Charles Widmore but leaving them behind to deal with the Others, hungry polar bears, smoke monsters and the vagaries of being stuck on an island far away from civilization is a better option?

LOST lost it after about the fifth episode in the first season.

No, Lost lost it in season three, then got it back again in season four. This season is better than anything since the first…I am loving where they’re taking the show.

I’m at a strange point where I have an intellectual curiosity about what happens in the story, but I can’t say that I care about what happens to the characters-with two exceptions, Sayid and Desmond. Smokey could roll up, eat Kate, Jack, John, Ben and whoever else it could get a chomp down on, and I’d be going ‘but Desmond’s ok, right?’

But it certainly is getting tighter with its story. No more weekly flashbacks to someone’s third birthday party or other ‘well that was lightly informative, but what the hell’s that big cable plugged into?’ stuff.

Lost went off the rails somewhere in the second season with the writers & diehard fans telling us it was getting better all the time. During that period at least, episodes were full of a whole lot of nothing except for the last minute or so to set up a cliff hanger. I hung around until we saw how Locke lost his legs, and that was it for me.

It’s not that that they didn’t show the characters; it’s that they didn’t talk. Period. Maybe it’s different now, but nearly every time they went on a journey, it was with only part of the group knowing why and keeping the rest in the dark, even at the end of the journey just so there’s a half assed cliff hanger to end the show.

John told them they all had to go back because everyone was in trouble. He couldn’t be more specific because if had said “They’re all jumping through time and getting nosebleeds.” no one would have listened.

Of course, it seems Hawking, Ben, and Charles all have alternative reasons for getting them back, which they won’t tell the six anyways.

If you don’t like the show, that’s fine, but I think it’s pretty ridiculous to say this when the creators have consistently insisted otherwise. Especially considering they have given examples of things like “Adam and Eve” that they included in the first season, but which they knew all along they wouldn’t explain until much later, for the specific purpose of proving that they weren’t making things up as they went along.

Give some examples.

It was randomly blowing up trees as late as Season 3 and 4 when it came. What about it has changed exactly? Aside from the “images from your past” effects becoming, for some reason, more cheesy. Look, Smokey made a powerpoint projector presentation of your life, Ben!

I thought Season 2 was a little weak but otherwise have thoroughly enjoyed the show. I completely understand what the OPs talking about—just don’t agree. And I think there’s a tie-in at the end here that’s going to make the journey more meaningful. It will not, I pray, be Hurley’s dream or some other “it really didn’t happen” shenanigans. I can’t see them doing that…and not being mauled to death by obsessive L O S T lovers.

Well of course they’re going to say otherwise. What else are they gonna say? “Yeah, we’re just stringing you along. We don’t really have anywhere to take this. We’re gonna go totally last season X-files on your ass”?
Some people say the details aren’t that important and that it’s a story about characters. In season 1, I could see that. But the characters don’t even make much sense anymore half the time. Every time a character does something, ask yourself “is there a plausible motivation for them to be doing this?” and frequently there isn’t. The characters have become plot devices to move the story from point to point.

Even the basic premise of this season, having to go back to the Island - why is Jack there? Kate? Hurley?

For them, it seems that they basically had this conversation.

“We Have To Go Back”

“What? Are you crazy? We barely got out of there alive.”

“We Have To Go Back”

“…Others. Smoke Monster. Polar Bears. Remember any of this?”

“We Have To Go Back”

“Oh. Okay.”

Jack came back because his life has gone completely downhill since he left and he’s realized that Locke is right. He also wants to save Juliet. Kate came back to save Sawyer and Claire. We don’t know why Hurley came back, but we will presumably find that out within the next few episodes.

The show does take a little thought. It would be boring if everything was spelled out for you.