Approximately 15 young men ages 15 to 18, described as being of Pakistani heritage, attacked the poor man…Why do we even keep pretending that these creatures deserve even the tiniest shred of consideration as human beings?
Approximately 15 young men ages 15 to 18, described as being Muslim fundamentalists, attacked the poor man…Why do we even keep pretending that these creatures deserve even the tiniest shred of consideration as human beings?
Dogface needs to clarify his meaning, and be more careful with his context.
This is part of the point with my OP: I’d better never go on vacation with a provocative post still lingering out there. Either that, or I need to go around and reply to my own ambiguous posts just for good measure.
There’s nothing conclusive in Dogface’s OP to prove he was directing STUPID savages at any ethnic group or even people of Pakistani heritage.
How much does one need to limit his expression in order to mitigate reprisal?
Lib, you raised some good points in your posts, but you threw it all away with the anti-liberal rhetoric. It’s totally unnecessary and does nothing but detract from your message.
Let it detract from me, if you must. But it ought not to detract from the message. The message is irrespective of the messenger.
Incidentally, I do agree with those who say that Dogface ought to clarify his position. What I disagree with is that his motive ought to be presumed.
Speaking of irony, that’s another one that Tom (or Debb) didn’t catch or else just didn’t find amusing. Those who are jumping on Dogface for presuming the motives of the gang (despite two mentions of the motive in the article) are presuming his motive here.
Boy, this is the SECOND time in a week that I’ve seen SDMBers scream “Where the hell is (Poster X) and why the hell doesn’t he/she respond to this?”
I wish people would get the benefit of the doubt around here. Consider:
not everyone’s lives revolve around the Dope. People have jobs, lives, obligations, families.
computers sometimes crash. Your first priority might not be to responds to a post you made the night before.
emergencies happen. Your first priority might not be to responds to a post you made the night before.
and, most importantly…
When the SDMB’s community passions get stoked, the Dope becomes a very, very, VERY scary place. Dogface might be reeling from the initial reaction that x number of Dopers are calling him a racist/bigot, and he’s trying to figure out exactly how to respond.
I mean, let’s face it: to be branded as any form of a bigot…except, as Libertarian points out, to be bigoted against Fundamentalist Christians…is the brand of doom around here. It’s the Dope’s equivalent of the Scarlet Letter. I know I’m afraid of getting that label slapped on me, and I often go over my text two or three times to resolve any ambiguity before I finally post it.
This place prides itself on “fighting ignorance.” I wish that, so often, it wasn’t about “fighting to make ourselves look better.”
Your two examples seem like more commentary about religious zealotry. If someone railed against an abortion clinic bomber from Wazoo Baptist Church, would you be upset?
Lib, I’ve gotta call bullshit here. There is nothing in Dogface’s posts that indicate the group he’s referring to is fundamentalist Muslim extremists or just the specific individuals involved in the stories he cites. Comparing “those people” to savages who don’t deserve to be treated as human beings are generally not the sort of invective one hurls against individuals, but rather against cultures.
Moreover, I disagree with your assertion that ignorant bigotry aimed at fundamentalist Christians is tolerated and welcomed here. If someone posted a similar OP about how several Christian men beat up a gay guy as further evidence that “these people” obviously aren’t even human, they’d get their ass handed to them. Can you provide an example where someone on this board called all Christians ignorant savages and received nothing but accolades and agreement in return?
You’d have to be blind not to see the pattern in Dogface’s posts. To me, it’s no different than posting story after story of inner-city violence with comments about those people being subhuman savages. It’s bullshit ignorant xenophobic crap, plain and simple.
Actually, I don’t think you’re blind at all. I think you found the response to Dogface’s OP more repugnant than the OP itself, and now are in the unfortunate position of defending him, even though it requires making some rather strained assumptions. It’s my guess that if you were sitting in a bar next to him and he spouted his last few OPs to you word for word, you’d have either rolled your eyes and ignored him or taken him apart for his ignorance.
Either that, or you’re actually a goat named Frieda and my computer monitor is really just an old copy of Life magazine posing as a hat rack.
Well, your first three points mght have a certain amount of merit to them if Dogface had not found the time and the energy and the computer facilities to contribute 20 posts in 19 different threads since he started the thread in question. In that time, he has informed us of the following:
Here he asks someone else for the sort of evidence he is so reluctant to provide in support of his own dribbling:
Here he takes a typical swipe at liberal and left academics:
Here he again asks for a cite, despite his own consistent unwillingness to back up his own assertions:
And he’s so friendly, isn’t he? Furthermore, when someone provided a bunch of cites on the issue at hand, Dogface made no reappearance in the thread.
Here we are treated to a delightful unsupported assertion of the sort that he criticizes others for:
Check out that last line. Have you ever seen anything more simplistic, especially from someone who’s frequently asserting his own capacity for logic and rational thought.
While it is true that there has been controversy over the counting of the popular vote in the Nixon-Kennedy election, the broad consensus still seems to support the idea that Kennedy won by a very narrow margin. Those who argue for a Nixon popular vistory have some interesting evidence on their side regarding the situation in Alabama, but the proof is far from conclusive. To make the bald-faced assertion that Nixon won, without mentioning the fact that the issue is still one of debate, and that the majority still disagree with his position, further demonstrates Dogface’s disingenuousness.
Here he takes another of his frequent, and often illogical, swipes at liberals:
All of these contributions suggest he’s had plenty of time to return to his own thread. I mean, one tends to assume that people start threads on issues that interest them, and that the OP of a thread will have the decency to return and defend or clarify his or her position.
As for your point number (4), ResIpsaLoquitur, if it were someone else i might agree with you. But i’ve seen plenty of Dogface’s posts over the past few months, and his standard MO is to barge into a thread making unsubstantiated generalizations and/or directing unwarranted abuse, and then to dissappear. I’ve hardly ever known him to return to a thread to respond to criticism or a question, even when such things were phrased very politely.
Sorry, but when someone shows such a consistent contempt for the canons of reasonable debate, you can’t really blame other Board members for starting to make assumptions about his or her motives. As i said earlier, it wasn’t really his OP in that other thread that irritated me about him, it’s more his hit-and-run posting style, and his apparent obsession with abusing liberals and certain other groups every chance he gets, whether or not the evidence or the tone of the debate warrant it. People weigh this sort of thing when making determinations about someone’s motives, especially when the person in question makes no effort to clarify his own statements. Most people engage in partisan rhetoric and non-sequiturs every now and again, but with Dogface it’s an obsession. If he actually made intelligent contributions to most of the threads he’s in, it would be easier to overlook the anti-liberal foaming and dribbling, or just make a joke about it, like liberals do with Libertarian’s occasional sputtering.
Have you checked out cheddarsnax’s Pit thread about him, that i linked to above? It provides more evidence of his drive-by tactics.
Dogface is a thin-skinned bigot. Have you ever seen the rabid way he attacks people if they say anything about the Orthodox church that he personally doesn’t agree with?
Well, this was covered extensively in our last “Liberals Conspiracy, don’t tell milroyj” meeting. We of the LCDTM, having taken over the SDMB completely (though nudging some of the arch conservatism out of Beer, CDex etc did take some doing), have moved on to phase two of our master plan for Total Global Domination (TGD[sup]TM[/sup]).
Phase two, as you might suspect involves a liberal (naturally) supply of goats and charred flag remnants. Having established some time ago that only liberals can speak, and setting forth the triad of “those special groups which cannot be maligned” (fanatical Muslim terrorists, gays and criminals, especially those on death row), we’ve got those pesky patriotic Americans right where we want them.
But I fear I’ve said too muchl.
