I don’t think it’s necessarily a “virtue” issue just a practical one. People do the best they can within the limitations of their background, knowledge and experience. Yes, it’s probably true that a well socialized heterosexual male will probably have an easier job overall modeling for a heterosexual son than a homosexual one, but this doesn’t mean a heterosexual man can’t be a good, tolerant and “virtuous” father for gay son.
I always find these discussions vastly amusing, because all the things everyone says children need a father for I got from my mother, and vice versa, except with regards to certain functions of biology before I was weaned. It’s good for kids to have a strong presence to set rules and a nurturing presence to care for them. It matters very little what genders are represented in these positions.
I’m not an expert in this, YMMV, IANAP, etc.
Why stop him?
I don’t want kids to make fun of him.
I went thru that and do not want his feelings hurt.
I and 4 siblings grew up more or less without fathers. While I consider myself to be a successful person in most respects, I deal with a lot of issues that I don’t think I would have had to otherwise. But what I have determined is that it has affected all of my siblings & I in different ways, and some more than others.
I think the most pain is caused by rejection from a parent, whatever the sex of the parent. Even if a child chooses not to have contact with the parent, it’s usually because the parent was unable to be a parent, and is perceived as a rejection by the child.
But I don’t think a blanket answer applies to everyone. It may have affected you, and if you have the means, I’ve found counseling to be a wonderful, nurturing way to work through it. And if it affects you more than it affects others, that’s okay, you may just feel it more deeply. I’ve always felt bad, frustrated and like a crybaby because of how deeply I felt it, but my sister said something like, “I think it affected you more because you’re ‘deep’.” I took that as a wonderful permission to just be okay with feeling how I feel.
I think the amount of the effect depends on the “remaining” parent. It’s important that the child knows it is not his/her fault, and make sure that the child knows that you’re looking out for them.
Lastly, I found this book helpful–
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1558745491/102-1894379-4110561?v=glance
Good luck and take care of yourself!!
My father left before I was old enoughto remember him. I was raised by my mother and grandmother. I’d say I’ve made it through the last quarter century pretty well-adjusted. I’m certainly not effeminate in the least. My wife usually gripes about my being such “a man.” You know how women use the word “man” like it’s a bad thing, sometimes.
I guess I could see how it could happen, but it’s by no means unavoidable.
That’s understandable. Is that how you present it to him? Do you let him do it in the house?
Depends. There’s a strong male presence, and then there’s a strong male presence that actually wants to be a parent.
My mom divorced when I was 4 and remarried three years later. I don’t hardly have any memories of my dad as a father figure (or strong male presence), so the new guy was all I really knew. He had a no-fuse temper, highly intolerant of anyone that couldn’t do or know things like he did, was abusive (some physical, mostly mental), and generally showed no desire to be a parent (my only other comparison as a parent was my mom). He was also an incredibly hard worker, held down 3 jobs most of the time, and always took us on a 2 week vacation every year (so I got to see 85% of the US, for which I am grateful). But he never played with me, never did father-son stuff, never offered to check my homework and never took care of me if I was home sick. By the time I was 10 I realized that I didn’t want him as a role model and avoided him as much as I could (but I always appreciated that I had new clothes to wear and food on the table). Thankfully he nearly always worked 2nd or 3rd shift so we hardly saw each other up until I joined the military.
Apparently, even though I saw my real dad on average once per year for about 10 days, my mom says I still grew up a lot like him; mannerisms, posture, demeanor, etc. I was a very shy kid in junior high and high school, but I finally pulled myself up by my own bootstraps and got myself out of my shell, pretty much thanks to no one but me.
To get back around to the OP, “Having no strong male presence in a broken home= Bad thing?” Between a “father” that I only knew for 4 years and had infrequent contact after that and another male that for all intents and purposes did not want a son in the first place, I’d have to say no. I think my mom would have done fine without either of them. Thanks mom.
My child does not have the option of having a father. He has a Grandfather who he does not live with, but who is a real “bloke”.
Who can say if my child was harmed by not having a father. The same way no one can tell if a child is harmed by not having a mother, or eating too much sugar, excessive tennis-ball-against-the-wall-throwing, too much bad TV, seeing a parent naked, reading lots, over dosing on fruit…whatever. In other words it is fairly tricky to prove.
A child is part nature, part nurture. We work with what we have. If there is no father then we go on reguardless. A child is not destined to be bad because they lack a father.
Children raised in father-absent homes will much more likely experience poverty than children in two-parent families.
Can’t provide a list. I don’t think there really is a list, certainly not of attributes, but I also don’t think the “strong male presence” needs to be in the home.I’ll give an example. My sister has been divorced since my nephew was very young. My nephew’s father rarely visited or called and generally does not take much of an interest in his life. My nephew has three uncles , all of whom are way more involved with their own kids , and even with my nephew. I suspect my nephew has a different idea of appropriate male behavior than he would have had if his uncles has also disappeared from their children’s lives.
(Okay, I’ll bite…) Cite?!
I grew up without a father and suffered no ill effects. I have a wonderful, very close relationship with my mum, and don’t feel I missed out anything. Having said that, I also had my grandad and my uncle to fulfill any need I may have had for a strong male rolemodel.
Well, the answer’s either yes or no; and if it’s no, maybe they need to see males and females being good persons in the same ways to know the answer’s no.
Actually, the purpose of a role model is to, well, model a role. Do males and females have different roles in our society? (to what extent? and should they? This may be a question for GD.)
My nephews are definitely better off without their father than with. He asked for the divorce and he wanted to control how the stuff got divided, and when he didn’t get his way, he refused to pay child support. My sister worked three jobs for ten years, and he spent all his money on the kids of whatever bimbo he was boffing at the time—but not on his kids. When they were still married, one of my nephews wanted to get a doll to take to be with him to hug because he was afraid of the dark, and my BIL wouldn’t allow it, because he didn’t want his kid to be a ‘faggot.’ Post-divorce, my sister got the kid the doll—a raggedy-andy type pillow—and his fear of the dark disappeared. They’re both nice normal well-adjusted young men, very fond of my sister’s husband, but they hate their dad, and it’s nobody’s fault but their own.
I wonder if anybody’s done studies about what happens to kids who don’t have a mother? It just seems that it’s all about fatherless kids.
Yes. Some times he’s wanted to wear weird stuff and I say, fine, jsut understand there are some mean kids who like to make fun.
Pay it no mind, they are stupid, just expect it sometimes.
He may turn out to be punk!
Here’s a cite for audilover, supporting Walloon. This appears to be a class syllabus, which includes cited studies and actual numbers for poverty rates.
quote:
Originally posted by Walloon
Children raised in father-absent homes will much more likely experience poverty than children in two-parent families.
This is hardly a brain teaser. I’m surprised you’re even asking for a cite for this common sense economic fact. But here goes >
Financial Stats of Single Parents
There is a large economic lifestyle distinction between “married and divorced” and “never married” single mothers, however, as illustrated here >
It’s not that men and women are good in different ways, matt, more that, as Thudlow pointed out, kids need to see men and women being good in the same ways. If all the important men in my life growing up had been upstanding good guys and all the women had been heartless scumbags, I would have a really skewed idea of what women are like.
This is such a bs statement. Children raised in father-absent homes in poverty will much more likely experience poverty. Children raised in father-absent homes with a parent who does a good job of bringing home the bacon have a good chance of not experiencing poverty.
Its not the freakin’ end of the world when a parent leaves. My mother left me when I was four, and it was a damn good thing she did. My son’s father left when he was two, and again, its a good thing that he did.
Bad things happen to families all the time, and you have to work through it. Some families have alcoholic fathers, other families have work-centric parents who have no time for their kids. These are all crappy situations, but they never get demonized the way the single-parent family does. Yeah, it sucks, but shit happens and you’ve got to do the best you can. All is not lost. My son and I have a great family…I refuse to call it “broken”, because its not. It just doesn’t fit into someone’s ideal.