Lately here in the UK is the ‘bedroom tax’, whereby those in receipt of certain benefits get those benefits reduced if they are living in a house with more bedrooms than necessary. This is an excellent idea in principle, and I was all for it. But it fails in reality because there is not enough public housing to house everyone that needs to move, and because it fails to deal with edge cases, like those who need an extra room for medical equipment, or partners who cannot sleep together. Once these were politely pointed out, I became against it.
Many times on this board and off. I shifted my entire opinion about the Iraqi invasion, for instance, and changed my mind on global warming/climate change after reading through debates on the subject. I’ve also changed my mind on numerous other issues, becoming more ‘liberal’ in my overall outlook (at least that’s what my dad tells me :p…probably make a bunch of posters here fall over from shock).
I haven’t see that this is an especial American trait…do you have a cite? What I have heard is that humans have a tendency to agree with things that conform to their overall world view and, I guess focus more on them (reinforcing their own preconceptions) while ignore or not focus on things that disagree with those preconceptions and world view. It seems to be basic human nature, and everyone (even non-Americans) do it. It takes a more trained and disciplined mind to be able to really dig into and focus on something that contradicts your world view or preconceptions on a given subject and be able to weigh the different options impartially to reach a conclusion that differs from what you thought/think is the correct one.
I changed my mind on interpretation of the Second Amendment. Not on gun control: I still think personal ownership of firearms is a bad idea, but I now agree that the 2A protects that right.
I was in favor of the death penalty as a kid, but once I grew up a bit I realized it was bad policy. I am agnostic on it from a moral perspective.
I am taking half credit for the latter. 
Maybe it’s just my observation but I get the sense you have mellowed on a number of other issues since joining the board.
On that note, I went from being totally intolerant of country music, to enjoying alternative country & cowpunk, to enjoying many forms of country.
I forgot that one: while I still think the death penalty is morally just, the current application of it is so flawed that I oppose its actual practice, for the most part. It may be salvagable, though.
[QUOTE=Really Not All That Bright]
I am taking half credit for the latter.
Maybe it’s just my observation but I get the sense you have mellowed on a number of other issues since joining the board.
[/QUOTE]
Yes, that’s fair to say. I’m still a libertarian, but more moderate than before, and probably more mindful of compromise and conciliation. I’d say this is because I was always a libertarian on practical, not just moral, grounds (possibly a side effect of lifelong atheism): I’m interested in what works the best, and in many cases, that’s the free market and individual liberty. Not always, though, and I’m open to being persuaded that a given act of government will do more good than harm.
Another one: while it has its strong points (preventing any one person from seizing control of the government, and selecting for moderate coalition parties), I no longer hold the American system of government to be the best one available, and would support a switch to proportional representation, and possibly a Westminster system.
Have you ever changed your mind?
Yes, often.
What did it take?
Generally, new evidence. Or re-analysis of pertinent information.
The epiphany which made me more open to revising my opinions came during my medical education when I viscerally realized that the strength of my feelings about a particular topic/situation did not necessarily correlate with the reality of the topic/situation.
To be specific, a kid with a serous illness whom I just knew was going to recover, didn’t.
Biggest things:
I was a Christian as a teenager. Then when I was 15 or so, I could no longer ignore the fact that my belief system was exclusively the result of where I had been born and had no other rationale. Out the window that went.
Five years ago, I was a fairly conventional Keynesian. The experience of the Great Recession, and the arguments from people smarter than me who had considered the issue more deeply, have turned me into a firm monetarist. While it’s true that aggregate demand was insufficient, the proper response should’ve been clearer expectations of more money. From the outside that might seem like a small technical shift, but a lot of pieces had to move to make that transition. There was a lot of evidence in favor of the previous conclusion, and each and every argument and piece of data had to be re-evaluated from a new perspective.
What did it take? A long-term process of re-visiting all my previous arguments and assumptions. It’s like going through a Japanese rock garden with someone who advises that you turn over one of the stones. He makes a good argument for it, so okay, you turn it over. Then he points out another stone that would look better flipped over. You reluctantly agree again. Then again. And again. After enough time, you’ve altered stones in every part of the garden. Finally, he suggests re-raking using a different pattern, and hell, his advice has been good so far, so you do it. And when you look at the whole thing again, the entire aesthetic has been subtly changed. You can’t go back to the old design, because this one is clearly better.
It’s a slow process, and you proceed one stone at a time.
“Well, now, I wouldn’t say that” - Warner Brothers cartoon
One of the items that told me to support the ACA was that, as even conservative critics pointed out, the ACA does allow for states to apply single payer as Vermont is showing. I still think the ACA is a start and a framework to progress that will be there because I do expect the insurance companies to continue to shoot themselves in the foot as the episode of cancelling budget plans as usual instead of making an exception and upgrade showed.
I changed my mind about gays in the military. When I was active duty in the eighties and nineties, I was against it. Not because I didn’t think they could serve honorably and such, it was more a housing issue.
They wouldn’t place me in a barracks room with a female, I reasoned, why a gay person?
Many late night discussions with folks who were out (as out as you could be in the military at that time) to some of the most virulently homophobic people I have ever met, over various form of alcohol on three different continents reshaped the way I think about gay folks and sexuality in general.
I used to be a moderate Republican type. I was even head of my university’s College Republicans for a few years. I was never a far right wing sort - heck, I’m from New Jersey.
However, a few years back I experienced an epiphany which led me into Christianity (I was an atheist prior to that - a moderate right-wing atheist, like George Will). And since my conversion and study of Scripture & Tradition I’ve gone well to the left. I joke that “Jesus made me a commie” at times. I am definitely not that far left, but I wholeheartedly support a much more expanded welfare state that I have ever had before.
In addition my Christian faith led me to support gay marriage, whereas before I was more of a civil union guy.
I used to think when jesus busted a fart it smelled like roses
now i’m convinced that it was so toxic
he’d kill anyone within a 3 mile radius
More often than I care to admit.
When I am presented with new evidence, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?
I’ve accepted the science of climate change, although I still have a hard time believing in the tipping point, doomsday predictions of David Suzuki, Al Gore and their ilk.
I’m less likely to change my mind than I am to wait to form an opinion. It’s one of the things that frustrates me on many issues of the day - things like Zimmerman or Ukraine or whatever. It’s like every person must have an iron-clad and unchanging opinion within the first thirty minutes or else. Me, I’d rather learn more about the issue and think it over. I’m very comfortable answering questions with “Recent research indicates x” even while refusing to say that I personally have a belief or an opinion about x. Usually people like me don’t even get a good poll option that can be represented in statistics.
Anyway, I have had some fairly major reversals of opinion in my life.
Yeah… Obamacare only changed my mind to the extent that I now think a single-payer is the only reasonable option.
Part of me is still willing to entertain the opposite extreme: an even less regulated market being allowed to muddle its own way through the issue without government interference (and by interference, I include counterproductive tax loopholes for employers). But anything in the middle? Clearly not an option in my mind anymore.
What does it take? Good arguments, based on facts if it’s a factual matter.
How it happens isn’t so pretty, though. When someone poses an argument that really hits home, I’m told my face isn’t particularly appealing or convivial. People think I’m mad at them for what they said, but what’s really happening is I’m internally reacting to a big shift in mental framework, because it’s a rare issue that’s independent of others.
I’ve changed my mind about a number of smaller issues recently, thanks to being de-ignorance here on SMDB, but none that involved any sea-changes in my outlook.
About a decade ago, some younger, more liberal friends challenged me about why I was against legalizing SSM. I said I’d have to think about it and get back to them, but in the process of thinking it out, I realized my reasons weren’t valid. (My main reason involved adoption, and not only did I have facts wrong, I wasn’t even being consistent.)
The biggest change was as an adolescent, I realized I no longer believed in God, despite being very devout when younger. I really wanted to believe in God, so I tried very earnestly over several years to regain my faith, but failed. The failure was a big disappointment. It was a big adjustment, and took as much as a decade to resort things like morality, philosophy, the meaning of life, etc.
I got a big shock about a decade ago when I was researching creationism. I was researching it to figure out why apparently intelligent and well-educated people could hold the position. I believe that on any serious question, if you can’t see the other side’s point of view, you’re missing something, and I couldn’t see it. But, one of the arguments really shook me: the probability one concerning origins. At first I didn’t see the flaw, and was really flummoxed by the odds. (At that time I also didn’t realize that it is possible that the universe is infinite.) I know enough math to understand the implication of the odds (assuming they were calculated correctly) and that really gave me a jolt! It was visceral, emotional, and rocked my world, because it wasn’t just a bit of evidence that would cause me to change a tentative scientific position. It would cause me to revisit my whole philosophical framework of life – similar to the reverse of the process I’d taken decades earlier.
To my relief, after a little investigation, the flaw was apparent. But it was an interesting experience. The amount of relief I felt was a clue that I should be suspicious of the argument providing said relief! It also made evident that while my reasoned position is agnostic (basically, I assume that I’m unlikely to know the truth in a matter like this), I clearly have some kind of commitment to the proposition that there is no deity.
But, I’ve been dead wrong about stuff before, and I won’t be too surprised to find I’m dead wrong about stuff in the future. I’m more certain of THAT than just about anything.
Here’s a blunt way to put it. I’m confident that I have deeply held beliefs that are just plain wrong. Anyone who isn’t, probably isn’t thinking clearly.
Got a link to that, or suggestions on keywords to search? I’d love to see that.
No kidding. We should all make a mental note!
I like that you aren’t following the flock.
The way so many people jump to conclusions would drive me nuts, but I know how to take a mental chill pill.
Plus I’m already nuts.
I was raised in a politically and religiously conservative bubble. And I believed pretty much everything that goes along with that. Frankly, all it really took for me to start changing my mind was exposure to other ideals. Someone I became friends with in my junior or senior year of high school was a libertarian, my first real exposure to a view not on the standard left/right line, and I started exploring different political views. A few years later, one of my oldest and closest friends and I had a very serious religious discussion; she was raised in a very different view of Christianity and she started asking me questions about why I believed it. I didn’t have an answer, I believed it because it was what I was taught and it didn’t even occur to me to question it. From there, I took it as a quest to tear down everything I believed to the most basic levels that I could and try to rebuild them, but always being able to answer why.
I think for most people, being asked a question they don’t know the answer to is scary. I think this is why a lot of people stick dogmatically to a lot of core beliefs like politics and religion, because they never really get down all the way to the most basic aspect, and I can understand that its a terrifying prospect to dissect aspects that, for most people, form a core essential element of how they define themselves. But I think for some people, it’s a fascinating endeavor. I had the opportunity to really rediscover and reinvent myself and, in the process, learn at least as much about others as well.
So, I guess, the major turning point would be that coversation with my friend, that it sort of opened the flood gates. Since then, I’ve made a lot of changes in my opinion, but none of them seemed anything but unnatural. It was sort of a point where I look back and realize that a few years ago I thought something else. So, in that sense, that’s really the only one where I really thought about it and made the choice to change my mind. That said, I guess it kind of comes off as a relatively small thing, just a conversation, but it was really a lot more than that. There was a specific moment that I remember after talking for several hours and ultimately changing my mind, but it was was really much more a months long, intense and intimate conversation.
I’ve changed my mind quite often. What did it take? A combination of information AND a willingness to change. As I get older, I find that I’m less wedded to ideas, but I need evidence. Things can’t just look and/or sound good. They need to have a basis in evidence.
Becoming an atheist (or recognizing that I already was one) freed me from having to force my world to conform to my beliefs. Now my beliefs conform to my world.
I was for the death penalty, but changed my mind when I started seeing how flawed our justice system is, especially in the cases of death row prisoners being freed from DNA evidence.
Like others in the thread, I do not find it immoral. But it seems too likely to kill innocent people.
I personally would have preferred a German-style health-care system
Same here.