I soooooo wanted to put this in the Pit, but maybe it’s a little “meh” for the pit.
We are having quite the rainy spring here in the Southeast US (sorry my southwestern US friends, apparently we get it all this year). I have noticed, more than I have ever noticed before, that many people driving in the rain have decided that it would be a great idea to turn on their emergency flashers. Just cruising down the interstate with their 4-way hazard flashers blinking happily away.
I get what you are going for. “I’m going to make myself more visible so I’ll be safer”. Problem is, it’s not just you out here on the road, it’s all of us, and you’re confusing me.
But maybe I’m wrong. I will admit it does bug me, but I’m willing to listen to reason. Anyone here a rain-flasher? Why?
I’ve seen people do it on interstates in the South. I would guess that it’s to (1) improve visibility and to (2) indicate they’re going slower than normal because of a torrential downpour (for whatever reason, the South tends to get a lot of those). I don’t think it’s necessary or proper during regular rainfall.
I wouldn’t put them on in a normal rainstorm, but if it is coming down so hard that (a) you can’t see more than a few feet in front of you and (2) consequently, you have to slow down to waaay below the speed limit, I do put them on. Fortunately, that kind of downpour is rare in our parts.
If there’s so much rain that I have to slow down considerably, I’ll turn 'em on so someone else cruising along at highway speeds coming up into the poor visibility is less likely to crash into me. When you first drive into a heavy rainstorm, it takes different drivers different amounts of time to decide they need to slow down, and having the hazards on will hopefully speed that decision. I’ll shut them off once I can resume highway speeds or once I can see there’s a car behind me following at a reasonable speed. I definitely don’t just cruise along with them on just because it’s wet out.
It’s illegal in Florida. Apparently state statute 316.2397 declares that flashing lights are prohibited on vehicles except as a means of indicating a right or left turn, to change lanes, or to indicate that the vehicle is lawfully STOPPED or DISABLED on the highway.
If conditions are so bad that you are putting on your flashers and creeping along, please get the hell off the road and park. Flashers tell me that you are stopped. So when I see you ahead, I prepare to stop behind you. But no, you speed up, slow down, and keep creeping along. So I creep up behind you, and other cars must creep up behind me. We’re all confused. How am I to know if or when you actually plan to stop? Do you see some obstruction ahead, or are you just being uber-cautious? Nobody knows but you. So you are being selfish and endangering everyone else around you. Turn off your flashers and drive like a normal driver, slowing down as necessary under existing conditions (also a requirement of Florida law). Or actually stop your vehicle, preferably in the safety lane or on the shoulder, and THEN turn on the damned flashers.
I think it may be technically illegal to use them that way in some states but I have still done it when I was caught in a sudden, torrential downpour where there is really no place to stop. I am talking about the kind when your windshield wipers don’t have a high enough setting and you can’t read road signs let alone tell where the lanes are. Blizzard conditions in the Northeast can sometimes justify the same thing.
I have never found it distracting to see people using them that way unless you mean that it causes you to pay extra attention that they are there. That is the whole point. I would rather someone get annoyed than have an SUV or 18 Wheeler slam into me because they couldn’t see more than 20 feet ahead without the extra warning lights.
Shagnasty, is there some kind of illegal other than “technically illegal”? Because as far as I know, illegal is illegal. Technically speaking.
And this action is illegal because it creates a hazard for motorists by confusing them about the status of traffic ahead. It isn’t an annoyance, it’s a danger. If conditions are really so bad that one cannot see what is ahead of one, then the proper response is to STOP. That would be a “vehicle that is lawfully stopped” and entitled to put on hazard flashers.
And the point is that drivers behind CAN see. If we see tail lights (“lights on in the rain”) we know traffic is moving. If we see brake lights, we know that traffic is (surprise!) stopping. And if we see hazard flashers, we are supposed to be able to conclude that traffic has stopped. That’s the point – to communicate the different statuses of traffic ahead. Defeating the system makes things more dangerous for everybody.
One person driving unexpectedly slow, with flashers on: Yes, thanks, it’s good for you to stand out.
A bunch of people driving slow because of the rain storm that we’re all in and already know about, and some of them running their flashers: You’re just adding confusion to the mix, which is the opposite of helping.
Just turn your regular lights on. We don’t need the flashers to get our attention because we are already looking for you!
What bit are you referring to? Talking about the flashers? The only time I hear Capt Herbs voice is when he does the annoying plumbers commercials, so I’m not sure what bit he did.
He did a rant about flashers in heavy rain yesterday. I thought that might have inspired this thread. Glad you know who he is and I not completely out in left field.
Yes, there is a big and practical difference. The difference between ‘technically illegal’ and practically illegal is how much trouble you will be in for violating the law. In this case, the police would not even write you ticket for it even assuming you got stopped if you gave a good reason (in this case, based on a weather emergency assuming there is a real one). Even if you did, you would still have an excellent chance at having a judge dismiss it instantly.
This is off-topic but not all ‘illegal’ actions are equivalent and I have no idea why you would think otherwise unless you are being pointlessly confrontational. There are plenty of so-called illegal acts which are routinely ignored and also laws which would be wise to ignore. You already know that though so I am not sure why you are splitting hairs.
I use flashers any time I’m not able to maintain speed on a road, whether it be due to rain, snow, an overloaded car trying to climb a huge hill, car problem, or whatever. It’s a warning to vehicles traveling at normal speed that they’ll rear end me if they don’t slow down or move around me. If I can maintain speed, then the conditions don’t matter and I don’t use flashers.
I’m not aware of any local law around here that says you can only use flashers if stopped.
Just because it is illegal in one state doesn’t make it illegal everywhere. I found this bill from New York.
I can’t tell from that whether it passed or not, but clearly the intent is to require what every sensible person does anyway. It’s not a danger, but the opposite.
Guys, I quoted Florida law and identified it as such. Of course I accept that other jurisdictions have different laws. And I recognize that not all laws are vigorously enforced. But “technically illegal” is still illegal (in the identified jurisdiction) and all the hand waving in the world doesn’t change that.
I offered the rationale behind the Florida law, and said that I supported it. If I did so too earnestly for this forum, I offer my apology. I still think flashers on moving vehicles is a bad idea. YMMV.
Apology accepted. However, we may be talking about two separate things here. One is simple raindrops causing blue-haired Florida drivers to turn on their hazard lights unnecessarily as soon as they start falling. Fark.com has a special Florida category for such things and they are the only state with a designated tag. I can see how that would be annoyance.
However, some of us (especially me) are referring to conditions where you cannot stop safely and need to let other potential vehicles on the road know you are there. Those conditions could range from a Northeastern blizzard to a Southeastern torrential thunderstorm.
I have been in trapped in all of those and the legality doesn’t matter at that point. I am a perpetual pilot in training and the same rules apply to the road as they do in the air. When faced with a weather emergency, you do whatever you need to in order to get you and your passengers to a safe place and that could well include turning on all of your available lighting so that you do not get hit by someone else undergoing the same distress.
I think it’s just our surprise that something we find normal and think should be mandatory is considered illegal and a danger by others.
Pure opinion here: the differences in driving norms and regulations across states is a nightmare and undoubtedly causes accidents, if not deaths. I don’t know how we could federalized them into one common law at this point, but not doing so is just one of many, many idiocies of our state system. Too many people spend too much time crossing state lines for the old rules to sit untouched.
I agree but what you are proposing isn’t really possible. Who is going to write a federal law that governs the use of 15 year olds driving tractors in rural Iowa and Manhattan? That simply isn’t going to work without a ton of subparts that equal the same thing we have now.
I do agree that hazard lights are at the driver’s discretion however for whatever reason they deem fit. It could be because they are towing an unstable trailer or have a front end issue. It doesn’t really matter. The point is for other drivers to become more aware of it and stay as far away as possible and that is a good thing in my mind. Of course, it can be abused but I have hardly ever seen people use them in a way that wasn’t justified. People doing really stupid stuff like drunk driving would not ever use them because it is like painting a neon sign on your vehicle.
To the OP, what do you expect people to do in this situation: You are on an interstate highway five miles from the nearest exit. Your vehicle suddenly pulls to the right because of a front-end issue. The speed limit is 45 mph minimum but you cannot do that safely. You can do 30 mph and almost certainly make it to the next exit where there is a car repair station. What do you do next?
In either of those scenarios, they need to (a) use their flashers, AND (b) get off the damn road.
Clearly use your freaking blinkers, move to the right
So what? No one is saying you can’t EVAH use your hazard flashers. I’m challenging the use of them in a normal common occurrence driving event. RAIN. Not biblical flooding, not Hurricane Donna, just normal wet stuff falling out of the sky.
The driving episode that led me to post this was along approximately 15 miles of I-85. In that 15 mile stretch, I had my wipers set to “low” most the time, with sometimes use of the intermittent. Never felt the need to go to high speed on the wipers. So I think it’s fair to say this was just “rain”, not "heavy rain, not a “downpour”, and certainly not anything that cut visibility to near zero.
And yet, I counted 11 vehicles with flashers going. Some were going about the same speed I was, maybe 3-5 were going slower, and a few PASSED ME.
We have had days of rain, so the roads are clean of oil, visibility was good, I could clearly see taillights from over a hundred yards away. The use of flashers was completely unnecessary, they added no safety to the users, and they were a distraction to others.
You do realize some older vehicles use the same rear bulbs for the tail lights and the flashers, right? That makes it hard to differentiate between them using their flasher or applying their brake.
A properly maintained car traveling at a normal rate of speed in a normal weather event does not need to use flashers. By the way, it’s not just Florida who says this is not legal. http://drivinglaws.aaa.com/laws/hazard-light-use/